My Significant Change - Psychology and Money Management | futures.io
futures.io futures trading


My Significant Change
Started: by jaytrades Views / Replies:3,141 / 27
Last Reply: Attachments:1

Welcome to futures.io.

Welcome, Guest!

This forum was established to help traders (especially futures traders) by openly sharing indicators, strategies, methods, trading journals and discussing the psychology of trading.

We are fundamentally different than most other trading forums:
  • We work extremely hard to keep things positive on our forums.
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendor advertising in posts.
  • We firmly believe in openness and encourage sharing. The holy grail is within you, it is not something tangible you can download.
  • We expect our members to participate and become a part of the community. Help yourself by helping others.


You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community. It's free and simple, and we will never resell your private information.

-- Big Mike

Reply
 1  
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
 

My Significant Change

  #21 (permalink)
Trading for Fun
New York, USA
 
Futures Experience: Master
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Mirus/Continuum//FuturePath/Rithmic
Favorite Futures: Currency Futures, Treasury Futures
 
jaytrades's Avatar
 
Posts: 80 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 22 given, 78 received

There is no "should" only what is. When I looked at my P&L, it made me think about money, and for me, I know that a thought about money is really a feeling. Feeling while nice, removes my focus on thought required for analysis of my method. Feeling is an emotion.

Yesterday, I held my day's gains and the record month for a full day, and did a lot of non-trading work. So I'm becoming functional within my limitations.

This morning, i was fully able to accept my stop out pre-market on NQ, then kill for BE, and then re-enter for a gain wiping out those losses. Today I go to the dentist, I already booked a small gain. So I know this is also a distraction, I may call it a day already here at 9:48am.

Thinking about the money and getting distracted from the trading plan would happen to me using any trading instrument.

Index futures have so many correlations with internals and intermarkets that I can daytrade them with a far greater feeling of confidence than any component stock.

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to jaytrades for this post:
 
  #22 (permalink)
Trading for Fun
New York, USA
 
Futures Experience: Master
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Mirus/Continuum//FuturePath/Rithmic
Favorite Futures: Currency Futures, Treasury Futures
 
jaytrades's Avatar
 
Posts: 80 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 22 given, 78 received

I'm still trading. It's been 2 years since my last post and it wasn't easy to re-read the entire thread.

I continued to repeat my loop of small success and larger failure many more times, which is hard to admit, but I didn't want to keep on posting the same thing.

What helped me and continues to help is my habit of stepping back, analyzing everything, researching psych and finding a solution, and taking time to do this.

Learning about myself thru this process is what has kept me going, it certainly wasn't the money or even the potential for gains, which is good since that was slim.

One thought that really keeps me going is that each failure I have now, even tho it freaks me out and I get bent out of shape, is definitely towards the end of the learning curve.

So then, each new solution I add, is one more step towards my goal of consistent trading.

I hardly recognize my current self in all the prior posts here.

Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to jaytrades for this post:
 
  #23 (permalink)
Elite Member
rutherford NJ
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Sierra xtrader Qtrader
Broker/Data: Amp and Optimus and CQG
Favorite Futures: NG ZS CL GC
 
Posts: 269 since May 2013
Thanks: 197 given, 90 received

wow jay from another jay


same name same issues
making slow progress
will ping u and we can share

Reply With Quote
 
  #24 (permalink)
Trading for Fun
New York, USA
 
Futures Experience: Master
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Mirus/Continuum//FuturePath/Rithmic
Favorite Futures: Currency Futures, Treasury Futures
 
jaytrades's Avatar
 
Posts: 80 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 22 given, 78 received

up late since i can't trade any way feeling this much emo

So one of the most recent psych things that helped was realizing that I have already covered some subjects in some chapters in Trading On Target deeper than Adrienne T. wrote about them.

I hadn't read the book cover to cover until my most recent mess up in trading since I had been making decent progress.

