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Support from wife/kids/loved ones in your trading
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Support from wife/kids/loved ones in your trading

  #41 (permalink)
Site Administrator
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Jura View Post
I'm wondering though, how do you guys get support if you have no wife/girlfriend or kids? Or no friends who understand trading? Any tips?

You can find plenty of like-minded traders here on futures.io (formerly BMT). When you read posts by a certain user that you agree with or feel compelling, then just send a Friend request to that user, exchange Skype info, etc, and you've now got an extra buddy who understands trading.

Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

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  #42 (permalink)
Elite Member
Washington DC
 
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Thanks Big Mike for another great thread. I'm glad that so many traders have a good family support structure when it comes to their trading.

I have a very guarded approach when it comes to the family and their support of the trading business. For me, I'd rather NOT get into specifics when talking to my wife about trading.
Background: I'm fairly new to trading. I've lost money in stocks and options, but currency futures have shown promise since I implemented a trading plan last January. I have a day job that pays the bills, but I want to develop a backup plan-- I'm highly motivated to learn trading to serve as this backup plan. I consider myself an optimist, but some more "realistic" people may call me a dreamer.
What I'm about to say is only my current opinion, with slight hyperbole, based on my level of experience, my situation, and my location along a flight path that might be long and arduous with several to-be-determined course corrections down the line.


Try not to let your wife/family know about your trading business.

Trading equates to gambling, according to a high percentage of the population. Gambling evokes visions of ruin, of having to short-sell the house, sell the furniture, and live in a car because the mortgage payments can't be made.

When starting your trading career, only you and your most trusted associates can be aware of your actions. Consider trading to be Top Secret - Sensitive Compartmented Information. Don't be cavalier about talking about it, for information leaks can lead to grave damage to your mission of attaining a trading education. Learning how to trade is difficult enough, and people's negativity will severely impact the acquisition of your skills and erode your confidence.

I've let my wife know about my journey as a trader. She is my wife, and I believe in having a high level of trust in a marriage. I consider my wife having a Top Secret clearance, but the details about trading are on a need-to-know. She understands the sensitivity of the topic, and my reasons for keeping it under wraps. My kids are too young to learn about trading, and only one child so far exhibits the personality traits for the business. But the extended family will not be told until this information becomes declassified, which is years away at best.

People's negativity is a killer. As my trading success is unproven, I cannot afford to have people tell me that "it's not possible to make money trading", or "the system is rigged", or "only Goldman Sachs can do it." I'm fine with people saying that only a small percentage of would-be traders succeed or that the path is difficult and requires a vast amount of self-study. But I've seen some of my extended family kill people's dreams or even their own dreams because of their negativity.

I consider futures.io (formerly BMT) forum a place where others have the security clearances to know about my trading actions. The support I've seen is amazing-- tales of failure have been met with encouragement from others, and overconfidence has been reigned in by constructive comments.

Thanks to all you members for being my support system.

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  #43 (permalink)
Elite Member
Las Vegas, USA
 
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The easiest way to get approval from others is simple:

LET GO OF WANTING TO SEEK APPROVAL FROM OTHERS!!!!

You already have their approval and support. You don't have to make it a bigger deal than it is.

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  #44 (permalink)
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@dc618, why not share all the intimate details with your wife? Withholding details is akin to withholding truth, aka lying.... it won't do you any favors in the stress/psychological department. If you are concerned she will not be understanding, it is probably because you are losing more money than she thinks is acceptable... and maybe she has a point...

I can't really give marital advice, as I am divorced. But I can talk about a hypothetical marriage, and that is one where you openly share, and you use her as a "rock" to anchor you, lean on, support you, etc. She does the same. Even if you disagree with her (for example, if she feels you are risking too much) then you should find compromise, as she may have a point you are missing yourself.

I find that most of the stress in the relationship over trading comes from two points. 1) Money, 2) Time. The money one is pretty easy to reduce actually, just by moving out of costly futures trading and into less costly forex trading with a mini or micro lot account at a reputable broker like MB Trading. The time issue is more troublesome, as it takes years to master trading - so you might try involving your wife in your trading by getting her interested enough to take her own trades, so it feels like you are doing something together instead of apart.

Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

Reply With Quote
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  #45 (permalink)
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Big Mike View Post
@dc618, why not share all the intimate details with your wife? Withholding details is akin to withholding truth, aka lying....

I have to disagree on that... one can be truthful and not have to disclose every single detail of what one is doing. That is like saying that if my wife asks me what I am doing when I get up at 4AM and I say I trade, but dont bother to include the details of what I trade or if I made $$$ or lost that day or if anything else.. by your definition, I would be lying to her since I am not sharing the details.

I just have to disagree with withholding details is akin to lying...

a lie is a lie... and truth is truth... details on truth dont make the truth any different or change it in any way.


Big Mike View Post
I can't really give marital advice, as I am divorced. But I can talk about a hypothetical marriage, and that is one where you openly share, and you use her as a "rock" to anchor you, lean on, support you, etc. She does the same. Even if you disagree with her (for example, if she feels you are risking too much) then you should find compromise, as she may have a point you are missing yourself.

let me know when you find that marriage... reality, unfortunately is much different..


