I think I am a lucky few where my wife actually a non-negative support. What i mean by that is she does not supports it, but will not put pressure on me if I do trade. My two kids are too young to understand it. They are two and one, but will get them involve when they are around five or six years old.
However, my friends do not look at it this way. I was actually talking about this business to a close friend yesterday, a tax professional, about it. Even after I explain to her that trading is a business just like other, losing is a business expense. But throughout our conversation, she has referred trading as gambling and comment if gambling can make you rich, then everyone will be a billionaire.
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Great post. This will also help me understand how trading is going to fit into my life. My wife is pregnant with our 3rd child. She doesn't really care much for my trading business as long as she thinks its going to make $$. I've tried to explain to her that I need my space and my time in order for it to succeed and that it will take time.
I think its absolutely critical to be up front and honest. I've blown an account or two in the past and simply told my wife. I'm relatively young so blowing through my savings wasn't too dramatic 5 years ago. However if I'm not careful and blow my current savings at 30, well it might be a bit scarier.
Anyways, what I'm trying to do are a few of these things concurrently:
1. Learn as MUCH as possible in terms of money mgmt, psychology...
2. Learn as MUCH as possible in terms of indicators and how markets move
3. Setup trading environment (NT7, servers, databases, development env, etc)
4. Building funds. Learn, THEN trade SIM, THEN put cash in.
I've convinced my wife (for now) that I need a separate space and will need some resources and will need to spend alone-time learning. The next thing is to convince her that putting money into the market (if strategies prove worthy) will be worthwhile and profitable.
Again, thanks BM for the post. Any more that will help me understand how to get my trading business underway will be appreciated!
thanks!
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Great topic Mike . Im married and my wife and I have 3 kids up to 16 in the house and I started the 1st steps in trading when my wife and I got married . Were both divorced previously and have kids with us now from our 1st marriages and I feel we both are a little more tolerant with each other as far as careers go because we know what negative criticism leads to - heartaches . I support her endevours and she supports mine and if we dont agree 100% with what the other is doing we talk it out and build up not down . The kids are not as easy because - theyre kids ! But as they grow more they are more interested in money and what is involved in making and more importantly keeping and growing money . They can explain to you what taxes , interest , assets , liabilities and mortgages are since they were little . They dont teach that at school so its our job to do that for them .
As far as what people think about trading - I think most people dont undersatand business and money in the first place so it doesnt bother me when they express an opinion . Many of my friends punch a clock and make the employer wealthy and let the boss focus on business while they collect the paycheck on friday and couldnt care less how that money came to be . They still think trading is gambling and irresponsible but those same people buy scratchoff tickets and play the lottery religiously . They talk about how theyll spend the millions theyre going to win someday .
All that matters is that Im a responsible parent and husband and what I do is my business . My family and I work like a team and have empathy for one another and give each other the benefit of the doubt .
If you have read my price reading thread you know that this is a part time endeavor for me since I have a full (more than most of the time) job. I am very good at what I do but only became good with experience, hard work, studying, discipline, and watching/learning from others. I am lucky also that I am paid well and have a stable career. With that said, there is also a lot of stress with the delivery of projects that I manage. So I started looking for a way to start a business without needed to quit my current job. Trading seemed like a good fit since I need to manage my savings and this is something I can do for a lifetime.
My wife is very supportive in everything that I do. Although she may not always agree with me she has always supported me. We have lot of respect for each other and we are best friends. Since I started researching and studying trading we have had a lot of conversations about the length of time it would take me to develop the necessary skills, not only because this is part time but because nothing is ever done well without a lot of hard work. If it were easy then everyone could do this. And if everyone could do this then who would we take our profits from? So we both understand that I am competing with full time traders and professionals with substantial backing.
The neat thing about this journey is that my wife has seen the potential and has indicated that she wants to trade also. I will start a different thread on this because I will need some help getting her started.
I believe she will be more disciplined than me and ultimately a better trader. However, I don't mind researching and trying new things (probably a hinderance) whereas she wants a proven set of rules provided that she can learn and execute. She won't mind studying and won't mind working hard but she does not want to start from scratch. I'm not a good enough trader nor do I have a stable trading plan for myself to teach her. So I'll start another thread for advice from everyone.
As always, you are appreciated Mike.
Andrew
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I think though you also need to keep things in perspective. Most people that suceed in business are leveraging a skill they already have....
I don't know why we have such problems admitting this isn't much different than gambling honestly. Trading is certainly much closer to becoming a professional poker player than it is to opening a restaurant.
For me, the only logical thing I could see to truely give myself a shot was I had to give up on the idea of getting married until I've done what I want to do at this game. I'm in my early 30s and don't even really bother with serious relationships. To me its the trade off of wanting a profession so outside the norm. I just don't have the time to give a relationship right now, its too hard to explain and I wouldn't expect people to understand much anyway.
Once you have found what you are looking for in this game the bankroll size will speak for itself.
If you are married and have kids and haven't found much trading success, I don't know..Maybe you are just in the wrong business. I can't imagine having to deal with a spouse during a drawdown, let alone kids.
