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Trading Psychology and How The Mind Works (IV)
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Trading Psychology and How The Mind Works (IV)

  #51 (permalink)
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jgomez74 View Post
I know this thread started long time ago, but since I just joined the forum, I also want to comment about this and I hope I can also get some suggestions.

George, this is a great thread, all the info you have written is such valuable. Iīve been also studying this topic during the last year and I totally agree with you.

As you said the standard methods to reprogram the subconcious are based on affirmations and visualizations. They became more popular after the following books were written;

"The Law of Mentalism" written by Victor Segno at the beginning of the 1900 century,
" Think and Grow Rich" written by Napoleon Hill by around 1937
"The Science of Getting Rich" written by Wallace D Wattles around the same time.

After that many other methods have emerged. In another thread I mention many of them like: meditation, hypnosis, listening to binaural or isoncronic audios, writing life scripts or essays only using possitive language, subliminal audios and videos.

Some others more recent like Sun Gazing, Watching the light of a Candle, Universal Energy etc.

We also have the gurus of the Law of Attraction and all their programs like Bob Proctor and his Six minutes to success, Dr Rober Anthony and his Secret of Deliberate Creation program and his other programs, Anthony Robbins, Joe Vitale etc.

When I started a thread similar to this one, I asked for another method that could help to reprogram the subconcious. Someone told me about the Sedona Method that I have not heard before and it is exactly the method that you George were recommending.

Since you George started that method more than two years ago, could you share with us all the effects that it has had in your life and in your trading business, please?

I am half way of the Sedona Method home study course, however, I find hard to release, to let go. Could you give me some advices that worked for you?

I know the Sedona Method is for releasing and cleaning the subconcious, and many of the other methods I mentioned are for the reprogramming.

What do you think about the Silva Method, have you tried it? Have you been following only the Sedona Method or have you combined it with something else?

I really appreciate your help or anybodys on this and I thank you in advance.

Jorge

Jorge,

What can I tell you? Does the Sedona or the Silva Method work? Do you need those in order to reprogram your mind and take the short cut in order to become a great trader.

The answer to all this is both yes and no. What does it take to become a great trader. You have to get in into your system a different kind of thinking that is totally adapted to how the market works. Are we as human beings even designed to be able to do that? No! Why? Because the markets are dynamic and our mind is static. Our mind is projecting the future based on the past. Sounds like technical analysis right?! Does technical analysis work? Yes and no!

It works when it works and it doesn't when it doesn't. The problem is not that. The problem is that we expect it to work on a constant basis. Why do we do that? Because we're built that way . Uncertainty kills us, it makes us feel threatened or unsafe. It puts us in a negative mode. Negative mode = Stress. Stress = Bad Perceptions. Bad Perceptions (in the market) = We only perceive part of the truth, and that part is very, very subjective. That's why you always get it afterwards, asking yourself how you could be that stupid and take that trade. Now you can see it clearly, but when you took it believe me you could have sworn it was the right trade to take.

So, would Sedona or Silva get you onto the other side? No! Why? Because the pure essence of trading can't be reprogrammed with something that isn't there. What you need in trading in order to become great is a system/method that you are convinced works. And second you need to be able to execute that.

Sedona or Silva can't get you there because none of them contains that. But what they can do for you is to help you ease that path. After all you're the one that's gone walk the path. If any of them clicks with you, then by all means go for it, use your intention to get rid of what you need to get rid of in order to ease your path.

But remember there are no short cuts out there, we al have to program in the trading agenda in order to make this work!

Good Luck!

We all struggle to make tomorrow look like yesterday!
Get rid of your past and let the future unfold from the now.
Past performance is not indicative of future results.
/George
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  #52 (permalink)
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George View Post
Jorge,

What can I tell you? Does the Sedona or the Silva Method work? Do you need those in order to reprogram your mind and take the short cut in order to become a great trader.

