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Deliberate Practice


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Deliberate Practice

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 bijeremiad 
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Didn't see a thread on this topic. It was a point of focus/interest for me a while back. I will leave a few articles I found interesting here. Others can feel free to add links and docs.

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 bijeremiad 
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This one hit home for me. Spelling bee participants practice for their contests in a couple ways. The study breaks it into three: 1) deliberate practice, 2) being quizzed, 3) leisurely activities (like reading lots). Study found strong link between those that practiced in solitary, feed-back driven etended to do better in the bees.

For me deliberate practice would be screen time, logging trades, and trade reviews. Flipping through charts might be like "being quized", but I found I spent too much time watching videos and reading forums "leisurely" trading activities. The leisurely activities became my procrastination. Need to move away from that.

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 bijeremiad 
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This is one of the "grand-daddy" papers on the topic. Morse code, violin, piano, chess, athletics. Too many ideas for me to summarize easily. But worth the read.

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 bijeremiad 
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Golf and chess here. Talks about the importance of focusing on metrics that you have control over. Plateaus can be maintained for years.

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 bijeremiad 
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Here is an interesting example how a goalie practices: using a smaller than normal target (tennis ball), forcing situational awareness (ball overhead), throwing the ball to unseen targets. In someways more demanding than the situation he is training for, but developing skills needed.


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 Tap In 
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Good idea for a thread. I would like to see this topic explored further.

As a long time competitive golfer I understand how deliberate practice can be applied towards improvement. I know that there are specific things I can work on to improve my ball striking, putting, chipping, etc. These things tend to be fundamental and time tested. You either do it right or not right, and the results show.

I have never figured out a specific way to practice trading though. There are a thousand and one different ways to trade, and the markets are ever changing. What worked today may not work tomorrow. I can read a golf book that says that if you do this, this, and this you have a good chance of hitting the ball straight. So I grab a bucket of balls and have at it. Repetition, repetition, repetition. The better I do those things the straighter I hit it, and then I move on to the next thing.

What is the equivalent to this type of practice in trading? How does a novice trader practice what he doesn't know? Is it just about more screen time?

I would love to hear some examples of how other traders practice.

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 cmmichaels 
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Awesome! Thanks for all the above

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 Jura 
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Don't mean to burst your bubble, but have you guys read the meta-analysis from Macnamara et al. (2014)?


Quoting 
Deliberate Practice and Performance in Music, Games, Sports, Education, and Professions: A Meta-Analysis

Abstract
More than 20 years ago, researchers proposed that individual differences in performance in such domains as music, sports, and games largely reflect individual differences in amount of deliberate practice, which was defined as engagement in structured activities created specifically to improve performance in a domain. This view is a frequent topic of popular science writing—but is it supported by empirical evidence? To answer this question, we conducted a meta-analysis covering all major domains in which deliberate practice has been investigated. We found that deliberate practice explained 26% of the variance in performance for games, 21% for music, 18% for sports, 4% for education, and less than 1% for professions. We conclude that deliberate practice is important, but not as important as has been argued.

(bold added)

They make a few comments that are essential for traders, I believe:


Quoting 
In terms of percentage of variance in performance explained, the effect of deliberate practice was strong for games (26%), music (21%), and sports (18%), and much weaker for education (4%) and professions (< 1% and not statistically significant).

Why were the effect sizes for education and professions so much smaller? One possibility is that deliberate practice is less well defined in these domains. It could also be that in some of the studies, participants differed in amount of prestudy expertise (e.g., amount of domain knowledge before taking an academic course or accepting a job) and thus in the amount of deliberate practice they needed to achieve a given level of performance.

Moderator analyses further revealed that the effect of deliberate practice on performance tended to be larger for activities that are highly predictable (e.g., running) than for activities that are less predictable (e.g., handling an aviation emergency), as we hypothesized.

Furthermore, the effect of deliberate practice on performance was stronger for studies that used retrospective methods to elicit estimates of deliberate practice than for those that used a log method. In fact, for studies using the log method, which presumably yields more valid estimates
than retrospective methods do, deliberate practice accounted for only 5% of the variance in performance.

