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MultiCharts vs. NinjaTrader
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MultiCharts vs. NinjaTrader

  #21 (permalink)
Hi Mom!
Bridgeport, Ct
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Sierra
Favorite Futures: Gold, Oil
 
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el oso View Post
Thank you everyone for the responses, really helpful to get some recent data points. Does anyone know ballpark how many users MC has? NT says they have 40,000 traders using their platform, which sounds strangely low considering their active community. Also, is NT's software stability still an issue in the latest version? UmBillyCord, you mentioned the application freezing - how often does that happen?

I would also check out Sierra Chart before you make a decision either way.

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  #22 (permalink)
Elite Member
Cary, NC
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: MC, NT, Python, R
Broker/Data: FXCM, IB, Oanda, IQFeed
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Yes - MultiCharts has Time & Sales support


Blash View Post

Yes - I've never used it so can't vouch for it's usefulness. Attached is a T&S window for Oanda EUR/USD I just pulled up - details @ https://www.multicharts.com/trading-software/index.php/Time_and_Sales.

-Guy

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  #23 (permalink)
Elite Member
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Platform: NT8,NT7,TWS,FOREX.COM app
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PeakGrowth View Post
Pay someone lol. But I have to say knowing how to program certainly kicks ass, it's like being in the matrix and you see the girl in the red dress everywhere and you scoff at the plebs who have to do repetitive work when you can oh so easily automate their life's work in a heart beat. Am I evil? Probably.

Anyhow off topic, unless you are programing some seriously complex algo I doubt you would run into problems.

Also would be interesting to see if an MC rep pops up to try get your business, if not...


I did.....lol..... Rancho Jigsaw CDA neoHarmonics Price Squawk ... But learned enough by hacking futures.io (formerly BMT) stuff to make risk reward trade management type stuff for myself... And data mining with Excel to pull out a few probabilities which I need to update.....

Evil has no "outward existence" it's just the want of good or quality attributes same way cold is the absence of heat and shadow the absence of light. It's a state of immaturity.

Peace out
Ron


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It is an axiomatic fact that while you meditate you are speaking with your own spirit. In that state of mind you put certain questions to your spirit and the spirit answers: the light breaks forth and the reality is revealed.
The steed of this Valley is pain; and if there be no pain this journey will never end.
Buy Low And Sell High (read left to right or right to left....lol)

Last edited by Blash; July 30th, 2015 at 10:12 PM. Reason: corrected spelling
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  #24 (permalink)
Elite Member
Norwich, UK
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
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el oso View Post
Hello fellow futures.io (formerly BMT)ers,

Also, does anyone who has knowledge of both MC and TradeStation have an opinion on whether MC is worth the additional money? (assuming that I would be making enough trades to waive TS' monthly platform fees).

Thank you all for your time.

el oso

(by no means exchaustive) things I consider good about one or the other:

1. NinjaTrader:

Pros:
Huge support here on futures.io (formerly BMT) - so plenty of resources. A lot of enthusiasm through its adopters and willingess to help & contribute to the community.
They're very responsive on their forum, and it's an open support forum with very useful past threads.
They have built-in free EOD data for most of the instruments you'd at least want to start with, or you'd ever trade. Kinetick EOD is a good quality feed, a nice perk that anyone else doesn't have.
Theoretically, if you want only EOD data, you could build & backtest everything in NT without spending a dime.
Flexibility to build on top of it with integration in .NET, Visual Studio, etc
They are receptive to feature-requests, and do acknowledge bugs, issues with the product.
Some of the best things I like in NT:
One feature that I appreciate in Walk-Forward, they'll actually give you stats on the OOS samples ... great edge compared to MC, if you're deep in backtesting, and you don't want to "manually" do stats in excel/alternatives.
Each Walk-Forward time-frame gives you the component trades ... you can actually see the trades on a map ... in MC this does not exist, Walk-Forward in MC is as blind as a bat in terms of component trades or OOS-only stats.
Superior market replay - they provide the replay data up to tick level - very nice. This is for the Pros section.
Nonetheless, this is countered by some simple missing features in the replay, which kills half of it's potential. Imagine you have a a cone of icecream in front of you - but you have to eat it with your hands tied at your back ...

Cons:
Very, and I mean, veeeery long release cycle. You might get to know your grandchildren before NT gets through two more big releases. Nonetheless, they have multiple small releases with incremental smaller features/brokers/data-feeds, bug fixing.
Some-what closed road-map. You don't really know what's "cooking" under in their development team (at least, by comparison to Multicharts).
I must say it's somewhat less robust than MC, both in touch & feel and in speed of execution/response time. Example: Backtesting - choosing genetic algoritm testing, rarely produced noticeable differences to the non-genetic, as opposed to MC, where I see noticeable results.
Lack of native (considered now to be standard) features like Volume Profile, Cumulative Delta, etc.


