The key is geometric growth enabled by low draw downs - Psychology and Money Management | futures io social day trading
futures io futures trading


The key is geometric growth enabled by low draw downs
Updated: Views / Replies:3,074 / 13
Created: by liquidcci Attachments:2

Welcome to futures io.

(If you already have an account, login at the top of the page)

futures io is the largest futures trading community on the planet, with over 90,000 members. At futures io, our goal has always been and always will be to create a friendly, positive, forward-thinking community where members can openly share and discuss everything the world of trading has to offer. The community is one of the friendliest you will find on any subject, with members going out of their way to help others. Some of the primary differences between futures io and other trading sites revolve around the standards of our community. Those standards include a code of conduct for our members, as well as extremely high standards that govern which partners we do business with, and which products or services we recommend to our members.

At futures io, our focus is on quality education. No hype, gimmicks, or secret sauce. The truth is: trading is hard. To succeed, you need to surround yourself with the right support system, educational content, and trading mentors Ė all of which you can find on futures io, utilizing our social trading environment.

With futures io, you can find honest trading reviews on brokers, trading rooms, indicator packages, trading strategies, and much more. Our trading review process is highly moderated to ensure that only genuine users are allowed, so you donít need to worry about fake reviews.

We are fundamentally different than most other trading sites:
  • We are here to help. Just let us know what you need.
  • We work extremely hard to keep things positive in our community.
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendors advertising in posts.
  • We firmly believe in and encourage sharing. The holy grail is within you, we can help you find it.
  • We expect our members to participate and become a part of the community. Help yourself by helping others.

You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community.  It's free and simple.

-- Big Mike, Site Administrator

Reply
 2  
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
 

The key is geometric growth enabled by low draw downs

  #11 (permalink)
Elite Member
Paradise, USA
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Big Charts
Favorite Futures: E-mini, Forex, Futures, Equities, Options
 
rtrade's Avatar
 
Posts: 502 since Nov 2010
Thanks: 578 given, 375 received


liquidcci View Post
I may do something like start with 10k on 1 contract and then increase per 1k. What this does is give chance for delta to work its magic while protecting my front end from draw downs. Not exactly what I do as per market per strategy things change but kind of how I approach it.

So let me understand what you are saying...with your automated bot system, you just have to reach your $1000.00 per month goal. In other words, you can have a losing day or week, but provided you reach the 1k or better goal at the end of the month you're on course....see attachment if correct.

"Faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." --- "Therefore, I Believe it and I will see it. And every day and in every way, I am healthier, wealthier, and wiser."
Attached Files
Register to download File Type: xlsx Liqcci.xlsx (9.5 KB, 18 views)
Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to rtrade for this post:
 
  #12 (permalink)
Elite Member
Austin, TX
 
Futures Experience: Master
Platform: ninjatrader, r-trader
Favorite Futures: CL, NG, TF, NQ, YM, GC, ES
 
liquidcci's Avatar
 
Posts: 862 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 609 given, 1,051 received


rtrade View Post
So let me understand what you are saying...with your automated bot system, you just have to reach your $1000.00 per month goal. In other words, you can have a losing day or week, but provided you reach the 1k or better goal at the end of the month you're on course....see attachment if correct.

Your spreadsheet essentially captures it. However it is not measured in months goals. If your delta is set to 1k like in your spreadsheet you would bump from contract to contract every time that 1k delta is exceeded. That could take 1 day it could take 2 months etc. Time is not a factor.

Also notice how as you increase in contracts that the dollar amount you are trading per contract. Under your spreadsheet just for an example take the 10k out to start and just start with 1k. You start with 1k per contract and by the time you hit 24 contracts you are at something like 11k per contract.

The frontend is where you are at highest risk but you are also essentially risking the least money. Once you get up in contracts you have a much larger cushion to protect your gains. This is why I really like fixed ratio. What I do to protect myself on front end is start an account like you with around 10k so it buffers my frontend until geometric growth can take over.

A real key to this is setting your delta correctly based on historical draw downs. If you set it to low you will constantly be going up then back down in contracts. You can also set a rate of decrease that is explained in the book I mentioned that can control when you bump down in contract. I usually set my rate of decrease the same. If my delta is 1k then I move up a contract when met that delta. But if I draw down more than 1k per contract I would bump down a contract. By making sure I don't set my delta to tight it I don't have to bump down more than one contract very often. In fact very rare would have to bump more than 1 contract before getting out of draw down.