(p. 1615-1616; underline added)

Their conclusion can be summed up with the following quote:


Quoting 
More than 20 years ago, Ericsson et al. (1993) argued that “individual differences in ultimate performance can largely be accounted for by differential amounts of past and current levels of practice” (p. 392). Ericsson and Moxley (2012) reiterated this claim, stating that “the concept of deliberate practice can account for the large individual differences between experts and novices” (p. 145).

The results of this meta-analysis do not support these strong claims. Regardless of domain, a large amount of variance in performance is not explained by deliberate practice and is potentially explainable by other factors. We conclude that amount of deliberate practice—although unquestionably important as a predictor of individual differences in performance from both a statistical and a practical perspective—is not as important as Ericsson and his colleagues have argued.

(p. 1615)

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Jura View Post
Don't mean to burst your bubble, but have you guys read the meta-analysis from Macnamara et al. (2014)?

What bubble does this study burst?

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 Jura 
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What bubble does this study burst?

For trading, these:


bijeremiad View Post
This one hit home for me. Spelling bee participants practice for their contests in a couple ways. The study breaks it into three: 1) deliberate practice, 2) being quizzed, 3) leisurely activities (like reading lots). Study found strong link between those that practiced in solitary, feed-back driven etended to do better in the bees.


bijeremiad View Post
This is one of the "grand-daddy" papers on the topic. Morse code, violin, piano, chess, athletics. Too many ideas for me to summarize easily. But worth the read.


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Jura View Post
For trading, these:

Still not sure what that study is trying to say. That practice doesn't really matter that much?

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 Jura 
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Still not sure what that study is trying to say. That practice doesn't really matter that much?

My understanding of it is the following:
  • Several experts have argued that deliberate practice is essential for achieving expert performance.
  • Macnamara et al. (2014) collected 88 studies (with 11,135 participants) about the effect of deliberate practice to examine how important deliberate practice really is.
  • In each of those 88 studies, an estimate was made for how much hours participants were spending on deliberate practice through either conducting an interview, questionnaire, or letting the participant keep a log.
  • Performance was measured with an objective measure, a laboratory task, group membership, or expert rating.
  • When Macnamara et al. (2014) combined the results of all those studies, they found that how many hours a participant spend on deliberate practice explained:
    26% of his/her performance in games,
    21% in music performance,
    18% with sports performance,
    4% in educational performance,
    and less than 1% for professions.
  • Another important point is that, when the time log of participants was used, the impact of deliberate practice on performance was even less than these percentages. So perhaps people have a tendency to miss-estimate how much time they spend doing deliberate practice.
  • Additional analyses from the researchers shows that deliberate practice had a larger impact on performance for activities that were highly predictable. But for activities that were much less predictable, deliberate practice matter much less.
  • We can also see that above: playing music is highly predictable and deliberate practice has a greater weight there (21% of differences in performance explained). But job performance, which has much more variables than playing music, is practically unaffected by deliberate practice (less than 1% of performance explained by deliberate practice).
  • But even in highly predictable and structured activities, like playing a game or making music, only 26% to 21% of the difference in performance was explained by the amount of deliberate practice. This suggest that around 75% of people's performance in predictable activities is due to other factors.
  • The authors suggest that these other factors could be general intelligence or working memory capacity.
  • Because much of the performance of people was attributable to factors other than deliberate practice, the authors conclude that deliberate practice is not that important.
  • But why does deliberate practice seem important? It might be because it is an indication of ability: people stop doing what they don't do well and feel rewarded for. So successful people have spend a lot of time in deliberate practice, but that's because they are good at it or have some ability. It doesn't necessarily mean that they achieved expert performance through deliberate practice.
  • Because trading is a unpredictable activity, probably comparable with professions and not with music or games, it's likely that deliberate practice is not that important for trading.
  • Of course, practice is important especially when someone is a newbie (practice can, after all, give confidence and that is quite important in trading). But the data from Macnamara et al. (2014) suggest that we should not consider deliberate practice essential for expert performance or give it a large amount of weight.
  • In other words, it looks like deliberate practice is not a holy grail for achieving expert performance, especially for unpredictable activities like trading.

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 Jura 
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Still not sure what that study is trying to say. That practice doesn't really matter that much?