Multicharts:
Pros:
I always liked their open PM platform - one can see the bugs, can log/open FRs, can comment and can really feel they contribute to the development of the platform.
Nice touch & feel, good execution, rarely has stability issues and let's not forget the Multicharts.NET platform which gives the same level of integration with c#/.NET/Visual Studio platform.
Support is very responsive and helpful.
There follow some inovative directions in the platform development that do surprise you. I like the high degree of inovation, and it's nice to see major features being implemented each 2-3 years.

Cons:
Lacks something similar to Kinetick free EOD.
Their Backtesting/Walk-Forward engine is a good start, but does appear like an old car that hasn't been serviced for the last 5 years, that starts to rust and needs some attention. You do feel that development is 100% focused in one (or few) direction(s), and multiple additional areas are not touched, or not properly integrated with the new features.
They may be very inovative, but this does present a risk. In my opinion, they completely messed up the Volume Profile, making it very inflexible compared to other implementations.
Market replay is a pain as well ... you don't have order execution in the market-replay and there is no volume-profile while doing replay.



So, in summary, you kind of have have two opposites in some respect.

I may be off in some of the above, and stand to be corrected. And it's my intention to learn from what I've missed or done wrong, and not to criticise anyone, but that was my experience with the two.

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  #25 (permalink)
Market Wizard
virginia
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: ninja
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el oso View Post
Hello fellow futures.io (formerly BMT)ers,

...
From the trial, I am overall quite satisfied with the product, but as I've done additional research on this forum and elsewhere, there are a couple "red flags" that are giving me pause before I make the purchase (am looking to buy a lifetime license), so was hoping to get your thoughts.

...
Thank you all for your time.

el oso

Here is a quick summary, BM coded many indicators for NT then moved to MC. He coded many indicators for MC then moved to SC. There you go.

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  #26 (permalink)
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cory View Post
Here is a quick summary, BM coded many indicators for NT then moved to MC. He coded many indicators for MC then moved to SC. There you go.

Here is the funny part, I've never written a single indicator for Sierra. Everything I need is built-in... Strange, since I'm an avid programmer. But the truth!

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  #27 (permalink)
DabbaDo
Indianapolis/IN
 
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Big Mike View Post
Here is the funny part, I've never written a single indicator for Sierra. Everything I need is built-in... Strange, since I'm an avid programmer. But the truth!

Sent from my phone

That is an amazing statement that will cause me to give Sierra another look. Somehow I thought you had left Sierra, mostly, for your own platform. Are the SpooAnalysis charts you post from Sierra?

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  #28 (permalink)
Patience my young padawan
Houston, TX/USA
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader TWS Barchart
Broker/Data: IB / IB
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@el oso

I'll add 2 points to MultiCharts although I have not played with it as much as I have with Ninja:

- Open Interest data is not supported by Ninja and it is supported by MultiCharts (in case you wish to use this data...)
- With Ninja, spread (calendar) between two contracts can only be plotted if you setup the Merge Policy to "Do not merge" which you cannot do automatically from a strategy or indicator. I still need to verify if this is easier with MultiCharts...

I think the major plus with Ninjatrader is Ninjascript which is awesome for programming indicators and strategies and that Kinetick EOD is free and the basic service is relatively not expensive.

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  #29 (permalink)
Patience my young padawan
Houston, TX/USA
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader TWS Barchart
Broker/Data: IB / IB
Favorite Futures: ES & looking into commodities
 
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Posts: 314 since Nov 2014
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On second thought I might just stick to Ninja. I like the environment of MultiCharts but I just got too used to NinjaScript. That is really Ninjatrader major advantage: Letting you play with it without purchasing.

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  #30 (permalink)
Elite Member
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Futures Experience: None
Platform: NT8,NT7,TWS,FOREX.COM app
Broker/Data: InteractiveBrokers, NinjaTrader Brokerage FOREX.COM, IQFeed
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ElChacal View Post
@el oso



- With Ninja, spread (calendar) between two contracts can only be plotted if you setup the Merge Policy to "Do not merge" which you cannot do automatically from a strategy or indicator. I still need to verify if this is easier with MultiCharts...




One thing that can be done is this: with IQFeed data you can power both NT7 and NT8 (NT8 beta, which I am doing currently and of course once in full release) on same machine and say set NT7 policy to "Do not merge" for spreads and NT8 how you regularly want it. Just an idea.

Ron


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It is an axiomatic fact that while you meditate you are speaking with your own spirit. In that state of mind you put certain questions to your spirit and the spirit answers: the light breaks forth and the reality is revealed.
The steed of this Valley is pain; and if there be no pain this journey will never end.
Buy Low And Sell High (read left to right or right to left....lol)
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