"The day I became a winning trader was the day it became boring. Daily losses no longer bother me and daily wins no longer excited me. Took years of pain and busting a few accounts before finally got my mind right. I survived the darkness within and now just chillax and let my black box do the work."
Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to liquidcci for this post:
 
  #13 (permalink)
Membership Temporarily Revoked
NYC
 
Futures Experience: None
Platform: graph paper and pencil
Favorite Futures: harp
 
dutchbookmaker's Avatar
 
Posts: 187 since Dec 2010
Thanks: 9 given, 107 received


Amazon.com: The Trading Game: Playing by the Numbers to Make Millions (9780471316985): Ryan Jones: Books

Going to have to read it again. This is certainly a book you want to own though. I have to admit I'm shocked this book is not wider regarded.

My biggest problem though is with his ideas on probability and how he uses it to put down Ralph Vince. It doesn't really make any sense. He clearly has no clue of bayesian stats.

liquidcci, you should check out Ganchrow's post on the sbr forum. He is a quant modeller at a hedge fund but sbr is for sports betting.
Kelly fraction - Sports Betting Forum & Handicapping

Reply With Quote
 
  #14 (permalink)
Elite Member
Austin, TX
 
Futures Experience: Master
Platform: ninjatrader, r-trader
Favorite Futures: CL, NG, TF, NQ, YM, GC, ES
 
liquidcci's Avatar
 
Posts: 862 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 609 given, 1,051 received


dutchbookmaker View Post
Amazon.com: The Trading Game: Playing by the Numbers to Make Millions (9780471316985): Ryan Jones: Books

Going to have to read it again. This is certainly a book you want to own though. I have to admit I'm shocked this book is not wider regarded.

My biggest problem though is with his ideas on probability and how he uses it to put down Ralph Vince. It doesn't really make any sense. He clearly has no clue of bayesian stats.

liquidcci, you should check out Ganchrow's post on the sbr forum. He is a quant modeller at a hedge fund but sbr is for sports betting.
Kelly fraction - Sports Betting Forum & Handicapping

Thanks I will check out the post. As far as Ralph Vince goes I can't really comment as have not used his methods extensively although I am familiar with them. I think every method has strengths and weaknesses and different systems can benefit from different methods.

Fixed ratio is weaker on the front end and strengthens as your account grows. But I overcome that by starting with a higher balance than my delta. I do like the way it protects your capital on the higher end. I can stomach losing a 5k or 10k account more than I could if I grew an account to 300k and lost it. But done right don't even have lose a 5k account.

"The day I became a winning trader was the day it became boring. Daily losses no longer bother me and daily wins no longer excited me. Took years of pain and busting a few accounts before finally got my mind right. I survived the darkness within and now just chillax and let my black box do the work."
Reply With Quote

Reply



futures io > > > The key is geometric growth enabled by low draw downs

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Upcoming Webinars and Events (4:30PM ET unless noted)

Jigsaw Trading: TBA

Elite only

FuturesTrader71: TBA

Elite only

NinjaTrader: TBA

Jan 18

RandBots: TBA

Jan 23

GFF Brokers & CME Group: Futures & Bitcoin

Elite only

Adam Grimes: TBA

Elite only

Ran Aroussi: TBA

Elite only
     

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Get all draw objects dimkdimk NinjaTrader Programming 18 February 14th, 2015 12:46 PM
Little help with Draw Region jram77 NinjaTrader Programming 14 September 26th, 2013 12:21 AM
China to Stay a Low-Key Gambler in Middle East Quick Summary News and Current Events 0 March 1st, 2011 03:00 AM
Job Growth Too Low, Deficit Must Be Controlled: Bernanke Quick Summary News and Current Events 1 February 9th, 2011 01:36 PM
3 bar high/low entry maintain active order until 3 bar high/low in opposite direction mrticks NinjaTrader Programming 8 November 13th, 2009 08:44 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:49 PM.

Copyright © 2017 by futures io, s.a., Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama, +507 833-9432, info@futures.io
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice.
There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
no new posts
Page generated 2017-12-16 in 0.11 seconds with 20 queries on phoenix via your IP 54.227.51.103