To (try to) explain it further, one of the things the study says is what you experienced yourself:


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As a long time competitive golfer I understand how deliberate practice can be applied towards improvement. I know that there are specific things I can work on to improve my ball striking, putting, chipping, etc. These things tend to be fundamental and time tested. You either do it right or not right, and the results show.

I have never figured out a specific way to practice trading though. There are a thousand and one different ways to trade, and the markets are ever changing. What worked today may not work tomorrow.

Because golf is much more predictable than trading, golf is much better suited for deliberate practice. And, as you already mentioned, deliberate practice in trading might not have a big impact because the markets are (to a certain extend) unpredictable and ever changing.

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Jura View Post
To (try to) explain it further, one of the things the study says is what you experienced yourself:



Because golf is much more predictable than trading, golf is much better suited for deliberate practice. And, as you already mentioned, deliberate practice in trading might not have a big impact because the markets are (to a certain extend) unpredictable and ever changing.


Thank you for taking the time to clarify.

There is a saying: “studies either confirm what common sense already suggests, or they are wrong”.

I do not disagree with much of this study, except their conclusion. It may certainly be true that deliberate practice contributes only 20 or so percent to performance but it is a very important 20% indeed. History is littered with those who were born with the 80% and wasted it away because they didn’t apply the 20%. The successful were also born with the 80% and they did the hard 20%. For them to conclude that for high level musicians or athletes “deliberate practice is not that important” is silly. I would like to hear what Jerry Rice or Tiger Woods or Roger Federer think about that notion.

It is no surprise that deliberate practice has a greater influence on activities with objective performance measures (they use the word “predictable” for some reason). In these activities competency or lack thereof is clear. There is a scorecard. With other “professions” the definition of success is foggier. In most professions many factors contribute to success beyond competency. Among them luck, personality and the ability to BS. In many professions, a person can have an entire successful career without really having to apply the intensity of training or focus that a high level athlete or musician does (or trader?). Woody Allen’s suggestion that “90% of success is just showing up” is spot on.

As regards to trading, I do believe trading is more like sports than other unpredictable professions. While the market itself may be unpredictable, performance results are cruelly objective. There is no BS in trading. You either make money or you don’t. We know that some traders are successful. We know that they have a technique and mindset that contributes to their success. Is it so unreasonable then to conclude that these things can be practiced? Brett Steenbarger (“Enhancing Trader Performance”) doesn’t think it is so unreasonable.

It would be interesting to hear if or how others practice their trading.

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 pludloe 
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I have a background in Music, and for the past couple of years I have been working on my understanding of the markets. I wanted a way to practice trading that was enjoyable and didn't seem like I was just looking at pretty pictures on the screen.

Here is what I have come up with:

* Define a simple objective Trend following system with a mechanical stop and mechanical take profit.

* Spend time in the (Sim) market only taking these signals to practice discipline. While doing this take notes on the strengths and weaknesses of the mechanical system. This continues until you've proven to yourself that you can follow a system with discipline over a decent length of time (accuracy and time length decided beforehand).

* Now the system becomes your opponent and you use your observations of the systems weaknesses to improve your comparative performance. I try to focus on only one change at a time and give priority to those improvements which I think will give the greatest performance increase for the least effort.

* If you have found an improvement to the system and it can be traded mechanically then add it to the original strategy and this now becomes your opponent.

An example would be a Moving average crossover system. These weakness of this system would be its performance in ranging markets. The weakness of the mechanical stop and target is not taking into account the context of the market.

If anyone else has any ideas I would enjoy hearing them.

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 Trailer Guy 
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System Trading, to me should be like golf or music. You are responding to a certain set of circumstances in a predefined way. We system trade because the great breakthroughs in fuzzy logic computing are in the future and as we have read on this forum very few can use Charles Boole's logic to trade successfully, so we are stuck using our own brain.

But the success part is being able to recognize those patterns without thinking. Van Tharp has written that really great system traders are able to follow their own rules maybe 70% of the time. This is based on their own trading logs. This knowledge, and I am guessing his own personal interest, have sent him in pursuit of oneness to practice train the brain for trading in the zone.

Adam H Grimes who is mentioned on these boards from time to time is right there with Van Tharp. He teaches focusing on a few simple patterns that give an edge and also has a large component on meditation in his class.

