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Time to Give Up
Started:March 27th, 2013 (04:47 PM) by Big Mike Views / Replies:55,867 / 414
Last Reply:October 21st, 2016 (12:21 AM) Attachments:3

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Time to Give Up

Old June 28th, 2013, 07:46 PM   #91 (permalink)
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Unless one is trained by a Prop Firm, I reckon that everyone should go through, must go through the beginners cycle.

Even after after trading equities part time for years, I went through the cycle again with intra day trading.

I reckon the "ten percent" of successful traders come from those of us that have the determination to survive and the smarts to manage risk long enough to learn the complete picture.

XS

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Old June 29th, 2013, 02:22 PM   #92 (permalink)
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Well this seems a bit to much black and white. I would not look for a signal service. But good education (also from vendors!) seldom hurts.

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Old July 13th, 2013, 06:32 PM   #93 (permalink)
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This paragraph touched on something that has caused a lot of doubt in my trading journey, so I'll put it out there to get some feedback. Even though I have never had any gambling issues, I am an addict to the core. I am very proud to say I have been sober close to 7 years now and my life has done a complete 180, however sometimes when I get excited in a trade (winning or losing trade) the switch will go off an I will make some inexplicable decisions that remind me of the state of mind I would go into when I was still active. I am naturally undisciplined, selfish, egotistical and have a high threshold for "pain". I have been able to change all of these in my daily life, but when it comes to trading, all these traits still come up with full force.

So, would this put me in the "Time to Give Up" category?

The simple fact that you are willing to be so honest tells me you are not in this category.

However you might be standing on thin ice because you are still looking for that pay off.

At the same rate if you can learn to trade without emotion than you will have truly beaten the addiction.

If you always do what you have always done you will always get what you have always gotten.
Celebrate because you executed your edge. Not because you won.
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Old July 20th, 2013, 09:05 PM   #94 (permalink)
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This is my first post on this website.

I've been thinking very hard about trading full time. I appreciate this thread as I am especially interested in the psychological aspect of trading. I worry about forgetting what is really important to me and running after things that don't matter. I don't want to end up loving the wrong things.

I'm 25, and I am alone, with no one who depends on me. I have a great paying job which affords me sufficient time to study and learn on my own, for that I consider myself very blessed. I started trading options almost a year ago now and just recently my initial 4k account has gone to 116 dollars. Looking back on my trades I see, over-trading, lack of a solid workable plan, lack of discipline, and no money management as my biggest problems - what I now know to be very common issues. I look forward to correcting these issues and seeing what happens.

I am very interested in learning how to do this right and I am grateful for the honesty here. Thanks.


Aaron

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Old July 21st, 2013, 01:54 PM   #95 (permalink)
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Trading is a zero sum game. For every winner, there is at least one loser. Therefore, not everyone can make money. That's the reality. It is time to quit, when you realize that you don't have an edge. Lastly, don't trade if you can't afford to lose the money. The stress can crush you and cloud your judgement.

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Old July 21st, 2013, 02:21 PM   #96 (permalink)
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Some of the responses in the thread are complete BS. The truth, how to know when you should give up? Look into your future, see yourself as someone who had a dream of trading for a living and gave up on it. Does that thought cause you pain? Then it's not time to give up. Does that thought not bother you? Then I argue you never really wanted it in the first place.

Don't ever let anyone tell you when you should give up, or when you should continue. That decision comes from you and you alone. Don't have the money yet? That does not mean you give up, it means you figure out how to get the money you need to trade, and you do it, you get it. You don't sit around reading forums wishing you had money. You go out and get the money. Got the money and blew an account? Go get more money! Never give in, never give up.

No excuses. You either want this or you don't. Don't listen to other people saying you either have what it takes or you don't, and if you don't you should quit, that some people just can't trade. BS. If you don't have what it takes, go get what it takes. End of story, end of debate.

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Old July 21st, 2013, 03:08 PM   #97 (permalink)
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No excuses. You either want this or you don't. Don't listen to other people saying you either have what it takes or you don't, and if you don't you should quit, that some people just can't trade. BS. If you don't have what it takes, go get what it takes. End of story, end of debate.

So is trading unique in this area, or does this apply to everything in life?