When I messed up again, it was time, so I did. I kept at it tho, and took the time to let each chapter sink in, which is different for me in the trading area of my life. I tend to forcefully and hastily apply anything new, but not any more.

A. Didn't jump back in after trouble.
B. Took time to study new psych info.
C. Considered new information to see, over time, if it applied to me.
D. Wrote journal entries regarding the new information.
E. Realized that I had to change the way in which I was processing information and my reaction to it, regarding trading.

(why emo now? because I've been falsely charged for ICE data and it just happens to be the same amount that I'm ahead this month, not much, but it's a start and so I am aware that I'd like to split some logs in the yard with a maul for a few hours...) (since this post the charge has been corrected)


Last edited by jaytrades; April 27th, 2016 at 12:17 AM. Reason: Since my info has broker names I didn't want to let this remain looking forever like they weren't as good as they are...
Reply With Quote
 
  #25 (permalink)
Trading for Fun
New York, USA
 
Futures Experience: Master
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Mirus/Continuum//FuturePath/Rithmic
Favorite Futures: Currency Futures, Treasury Futures
 
jaytrades's Avatar
 
Posts: 80 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 22 given, 78 received

Futures Edge on FIO

Which products do you trade?

 
I still haven't had my unauthorized data charge issue resolved at my broker, so I'm not trading at the moment and have time to add to this. (subsequently corrected)

Another significant change I made recently that took me from red to green was this.

I had heard about, "our stories." This is our history, past events, things that influenced us, and we know them well, and we support them in our mind. Our self-talk is in alignment with our stores. We are limited by them. I never knew much more about it until reading more in T.O.T. book.

I didn't really believe I could change this, but I did and it helped. It's not even that complex.

A. I identified what I was saying to myself when confronted with a challenge.
B. I was surprised that it was exactly what I was attempting to fight against in my psych.
C. I changed my self talk in the area that was holding me back.
D. I began to believe what I was telling myself and the limitation I was giving myself was much less powerful.

an example might be: "I don't have the patience to sit here and watch wave after wave of the price action area I've identified on the chart as an entry area long to set up after many short term failures," can be changed to: "I have the patience to sit here without entering prematurely in this value area as the short term price action fails to hold support levels, until it starts to hold and form a pattern within my strategy to enter at the right time."

I used it in music: "I am tired after 3 minutes of intense brain work in trying to read music and so I'll quit it after 3 mins and get back to improv, which is more satisfying since it sounds and feels better." I've changed this to, "This hurts my brain from the intense concentration required, but I'm going to push thru it and ignore that pain and go for a little longer." So guess what, now I'm reading past my prior plateau because I was able to last just a few minutes longer in my practice drill and now I just ignore that point of pain and now I don't feel it, plus, I'm encouraged by the progress, in only 2 weeks my ability has increased.

I've done this in more than one area in my trading, including my prior night prep and very early morning ability to wake up earlier and begin to prepare earlier. It is extremely simple, subtle, yet powerful.


Last edited by jaytrades; April 27th, 2016 at 12:18 AM. Reason: see prior
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to jaytrades for this post:
 
  #26 (permalink)
Trading for Fun
New York, USA
 
Futures Experience: Master
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Mirus/Continuum//FuturePath/Rithmic
Favorite Futures: Currency Futures, Treasury Futures
 
jaytrades's Avatar
 
Posts: 80 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 22 given, 78 received

My Significant Change

I feel improved. If it wasn't for the challenge to my psychology, I would have quit trading a long time ago, or remained out after the time(s) (lol) that I did quit.

This is gonna be hard to admit, 7 3/4 years... is how long it's been...but again, it's not like I had only one goal.

The financial goal led me on this personal, psychological path of learning to 'know thyself.' Because trading is definitely like The Matrix.

As cliche and corny now after the movie has been over played and then diminished by incomprehensible sequels, it's the often repeated story of overcoming the challenge.

I really can't say enough about my path that will help any one else's path since every single one will be unique.