The answer to all this is both yes and no. What does it take to become a great trader. You have to get in into your system a different kind of thinking that is totally adapted to how the market works. Are we as human beings even designed to be able to do that? No! Why? Because the markets are dynamic and our mind is static. Our mind is projecting the future based on the past. Sounds like technical analysis right?! Does technical analysis work? Yes and no!

It works when it works and it doesn't when it doesn't. The problem is not that. The problem is that we expect it to work on a constant basis. Why do we do that? Because we're built that way . Uncertainty kills us, it makes us feel threatened or unsafe. It puts us in a negative mode. Negative mode = Stress. Stress = Bad Perceptions. Bad Perceptions (in the market) = We only perceive part of the truth, and that part is very, very subjective. That's why you always get it afterwards, asking yourself how you could be that stupid and take that trade. Now you can see it clearly, but when you took it believe me you could have sworn it was the right trade to take.

So, would Sedona or Silva get you onto the other side? No! Why? Because the pure essence of trading can't be reprogrammed with something that isn't there. What you need in trading in order to become great is a system/method that you are convinced works. And second you need to be able to execute that.

Sedona or Silva can't get you there because none of them contains that. But what they can do for you is to help you ease that path. After all you're the one that's gone walk the path. If any of them clicks with you, then by all means go for it, use your intention to get rid of what you need to get rid of in order to ease your path.

But remember there are no short cuts out there, we al have to program in the trading agenda in order to make this work!

Good Luck!

George, thank you very much for your answer and deep thoughts. As I said, this thread started more than two years ago, I think that after that period you have come to this conclusion.

You are very right when you say that uncertainty may be very harmful if we do not know how to handle it. Trust in our method and the capability to execute it is the way that we can handle uncertainty. We must get use to uncertainty because in this business it will always be there.

Once we accept that true about uncertainty, trust our method and execute it, we will be able to become good traders. And thatīs the issue, since uncertainty related to money makes our mind and body to feel so many emotions that may make us not to execute or follow our method properly.

We must also accept that our trading method will not work all the time, and we should not allow that to affect us, but execute it all the time if we trust it and know that on the long run it will make more money than losing it.

What a trader must do is not to focus on the money, but to focus on the technicals, what I mean is to focus on execute his method exactly as it says, just as a technician will do in any other profession where he must apply certain process.

I understand that the sedona or Silva mehtod, or any other method will not make us a professional trader per se, but they are tools to ease our path to become that. Specially if they help you to handle or manage the uncertainty and not to be affected by the loser traders.

I am still trading on SIM. Iīve been doing well, three or four winning days per week. The days that I lose are because I might not follow my method because of fear or any related emotion. I tend to move my stop loss sometiems, because I do not want to take the loss of the trade. Sometimes it works, but some others it does not. What happens is that my method uses a very short stop loss only 5 ticks, and if you do not have your enties with a precise timing it can make you to have several losing trades.

I know I must follow the method and master my entries. I only one to tune that up to go alive with a cash account.

Thatīs why I asked about the different mind programs, so that I can handle uncertainty in a better way and to diminish the impact of emotions.

Of course that I have improved a lot from where I was four or six months ago and also to notice and realize the progress is important in this path.

Good luck to you too.

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  #53 (permalink)
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Trading Psychology


This is a huge area of importance. It can make you or break you. I have gotten some really great support on this from Steve Wheeler at Navitrader who is a firm believer in positive thinking and its effects on your life and trading. The book and DVD, "The Secret" are definitely worth reading and watching.

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JuneBug View Post
This is a huge area of importance. It can make you or break you. I have gotten some really great support on this from Steve Wheeler at Navitrader who is a firm believer in positive thinking and its effects on your life and trading. The book and DVD, "The Secret" are definitely worth reading and watching.

You seem to mention NaviTrader quite often....

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jgomez74 View Post
George, thank you very much for your answer and deep thoughts. As I said, this thread started more than two years ago, I think that after that period you have come to this conclusion.

You are very right when you say that uncertainty may be very harmful if we do not know how to handle it. Trust in our method and the capability to execute it is the way that we can handle uncertainty. We must get use to uncertainty because in this business it will always be there.