Big Mike View Post
I find that most of the stress in the relationship over trading comes from two points. 1) Money, 2) Time.

I will expand your argument and say the stress in any relationship has to do with those two things you mention.

the way I do it is simple... I dont recommend it for everyone.. I have been married for 10 years, it works for me..

my wife knows I work and what I do for a living, and that I trade as a hobby to fund our retirement and nothing else. She has no idea how much money I make on either ventures. She gets an allowance for her, outside of the houes and kids, even though she works on the side doing her own thing. I cover all family costs. I dont trade with money that I cant afford to lose, so what I do with those funds is my business as long as I dont put the family at risk, and that would never be the case. My family present and futures are well protected, and she knows how to access that protection in the event that something happens to me.

the only thing that stresses my wife is time... not much I can do about that variable but to try and maximize the quality of time spent with the family.

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  #46 (permalink)
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sysot1t View Post
I have to disagree on that... one can be truthful and not have to disclose every single detail of what one is doing. That is like saying that if my wife asks me what I am doing when I get up at 4AM and I say I trade, but dont bother to include the details of what I trade or if I made $$$ or lost that day or if anything else.. by your definition, I would be lying to her since I am not sharing the details.

If your wife asks how your trading went, and you conveniently leave out the fact that you lost 10% of your trading account today and simply answer with "it was fine" - you have left out the details, but in my opinion, you've also lied.

It's my view that you need your wife to fully support you, and not have to withhold info from her to gain that support or steer that support in your favor, as doing so only adds stress.

Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

Reply With Quote
 
  #47 (permalink)
Membership Permanently Revoked
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
 
Posts: 1,176 since Nov 2009
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Big Mike View Post
If your wife asks how your trading went, and you conveniently leave out the fact that you lost 10% of your trading account today and simply answer with "it was fine" - you have left out the details, but in my opinion, you've also lied.

I will agree that saying "it was fine", when in fact it wasnt, is lying. However, that was not your original post..


Big Mike View Post
Withholding details is akin to withholding truth, aka lying....

lets say that day I lost 10% because I revenge traded... if my wife asks me how it was today, I would say "it sucked"... no details provided as they are not needed... as per your definition, I would be lying... so I still disagree with that original post.


Big Mike View Post
It's my view that you need your wife to fully support you, and not have to withhold info from her to gain that support or steer that support in your favor, as doing so only adds stress.

Mike

I guess that I am pscyhologically made up differently from most given that I dont need my wife's support to trade... after all, this is a hobby.. is not like i am risking the cost of living money.

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  #48 (permalink)
Site Administrator
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sysot1t View Post
I guess that I am pscyhologically made up differently from most given that I dont need my wife's support to trade...

From my experience with helping other traders, support is very critical from a spouse. If you lack your spouse's support, then it really places you in a difficult position to be a successful trader.


Quoting 
after all, this is a hobby.. is not like i am risking the cost of living money.

I didn't realize you weren't a full time trader.

Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

Reply With Quote
 
  #49 (permalink)
Elite Member
australia
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Favorite Futures: -
 
Posts: 300 since Sep 2010
Thanks: 123 given, 137 received


liquidcci View Post
I would suggest not starting out with aim to make a living. Start out to make extra income. If at some point you are making so much extra income that you can step out of your job and focus on trading then do it. Plus the added pressure of having to depend on trading to pay the bills can be crushing and cause you to make many mistakes.

The reality is most will fail in trading. If you have others who are depending on you to bring home a paycheck they will suffer if it does not work and odds say it won't work. It is not worth the stress it can cause in relationships. Most likely if you fail in trading you have eaten up your savings and are possibly in debt. It can be a double kill on your finances that can set you back years financially and ruin your relationships.

I really think the ultimate is if you can get some other type of business going that allows you to keep an eye on markets. Then instead of taking money out of your trading account every month you just let it build and scale.


I think this is great advice. I am not sure if I would ever want to have trading only as my sole source of income. The markets changes and I am not sure if I would be able to make a living from trading for the next 10 years and beyond even if I am doing well now.

In trading everyday you starts from zero, yesterday's success means nothing today. You start all over again day after day, year after year.

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  #50 (permalink)
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Big Mike View Post
From my experience with helping other traders, support is very critical from a spouse. If you lack your spouse's support, then it really places you in a difficult position to be a successful trader.


I guess we are all different; my wife would crack under the pressure if she ever saw how much I am willing to lose in a single day; she is too emotional while I am more logical, I can justify the VaR while she would just think how that is the monthly mortgage on her parents condo. Less stress for me not to share details, less stress for her not to know details.



Big Mike View Post
I didn't realize you weren't a full time trader.

Mike


and no, I dont trade full time, and by full time I mean for a living ... I dont think I would ever trade for a living... I need a job to actually keep me intellectually challenged.

Trading for me, is only a 2-3 hour a day affair of actual trading, and about 2 hours of research and prep; sometimes less, comes down to what markets interest me that day or if I am looking to do some options for income.

Trading to me is really no different than gambling in a casino; if I sit there all day long, I will give back the winnings because I will over trade out of boredom. Trading is really, really, really boring; but that doesnt mean one should trade for excitement, it should be boring IMO.

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