The exceptionally fowl mouthed Tom Dante asks in his endearing way if people ever review the prior day to see what they are doing, especially with his Trading Devil score card so you can tally by number and type your mental mistakes.

Now clearly none of this performance practice would be needed for the enlightened ones who simply trade price action with no rules off of bare charts. On the other hand how many years of practice reading the charts did it take them to reach trading enlightenment. If training to be able to read price action isn't right there with music then I guess I just don't get it.

Just my 2cents.

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There are plenty of platforms that you can practice on. But my trading is to automate and back test

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Jura View Post
My understanding of it is the following:
  • Several experts have argued that deliberate practice is essential for achieving expert performance.
  • Macnamara et al. (2014) collected 88 studies (with 11,135 participants) about the effect of deliberate practice to examine how important deliberate practice really is.
  • In each of those 88 studies, an estimate was made for how much hours participants were spending on deliberate practice through either conducting an interview, questionnaire, or letting the participant keep a log.
  • Performance was measured with an objective measure, a laboratory task, group membership, or expert rating.
  • When Macnamara et al. (2014) combined the results of all those studies, they found that how many hours a participant spend on deliberate practice explained:
    26% of his/her performance in games,
    21% in music performance,
    18% with sports performance,
    4% in educational performance,
    and less than 1% for professions.
  • Another important point is that, when the time log of participants was used, the impact of deliberate practice on performance was even less than these percentages. So perhaps people have a tendency to miss-estimate how much time they spend doing deliberate practice.
  • Additional analyses from the researchers shows that deliberate practice had a larger impact on performance for activities that were highly predictable. But for activities that were much less predictable, deliberate practice matter much less.
  • We can also see that above: playing music is highly predictable and deliberate practice has a greater weight there (21% of differences in performance explained). But job performance, which has much more variables than playing music, is practically unaffected by deliberate practice (less than 1% of performance explained by deliberate practice).
  • But even in highly predictable and structured activities, like playing a game or making music, only 26% to 21% of the difference in performance was explained by the amount of deliberate practice. This suggest that around 75% of people's performance in predictable activities is due to other factors.
  • The authors suggest that these other factors could be general intelligence or working memory capacity.
  • Because much of the performance of people was attributable to factors other than deliberate practice, the authors conclude that deliberate practice is not that important.
  • But why does deliberate practice seem important? It might be because it is an indication of ability: people stop doing what they don't do well and feel rewarded for. So successful people have spend a lot of time in deliberate practice, but that's because they are good at it or have some ability. It doesn't necessarily mean that they achieved expert performance through deliberate practice.
  • Because trading is a unpredictable activity, probably comparable with professions and not with music or games, it's likely that deliberate practice is not that important for trading.
  • Of course, practice is important especially when someone is a newbie (practice can, after all, give confidence and that is quite important in trading). But the data from Macnamara et al. (2014) suggest that we should not consider deliberate practice essential for expert performance or give it a large amount of weight.
  • In other words, it looks like deliberate practice is not a holy grail for achieving expert performance, especially for unpredictable activities like trading.

You blend points of the study and you cite your own beliefs as fact.
"Trading is unpredictable activity" - the market will move 3 ways. How is that not predicatable?

I suspect you are espousing your beliefs into this.

Trading is still pattern based. Is music not pattern based?

^Only 21 to 26% due to deliberate practice?
Could that not be based on how subjective the standards for deliberate practice are? It's relative. You seem like you've never played sports, been coached in sports, much less competed at a high level.

In those 88 studies, with 11000 participants, who and what were they of?
They sure don't sound like world class performers.
Even if they were could not their performances be improved and economized by practice?

Whether these persons or not did deliberate practice or not, would one not benefit from isolating various aspects of anything including trading? As simple as seeing the same progression and set up in 50 different charts? Prior to each session than the trader who goes off rote memory.

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Find something you like...
Screenshot it, find it again, repeat. Review it. You could also video screenshot the same set up, play it at high speed, find in multiple times, put on random play. Work the observation and process through in your head. Add a few that got stopped out. Etc. Etc

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Jura View Post
Don't mean to burst your bubble, but have you guys read the meta-analysis from Macnamara et al. (2014)?