The difference between a total degen gambler and single minded obessesion developing your craft in trading is really only the difference between how much money is being made/lost....I'm sure there is not a spouse on the planet that complains about a successful speculators ways of making coin.
The importance of family support and understanding plays an important role in our successful as individuals in any field of industry. However it is the very nature of trading as a business that makes it difficult for non traders to relate, especially our immediate family.
The truth of approaching trading as a business is a realization that dawned on me, later on during this journey. It was this and a change in my world view, which changed my relationship with my wife dramatically. The level of support and interest increased much, much more.
Traders are like the early pioneers, undertaking a journey into the unknown for a better life for our families. After all isn’t that why got into this, a better life!
Like any business, establishing the boundaries between family and work are very important. Furthermore identifying the nature and structure of the business is critical to a reaching this happy balance between personal and professional life.
There are few things that we forget as traders. When most people startup a business, the husband/wife/family can physically see the business. They can come down and visit you at the shop or go out with you on the road. With most businesses or jobs when we clock out, we closes shop and return home to your family. Also depending on what your job involves, sometimes it’s not appropriate to discuss every little detail with your family.
As traders, the venture capital is ones and zeros on the screen. Our office is our home and our tools of the trade are our monitories and PCs. We spend hours, days, weeks, years learning the trade not generating an income. We are on an emotional rollercoaster until we reach the level of psychology need to be in this business. If the business goes belly-up, there are nothing lift to sell.
When we begin to see the world through our partner’s eyes, it tells a different story. The fact they have not packed and left when you have blown the bank on tuition fees, is in itself an immeasurable amount of support and love.
Let me ask you, would you stick around with your business partner if they blew the venture capital you work so hard to build. How would you feel if you stood 8 hrs a day in the joint partnership retail store, trying to make money for the business, while your partner stayed at home staring at the PC drawing a wage and telling you - I’ll makes us money in the future!
What I’m saying is - when we exchange our self with ours, and we look at our self through their eyes our world view changes. We become the ones giving the support; we become the bouncing board of which their concerns are heard. And this in turn gives us all the happiness that there is, whether our trades succeed or fail.
Alex
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It seems to me as if you're on the wrong path, if you're going to construct your trading path based on an outcome where you'll get confirmation from your husband. Things are just going to get worse. Imagine you're going to fail once again. Or what is going to happen if you succeed, and then fail after that again.
You see, a successful trading carrier is build upon these premises. Being successful doesn't mean that you're going to be making 2k out of 10k, and after that compound it. No, it means that out of the 10k you're maybe going to be making 2k and lose 1k, and out of the 11k you make another 3k and you lose 1k.
Being successful means to be consistent and faithful to your system, and to what works for you. It means that you have to lose less then you win. Unfortunately, we're never gone get rid of the roller coaster. But we can learn how to control it, so that when we summon up our fights and struggles, the outcome is more positive then negative.
I think we're all better of if we follow Ronan's example or Gary's. Talk to your husband and tell him, what you've been through, and what you're up to. How and why things happened the way it happened, and that you've decided to proceed and how things are going to look like in the near future.
Ask him to support you, because that is what you really, really want to do, and that this is your highest wish. Not because you want to show him that you can make it out there, but because this is what your heart is telling you do be the right thing for you.
We all struggle to make tomorrow look like yesterday!
Get rid of your past and let the future unfold from the now. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
/George
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Important to have support and coverage, as tensions do reinforce irrational behavior. Best thing is not to trade, if things are not in line. Family support is as important a factor for me as physical fitness and mental preparation!
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Thanks George for your advice , my main concern is that I want to get rid of that psychological barrier , it's really important for my psyche to be able to do that even if it takes months and weeks and days , I know that Rome was not built in one day ... That will be a big step towards a more relaxed state of mind ,
I will be involving him soon , as he was really interested in doing it but got caught in the daily job cycle , which is important in these kinds of situations where one of us has to bring a paycheck to sustain the family .
hopefully things will get better once he starts sim trading , I will be the master then lol
Thanks for all the support , I really appreciate it .
"Risk more than others think safe.
Dream more than others think practical.
Expect more than others think possible.
Care more than others think wise"
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I do not day trade for a living, but I do have a business for end of day trading in equities and options. However, I am becomming more interested in day trading but I have yet to take the plunge and leave my day job. I should say that my job, like a lot of others in this economy, is not very secure so you could say that I am hedging my employment
My wife supports my trading 100% so long as it doesn't turn into a gambling habit and I am bringing home the money. What is having an impact on our relationship (and that of my 2 kids) is my day job. Because of current economic conditions, my company knows it can take advantage of their employees (more work hours and less benefits). It is not unusual for me to work 90 hour weeks including weekends. A recent announcement regarding a change in company policy axed 5 vacation days in the name of "being competitive with current economic conditions". I could go on with other issues, but I don't want to turn this into a rant. At the end of the day, I have very little time for my family and my wife is aware of that.
My wife and I have discussed several times the possibilities of leaving my job to do trading full time. We discussed issues and milestones for making progress to ensure a smooth transition when the time comes. I know she feels more secure in this venture so long as we keep an open dialog going.
Regards,
-C
“Strategy without tactics is the slowest route to victory. Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” - Sun Tzu
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