The reason that every single path is unique is because each of us has been uniquely conditioned from birth to 10 and beyond.

Revealing our conditioning is hard as hell, but not even a requirement since we are able to form new habits over time to replace the existing habits formed by our conditioning. But it definitely helps to at least uncover one of them, then notice how deeply affected we have been from that one, for our example of how powerful that process was and how powerful it is for us to reveal and attempt to change it and then to actually make the change.

And finally, once my psych has been adjusted enough and I've experienced the many new concepts of trading, then the interesting thing is that the technical concepts of trading, that many say are so simple, begin to be revealed in a new light.

I find myself finding essential, but subtle, fine points to rather simple technicals now that I thought I knew, but was overlooking them based on my feeling the need to trade, or whatever my psych challenges were, (some still are...) that got in the way for me to be fully able to decipher the reality of the price action right there on the chart that many others can see just as easy.

Every little thing that I was supposed to have learned, it seems I am relearning now that my psych has improved. This now is helping the bottom line, however there is a far deeper bottom line, and that is this powerful journey that I've been on that is unique but not as uncommon as the many who challenge themselves with many things that require a deeper understanding of one's self.

And THAT is my significant change.

Reply With Quote
The following 3 users say Thank You to jaytrades for this post:
 
  #27 (permalink)
Elite Member
Merced Ca USA
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TDA
Broker/Data: Datek :)
Favorite Futures: Futures
 
shortride's Avatar
 
Posts: 13 since Apr 2013
Thanks: 31 given, 2 received

encouraging/discouraging

After reading your journal, I am both encouraged and discouraged.

Encouraged that you have made such progress, discouraged that it took so much time and work.

I see myself in a lot of what you wrote, I too have a strategy that I believe gives me the edge I need to make money trading. However, as you, I struggle to follow my strategy. I too, feel that my problem is psychological but had no idea it might be that hard to cure.

So far, the biggest help, has been to use "on demand" (TOS) during the weekend, trying to trade exactly according to my strategy. Seeing the positive results there, helps me to follow my strategy closer in real trading during the week.

My plan is to keep doing that until I become laser focused on my strategy.

Thank you for taking the time to post your journal, I sure it has helped many including me.

“Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.
Reply With Quote
 
  #28 (permalink)
Elite Member
Fort McMurray, AB Canada
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: NT, MT4
Broker/Data: Continuum
Favorite Futures: ZB, ZN
 
spideysteve's Avatar
 
Posts: 93 since Mar 2015
Thanks: 150 given, 90 received

4 years of posts and it can sum up where many are still at, myself included

Keep at it, and keep posting

Reply With Quote

Reply



futures.io > > > My Significant Change

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Upcoming Webinars and Events (4:30PM ET unless noted)

2016 True Edge Awards: Voting is open until Jan 21!

Now
 

Bookmap New Indicator Panel, Cumulative Delta, Order Flow demo

Jan 17
 

An Afternoon with FIO member Massive l

Elite only

Leo Murphy: Making sense of Technical Analysis and Random Walk

Elite only
 

FuturesTrader71: Ask Me Anything

Elite only
     

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Nasdaq Expects 'Significant' New Costs for Facebook IPO Quick Summary News and Current Events 0 August 3rd, 2012 05:30 PM
Is there an indicator that shows price change averaged with volume change intrabar? Itchymoku NinjaTrader 8 July 31st, 2012 08:40 PM
Trading and your significant other DarkPoolTrading Traders Hideout 2 June 24th, 2012 10:34 AM
Markets at Start of Significant Downturn: Marc Faber Quick Summary News and Current Events 0 April 8th, 2012 09:00 PM
Significant Other & Trading adrian Off-Topic 10 January 22nd, 2010 06:37 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:12 AM.

no new posts
Page generated 2017-01-17 in 0.15 seconds with 19 queries on phoenix via your IP 23.23.37.116