(bold added)

They make a few comments that are essential for traders, I believe:


(p. 1615-1616; underline added)

Their conclusion can be summed up with the following quote:


(p. 1615)

^"Why were the effects for education and profession so much smaller?"
Because it's not common practice to isolate skill sets in these domains. If you look at what Doug Lemov did author of Teach Like a Champion his group isolates skills that effective teachers commonly use and actually do skills and drills with other teachers to improve their abilities to teach. This is in line with Hanusheks 1992 study that a child with an effective teacher in a so called lower school will do better than a child with a less effective teacher in a really good school.

Jura maybe you should continue to test your theories and research further.

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The deliberate practice used in trading provides the perfect foundation to build effective training programs for traders who want to reach consistency faster and have a much higher chance of success.

However, deliberate practice can be difficult because it forces traders out of their comfort zone as the drills get more challenging. So, it’s important to stay resilient as you would in the real financial markets. Deliberate practice also requires long efforts of concentration- perfect for getting you ready once you’re staring at your real, live charts. Lastly, there’s no instant gratification because you need to master many complex skills over time before you see a profitable equity curve.

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I have used deliberate practice a lot to improve my trading. I started on and off in 2017, then in 2018 I started to take it seriously but I couldn't get anywhere.

I have a background in engineering but I have been a semi professional musician for 10+ years (classic guitar).
One day a thought came to my mind: what if I can treat trading like music?
A musician learn by deliberate practice, when you first start to play an instrument you don't ask yourself "how long will it take?".
So I made a commitment to only focus on trading every single day.

Three years have passed now, and I have improved so much. You just practice every day and you will become good.

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 LastDino 
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I would imagine here by deliberate practice, one means establishing more mind and body connection, gaining better understanding of yourself and your psychology in critical situations, I think that's pretty much the only secrete sauce of the trading world.

That's probably why it takes long time to master it and even after then you might not be the top most, just like any other field.

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 robert880 
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SBtrader82 View Post
I have used deliberate practice a lot to improve my trading. I started on and off in 2017, then in 2018 I started to take it seriously but I couldn't get anywhere.

I have a background in engineering but I have been a semi professional musician for 10+ years (classic guitar).
One day a thought came to my mind: what if I can treat trading like music?
A musician learn by deliberate practice, when you first start to play an instrument you don't ask yourself "how long will it take?".
So I made a commitment to only focus on trading every single day.

Three years have passed now, and I have improved so much. You just practice every day and you will become good.

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Wonder what you mean? What specific actions did you take every single day for 3 years? I would imagine there are plenty of people that trade everyday it are not doing deliberate practice. I’m thinking iof putting together a routine to think about the market every day after hours. Maybe doing a replay everyday and marking up my charts. Curious what you’re doing.

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 SBtrader82 
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robert880 View Post
Wonder what you mean? What specific actions did you take every single day for 3 years? I would imagine there are plenty of people that trade everyday it are not doing deliberate practice. I’m thinking iof putting together a routine to think about the market every day after hours. Maybe doing a replay everyday and marking up my charts. Curious what you’re doing.

I have traded everyday meaning that I was watching market 8 hours per day for three years, without losing any single day.
Most people watch market from time to time.

I then imposed rules like the systematic use of stop losses etc.... but trading everyday for me is already a form of practice.

When I was playing guitar I used to play every day including Sundays, Saturdays and festivities. This is what musicians do, they practice everyday. And they practice 6+ hours per day.

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 trendisyourfriend 
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Deliberate practice always follows the same pattern: break the overall process down into parts, identify your weaknesses, test new strategies for each section, and then integrate your learning into the overall process.

The greatest challenge of deliberate practice is to remain focused. In the beginning, showing up and putting in your reps is the most important thing. But after a while we begin to carelessly overlook small errors and miss daily opportunities for improvement.

This is because the natural tendency of the human brain is to transform repeated behaviors into automatic habits. For example, when you first learned to tie your shoes you had to think carefully about each step of the process. Today, after many repetitions, your brain can perform this sequence automatically. The more we repeat a task the more mindless it becomes.