Once we accept that true about uncertainty, trust our method and execute it, we will be able to become good traders. And thatīs the issue, since uncertainty related to money makes our mind and body to feel so many emotions that may make us not to execute or follow our method properly.

We must also accept that our trading method will not work all the time, and we should not allow that to affect us, but execute it all the time if we trust it and know that on the long run it will make more money than losing it.

What a trader must do is not to focus on the money, but to focus on the technicals, what I mean is to focus on execute his method exactly as it says, just as a technician will do in any other profession where he must apply certain process.

I understand that the sedona or Silva mehtod, or any other method will not make us a professional trader per se, but they are tools to ease our path to become that. Specially if they help you to handle or manage the uncertainty and not to be affected by the loser traders.

I am still trading on SIM. Iīve been doing well, three or four winning days per week. The days that I lose are because I might not follow my method because of fear or any related emotion. I tend to move my stop loss sometiems, because I do not want to take the loss of the trade. Sometimes it works, but some others it does not. What happens is that my method uses a very short stop loss only 5 ticks, and if you do not have your enties with a precise timing it can make you to have several losing trades.

I know I must follow the method and master my entries. I only one to tune that up to go alive with a cash account.

Thatīs why I asked about the different mind programs, so that I can handle uncertainty in a better way and to diminish the impact of emotions.

Of course that I have improved a lot from where I was four or six months ago and also to notice and realize the progress is important in this path.

Good luck to you too.


Divide it into different segments. Start with your edge and learn to trust it. Either by back testing it or by executing it on a consecutive basis. After that take the step towards YOU!

When you know that your edge is working. Know also that it is you and only you that's standing in the way. When you talk about your system you talk about having issues with entry's. Entry's are very important when we speak about your edge and how they relate to that. In other words, if you execute an entry flawless it will bring you closer to having the odds on your side.
But entry's are far from the most important thing when we're talking about making it to the top and stay there. YOUR EXITS!; that's the key, and what happens after you've entered. In other words how you administrate your trade after you've entered the trade.

And that thing has to do with your system. Again, you have to do the work and make your system waterproof.

Now, I'm going to repeat myself. When you've done your system waterproof (remember there's no perfect system out there, all you need is a system that gets you on the positive side) take the step towards starting to monitor yourself. Why? Because you're the one that's going to have to pull the trigger and to follow your plan. If you know that your plan is working (and you have that proven and I'm talking about pure numbers here), but you're still not getting the good results executing it, then it is probably due to the fact that you have something in your belief system that's stops you from executing it correctly.

Here's where you should imply methods such as those you are suggesting, and that I've also suggested in previous posts. So keep it simple and work yourself systematically through it by taking the right steps. Now, with all that being said I'm sure that those methods can make you benefit in other ways as well, but as long as you lack a proven edge you're not gone end up on the right side of things. An edge together with a good pilot executing it, can take you to the moon and beyond!

Good Luck!

We all struggle to make tomorrow look like yesterday!
Get rid of your past and let the future unfold from the now.
Past performance is not indicative of future results.
/George
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  #56 (permalink)
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George View Post
Divide it into different segments. Start with your edge and learn to trust it. Either by back testing it or by executing it on a consecutive basis. After that take the step towards YOU!

When you know that your edge is working. Know also that it is you and only you that's standing in the way. When you talk about your system you talk about having issues with entry's. Entry's are very important when we speak about your edge and how they relate to that. In other words, if you execute an entry flawless it will bring you closer to having the odds on your side.
But entry's are far from the most important thing when we're talking about making it to the top and stay there. YOUR EXITS!; that's the key, and what happens after you've entered. In other words how you administrate your trade after you've entered the trade.

And that thing has to do with your system. Again, you have to do the work and make your system waterproof.

Now, I'm going to repeat myself. When you've done your system waterproof (remember there's no perfect system out there, all you need is a system that gets you on the positive side) take the step towards starting to monitor yourself. Why? Because you're the one that's going to have to pull the trigger and to follow your plan. If you know that your plan is working (and you have that proven and I'm talking about pure numbers here), but you're still not getting the good results executing it, then it is probably due to the fact that you have something in your belief system that's stops you from executing it correctly.