For example, if someone simply has the willpower to be better than Tiger Woods or Michael Jordon, or if someone had the willpower to land on the moon instead of Neil Armstrong, does this mean that they have a chance in hell?

No, it does not.

Willpower alone is not nearly enough. Willpower is a prerequisite. It is not an advantage or edge.

Not everyone is cut out to be a trader.

Mike

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Old July 21st, 2013, 04:30 PM   #98 (permalink)
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So is trading unique in this area, or does this apply to everything in life?

For example, if someone simply has the willpower to be better than Tiger Woods or Michael Jordon, or if someone had the willpower to land on the moon instead of Neil Armstrong, does this mean that they have a chance in hell?

No, it does not.

Willpower alone is not nearly enough. Willpower is a prerequisite. It is not an advantage or edge.

Not everyone is cut out to be a trader.

Mike

I am just wondering who you are to say what others can and can't do? I can't continue to spend time at a place where the main dude is putting limitations on what others can do. You have built something pretty amazing here, and I guarantee there were plenty of people who said you could never achieve what you have with futures.io (formerly BMT). I find it odd that you keep throwing it out there that not everyone is cut out to be a trader.

The correct phrase is, not everyone is willing to put in the time and effort it takes to become a trader.

I absolutely disagree with your statement now, as I have every other time I have seen you say it.

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Old July 21st, 2013, 04:52 PM   #99 (permalink)
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I am just wondering who you are to say what others can and can't do? I can't continue to spend time at a place where the main dude is putting limitations on what others can do. You have built something pretty amazing here, and I guarantee there were plenty of people who said you could never achieve what you have with futures.io (formerly BMT). I find it odd that you keep throwing it out there that not everyone is cut out to be a trader.

The correct phrase is, not everyone is willing to put in the time and effort it takes to become a trader.

I absolutely disagree with your statement now, as I have every other time I have seen you say it.

You want to leave because you don't agree with my opinion? While I don't understand why you would do such a thing, you are of course free to do so. You seem to be really overreacting.

Anyone can be anything they want to be if they apply themselves. I think you are confusing what I am saying. There is a difference between being a golfer, basketball player, or trader, and being a good one on any of the above.

What do you think happens to someone who decides they are going to be a pro golfer? They have no other job, they just decide their income will come from golfing. If they don't make the cut at the PGA then they aren't going to make money. It doesn't matter how hard they try or how much they want it. It doesn't matter how much they enjoy it. What matters is their skill. They either make the cut, or they do not.

And with trading it is 100x harder because not only is your income dependent upon you being a great trader, you also will LOSE money if you are not -- unlike most other analogies.

I stand by my statement. This is a discussion forum on the internet. If every time someone disagreed with someone else they met on the internet, the internet would be a very empty, lonely place. The point is to discuss.

Perhaps you want to explain why you believe what you do, in some more detail. I am stating my opinion after talking to thousands of traders over the years.

Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
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2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
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Old July 21st, 2013, 06:35 PM   #100 (permalink)
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Big Mike View Post
For example, if someone simply has the willpower to be better than Tiger Woods or Michael Jordon, or if someone had the willpower to land on the moon instead of Neil Armstrong, does this mean that they have a chance in hell?

No, it does not.

Willpower alone is not nearly enough. Willpower is a prerequisite. It is not an advantage or edge.

There is only one Tiger, and only one MJ. You mention the best golfer of all time (by the time he's done anyway), and the undisputed greatest basketball player the world has ever known. If you asked if someone had the willpower to be better than Paul Tudor Jones or run a better hedge fund than Ray Dalio, then that would be a more fair comparison (and most of us would say, that would be great, but only a few million a year will do, thanks).

But I don't think anyone here is talking about being at that level. I think that simply preparing for trading alone is something that most people are too lazy to do. I also think that most are too lazy and scared to become introspective enough to face themselves and their faults with a view to transforming themselves (transforming their response to risk, their fear, greed, and all those things that we have to work on). Many are also not confident enough to think for themselves and formulate ideas and so they wind up on the grail quest, following others. I think maybe a select few simply aren't intelligent enough to trade but I think the percentage is small enough to be negligible. Besides that small percentage, I think most people are just unwilling to do the work that is required to really give trading a fair chance, and whether that's lack of willpower, lack of work ethic, or lack of something else, I don't know, but it's definitely true that most will not do it.

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