Mindless activity is the enemy of deliberate practice. The danger of practicing the same thing again and again is that progress becomes assumed. Too often, we assume we are getting better simply because we are gaining experience. In reality, we are merely reinforcing our current habits—not improving them.

source:
https://jamesclear.com/beginners-guide-deliberate-practice
https://jamesclear.com/deliberate-practice-theory

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 SBtrader82 
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trendisyourfriend View Post
Deliberate practice always follows the same pattern: break the overall process down into parts, identify your weaknesses, test new strategies for each section, and then integrate your learning into the overall process.

The greatest challenge of deliberate practice is to remain focused. In the beginning, showing up and putting in your reps is the most important thing. But after a while we begin to carelessly overlook small errors and miss daily opportunities for improvement.

This is because the natural tendency of the human brain is to transform repeated behaviors into automatic habits. For example, when you first learned to tie your shoes you had to think carefully about each step of the process. Today, after many repetitions, your brain can perform this sequence automatically. The more we repeat a task the more mindless it becomes.

Mindless activity is the enemy of deliberate practice. The danger of practicing the same thing again and again is that progress becomes assumed. Too often, we assume we are getting better simply because we are gaining experience. In reality, we are merely reinforcing our current habits—not improving them.

source:
https://jamesclear.com/beginners-guide-deliberate-practice
https://jamesclear.com/deliberate-practice-theory

This is very true , in trading it's very difficult to understand if you are making any progress. The reason is that P&L is not a good metric, to measure any progress.

What I did in my case was to work on something for some weeks until this something (for instance the systematic use of stops) became innate in my trading.
Then, after one thing became part of my style I started to work on something else.

This is something musicians often do. They work on scales, then on arpeggios etc...

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 Bermudan Option 
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Anyone care to expand on some of their Deliberate Practice Habits? In retrospect, I have unintentionally had months of mindless repetition that I thought was practice, with few insights being discovered and/or and retained.

I'm currently backtesting with the following deliberate practice methods:
  • Create S.M.A.R.T. weekly goals that are not based around outcomes
  • Reflect on my session to see where I improved and where I have room for improvement
  • End of week review to reflect on the week as a whole
  • Take screenshots of recurring price patterns that may be exploitable
  • Use spaced repetition software to create flashcards around key themes and/or exploitable price action patterns

One idea that has further reframed my approach to my deliberate practice is the book Practice Perfect by Doug Lemov. The book touches on best practices for practicing and mentioned that there are two types of practices: Drills & Scrimmages...

Drills are honing in on a specific skill. An example of a drill in soccer would be weaving in and out of a series of cones with the ball to improve dribbling. They point out that drills can make you better at a skill, but that doesn't automatically equate to being better overall. In the soccer example, a defender would be seen as incompetent if he chose to dribble the ball repeatedly instead of clearing the ball for example.

This is where scrimmages come into play. Scrimmages are a chance to insert drilled skills into game-like scenarios with a much more focused analysis on whether the skill is resulting in improvement in overall outcomes.

I have spent less time scrimmaging and more time drilling and I feel like my improvements are more noticeable. In retrospect, when I thought I was practicing before, I was actually just replicating my live trading but without risk. It's like playing pickup games... if you aren't paying focused attention on areas that can be tweaked (ie: Drilling) then unchecked (and often bad) habits become ingrained and automated.

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 TradingDrills   is a Vendor
 
 
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trendisyourfriend View Post
Deliberate practice always follows the same pattern: break the overall process down into parts, identify your weaknesses, test new strategies for each section, and then integrate your learning into the overall process.

The greatest challenge of deliberate practice is to remain focused. In the beginning, showing up and putting in your reps is the most important thing. But after a while we begin to carelessly overlook small errors and miss daily opportunities for improvement.

This is because the natural tendency of the human brain is to transform repeated behaviors into automatic habits. For example, when you first learned to tie your shoes you had to think carefully about each step of the process. Today, after many repetitions, your brain can perform this sequence automatically. The more we repeat a task the more mindless it becomes.

Mindless activity is the enemy of deliberate practice. The danger of practicing the same thing again and again is that progress becomes assumed. Too often, we assume we are getting better simply because we are gaining experience. In reality, we are merely reinforcing our current habits—not improving them.

source:
https://jamesclear.com/beginners-guide-deliberate-practice
https://jamesclear.com/deliberate-practice-theory

Thanks and excellent points Trendisyourfriend!