Here's where you should imply methods such as those you are suggesting, and that I've also suggested in previous posts. So keep it simple and work yourself systematically through it by taking the right steps. Now, with all that being said I'm sure that those methods can make you benefit in other ways as well, but as long as you lack a proven edge you're not gone end up on the right side of things. An edge together with a good pilot executing it, can take you to the moon and beyond!

Good Luck!

George, thank you very much again for your very helpful suggestions.

As I said, Iīve been having good results on SIM and I am sure my method works. Now I only need to make the big leap to start trading a live with a cash account.

Thanks again and Good luck for you too.

Jorge

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Sedona Method

Hello Georges

I understand that this is an old thread

From your very first post, you mention the Sedona Method was one of your preferred concept to help you to get in a good psychological zone

I did visit the Sedona Method site. They offer a lot of different products. May I ask you, witch one should I select to help me in my trading business?

Any help appreciated

Martin

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arjfca View Post
I did visit the Sedona Method site. They offer a lot of different products. May I ask you, witch one should I select to help me in my trading business?

Also consider discussing Sedona here:

https://futures.io/psychology-money-management/18734-sedona-method-getting-out-touch-dealing-fear.html

Mike

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arjfca View Post
Hello George

I understand that this is an old thread

From your very first post, you mention the Sedona Method was one of your preferred concept to help you to get in a good psychological zone

I did visit the Sedona Method site. They offer a lot of different products. May I ask you, witch one should I select to help me in my trading business?

Any help appreciated

Martin

Thanks George, for these threads. It takes the concept of successful trading to a whole new level, at least for me.

I'd like to comment on the recommendation of the Sedona method. The method has been very successful for alot of people, but I could not persist with it for a number of reasons. Firstly is the repetition, it seems their is a core principle here that can be described in less than a page or two, but continues to get rehashed over and over again. If Sedona is so easy, why does it take an incredible amount of books and CD's to accomplish the skills transfer?

Secondly, its not very analytical, and I like getting into the details of stuff and wondering why something does not work. Sedona asks us to believe a competing narrative, and then 'simply release' on those ideas.

A reviewer on Amazon had very similar views to these, and recommended "CBT for Dummies" (Cognitive Behavioural Therapy), and as a result I am working my way through this book and finding alot more depth and reasoning into the techniques and exercises. Highly Recommended.

Cheers,

Adrian

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  #60 (permalink)
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adrianjm View Post
Thanks George, for these threads. It takes the concept of successful trading to a whole new level, at least for me.

I'd like to comment on the recommendation of the Sedona method. The method has been very successful for alot of people, but I could not persist with it for a number of reasons. Firstly is the repetition, it seems their is a core principle here that can be described in less than a page or two, but continues to get rehashed over and over again. If Sedona is so easy, why does it take an incredible amount of books and CD's to accomplish the skills transfer?

Secondly, its not very analytical, and I like getting into the details of stuff and wondering why something does not work. Sedona asks us to believe a competing narrative, and then 'simply release' on those ideas.

A reviewer on Amazon had very similar views to these, and recommended "CBT for Dummies" (Cognitive Behavioural Therapy), and as a result I am working my way through this book and finding alot more depth and reasoning into the techniques and exercises. Highly Recommended.

Cheers,

Adrian

There are a lot of techniques. I like breathing - breath in and out - conscious breathing. With this kind of release you can get "no mind". I also like sedona. It was my first CBT. I switched to Core Transformation (NLP). The end is the buddhism. I read a lot of books about NLP, Hypnosis ( like also Gerald kein) and so on, but "a new world" from tolle changed my mind. Tolle and Osho recite the buddhism in a wonderful style.

In this case: breathing and buddhism is meditation. you can learn a lot of breathing techniques ...

best regards

Causality is the relationship between an event (the cause) and a second event (the effect), where the second event is a consequence of the first.
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