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Which level of trader are YOU?
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Created: by bluemele Attachments:1

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Which level of trader are YOU?

  #41 (permalink)
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tradetree View Post
I have a general question and I hope it is not too far off topic. For members on this thread that are not yet profitable, have you taken one of the documented strategies that are on this list (other threads) and tried them? I have my own strategies that are profitable, but I've recently wondered why people are not profitable with the help that is out there? There are whole threads on BigMike's devoted to one particular method and they are supposed to be making profits. So why can't everyone just jump on those?

I think the answer is that there are very few (if any) consistent, mechanical systems that are complete on the forums I've read (i.e., which have when to trade, when not to trade, how much to trade, entry, exit w/ loss, exit w/profit all specified objectively). Any of those variables will affect a system's performance and so just taking 2 or 3 of those variables from someone else's method will not necessarily reproduce their results. Also, of the method's I've followed I haven't seen one yet that hasn't evolved over the time I've watched the practitioner trade their method.

I think that to trade any incomplete system, you really need to know a lot more than what is covered by the system - i.e., you need to know how to trade. Other's systems can be a great learning environment for getting the experience necessary to trade profitably but by then you have essentially developed your own version of a given system.

Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty. - Frank Herbert
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  #42 (permalink)
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Surly View Post
I think the answer is that there are very few (if any) consistent, mechanical systems that are complete on the forums I've read (i.e., which have when to trade, when not to trade, how much to trade, entry, exit w/ loss, exit w/profit all specified objectively). Any of those variables will affect a system's performance and so just taking 2 or 3 of those variables from someone else's method will not necessarily reproduce their results. Also, of the method's I've followed I haven't seen one yet that hasn't evolved over the time I've watched the practitioner trade their method.

I think that to trade any incomplete system, you really need to know a lot more than what is covered by the system - i.e., you need to know how to trade. Other's systems can be a great learning environment for getting the experience necessary to trade profitably but by then you have essentially developed your own version of a given system.

@Surly,

Amen. That is what I wanted to say!

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  #43 (permalink)
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I agree with others in that it is going to be really difficult to trade someone ELSE's discretionary system. If one does make it profitable at the end, it is likely they won't trade it the same way the creator trades it, and it's not 'the system' that makes the adapter profitable, but the guy himself.

This is also why I think it is next to pointless to PAY for a discretionary system from someone. Never mind the fact that you never really know if the vendor is actually a trader that makes a living trading what they are selling, but even still.... in the end the purchaser will have to come up with whatever logic necessary to turn that system into something that will generate a profit. So what's the point of paying the money?

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  #44 (permalink)
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forrestang View Post
I agree with others in that it is going to be really difficult to trade someone ELSE's discretionary system. If one does make it profitable at the end, it is likely they won't trade it the same way the creator trades it, and it's not 'the system' that makes the adapter profitable, but the guy himself.

This is also why I think it is next to pointless to PAY for a discretionary system from someone. Never mind the fact that you never really know if the vendor is actually a trader that makes a living trading what they are selling, but even still.... in the end the purchaser will have to come up with whatever logic necessary to turn that system into something that will generate a profit. So what's the point of paying the money?

So, would you pay for a non-discretionary system?

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  #45 (permalink)
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bluemele View Post
So, would you pay for a non-discretionary system?

ONLY if I could validate it myself first.

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  #46 (permalink)
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I wanted to make another point about "other people's systems" (OPS?). The point I was trying to make earlier is NOT that you can't trade another person's system - just that none of the system's I've seen here or elsewhere on forums are complete - in the sense that all aspects of the system are specified and/or the system hasn't changed over time as the practitioner develops their methodology.

I actually think that trading another person's system (assuming it is a complete system) is a very good thing to do to learn how to trade. It helps you practice discipline, it teaches you about variance, it shows you how fallible you can be even when you have a clear (and complete) set of rules to follow, and over time it will teach you about how markets move (because you will be observing the markets). All these things are useful and following another person's system gives you a great context to learn/practice these things.

Of course we rarely do what's good for us... (of course I'm only referring to myself here...)

Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty. - Frank Herbert
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  #47 (permalink)
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The problem with trading someone else's system is that you won't be able to trade it unless you thoroughly believe in it. You need to test it and then add your own flavors.

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  #48 (permalink)
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Like mentioned before, systems need experience.

Systems will evolve.

The flavor of the month is Perry G's system which seems to be a knock-off of shadow traders. I would bet that his system will change and evolve. Heck, since the seminar he gave it has evolved. Perry has been trading for quite a while and has built a discretionary system that others require post after post to comprehend. Before Perry it was Sharky and among all the boards there are hundreds of similar systems/threads.

So, the question is why can't you trade someone else's 'system' and be profitable. Because to me, systems are organic which requires a certain type of 'feed' to grow and not die.

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  #49 (permalink)
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I recalled finding this passage in a book I read about a year ago about forex.

But sadly, I only remembered its content, not the author nor the title.

The other parts of the book taught about price action patterns which I found interesting otherwise, the book was pretty basic, teaching you about the basics of forex, spread, broker, what is leverage etc, fundamental analysis, the details and characteristics of each forex pair, and some basic chart patterns.

It's a beginner's book.

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  #50 (permalink)
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Nasdin94 View Post
I recalled finding this passage in a book I read about a year ago about forex.

But sadly, I only remembered its content, not the author nor the title.

The other parts of the book taught about price action patterns which I found interesting otherwise, the book was pretty basic, teaching you about the basics of forex, spread, broker, what is leverage etc, fundamental analysis, the details and characteristics of each forex pair, and some basic chart patterns.

It's a beginner's book.

And? I am not saying I wrote it or I came up with it...

You didn't 'glean' anything from it?

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