In Deliberate Practice, there should be a constant evaluation by the coaching system, along with specific learning targets. The difficulty of each level should gradually increase as the trader's performance improves. The instant feedback by smart drills or a coach would let the traders know right away to do a task and to learn from their mistakes quickly and efficiently.


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 SBtrader82 
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TradingDrills View Post
Hi SBtrader82,

I used deliberate practice as the best method to train aspiring traders to become consistent on a single setup: Find a trend and take its pullbacks
Let me provide everyone with some rough statistics from my training experience with lots of students since 2013 when my Training/coaching Method changed:

1- Vidoe/webinars with Q/A ~ ~5% chance of success
2- Vidoe/webinars with Q/A + Powerpoint drills sent offline ~ 10% chance of success
3- Vidoe/webinars with Q/A + Smart Drills under LMS ~ 30% chance of success
4- Vidoe/webinars with Q/A + Smart Drills under LMS+ 1-1 coaching ~ 50% chance of success

Note:
The #1 disappointed me as I spend lots of time preparing many videos and explaining in detail the trade conditions and expected a much higher chance of success. Then I realized in the performance coaching era like trading, is like teaching swimming outside water by videos, which is not effective.

The #2 was more effective but it took lots of my personal time to provide feedback to those who completed the offline drills. I realized only students who practiced these drills become consistent, which was the beginning of my research on the topic of deliberate practice in detail. But with this system, only 10% completed these drills as there was no enforcement, and the majority not used these effective drills and only watched videos.

The #3 had Deliberate practice component and was using Smart Drills. All other price action setups were removed and the focus of the process and Algo conditions were to trade only one simple pullback setup. It was also embedded under Learning Management System (LMS) that was facilitating the coaching process. However, personal coaching was sporadic and missing at the end for coachable students. I realized some traders need direct specific coaching when they get to Trading Personalization at the end (selection of Time frame, instrument, risk tolerance & SL, trading hours/session, Money Management, preparing journals).

The #4 is the best coaching system so far as it is completely based on deliberate practice with the smart drills under LMS that provide instant automatic feedback to students, so it will not take my personal time till the trader completes all essential training and understands our terminology. By that time if any coachable student remains in the LMS training system, then I will invest my time to coach them personally after the interview.

By the way, 50% will never become a successful trader even with the best training system as they cannot resolve their psychological Cognitive/Emotional mismatches.


@TradingDrills everything that you write sounds very weird to me, what does it mean "it was also embedded under Learning Management System (LMS)"? there are many part of your post that if I read them rationally they sound just like a bunch of complicated words stick together, but they make no sense to me.

I don't understand what you are offering, does your method/system makes money? if so can you prove this claim?
Or are you just a coach? (I have nothing against coaches) but I cannot understand when you say trading system etc... and then you talk about coaching.

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 bobwest 
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TradingDrills View Post
Hi SBtrader82,

I used deliberate practice as the best method to train aspiring traders to become consistent on a single setup: Find a trend and take its pullbacks
Let me provide everyone with some rough statistics from my training experience with lots of students since 2013 when my Training/coaching Method changed:

...

The #4 is the best coaching system so far as it is completely based on deliberate practice with the smart drills under LMS that provide instant automatic feedback to students, so it will not take my personal time till the trader completes all essential training and understands our terminology. By that time if any coachable student remains in the LMS training system, then I will invest my time to coach them personally after the interview.

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  #33 (permalink)
Chof
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I believe "deliberate practice" can/will benefit any trader. Dr Steenbargers advice to journal such practice/actual trades applies the experience to your historical record and helps you grade results.
His advice (as others have said) is a great way to pick specific things to work on. The prep
and emotional considerations before trading should also be considered. These sorts of matters are rarely spoken about - but are so important to achieve consistant results.

Generally, pick one or two things/skill to work on. Stick to your hard loss limit - like 3 losses in a row.
Practice/trade for an hour at a time max - go for a walk or drink of water. Keep track of results and then journal same at the end of the session and you'll get better - simple. (right)

I hope I haven't missed the point with this - (just sharing what I've always done)

All the best and good trading!

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