Futures, Options on Futures, and the meaning of life - futures io
futures io



Futures, Options on Futures, and the meaning of life


Discussion in Options

Updated
      Top Posters
    1. looks_one cordoba with 1 posts (0 thanks)
    2. looks_two bithead007 with 1 posts (0 thanks)
    3. looks_3 SMCJB with 1 posts (2 thanks)
    4. looks_4 SBtrader82 with 1 posts (0 thanks)
    1. trending_up 1,689 views
    2. thumb_up 2 thanks given
    3. group 4 followers
    1. forum 3 posts
    2. attach_file 0 attachments




Welcome to futures io: the largest futures trading community on the planet, with well over 125,000 members
  • Genuine reviews from real traders, not fake reviews from stealth vendors
  • Quality education from leading professional traders
  • We are a friendly, helpful, and positive community
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendors advertising in posts
  • We are here to help, just let us know what you need
You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community.  It's free and simple.

-- Big Mike, Site Administrator

(If you already have an account, login at the top of the page)

 
Search this Thread
 

Futures, Options on Futures, and the meaning of life

(login for full post details)
  #1 (permalink)
bithead007
Denver Colorado
 
 
Posts: 3 since Dec 2019
Thanks: 1 given, 1 received

I am interested in trading futures and options on futures (risk-defined trades like iron condors, etc). TDAmeritrade lets me do all that in one account, along with my options on equities stuff, but the futures commissions aren't what I'd call inexpensive, but the platform costs are zero. So still, I'm making money there so I'm not complaining.

But I think there is more out there, so I got set up with a broker and CQG QTrader. As a bonus, there might be potential down the road to have other people use my trading success as an advisor. So I thought that might be cool as a career potential kind of thing, and so I did tons of paperwork. That was all fun and games until my first CQG order failed, whereupon I asked and the broker told me I'd have to call the order desk to place a trade containing any short option. What? This wasn't specified in the agreement paperwork, and I've never called a broker to place a trade, so not doing that. To top it off, when I called the clearing firm and asked what other brokers I could use, they wouldn't give me a list and said someone from compliance would have to call me back and they haven't.

So I found an article online and started calling. Tradeovate has no ability to do iron condors. Infinity Futures has a full voicemail box. At this point I made a drink. It's like I've landed in a hot tub time machine and gone back to 1890 or something. Why is this so difficult to find a competitive commission provider and choose a platform? All I want to do is buy/sell futures contracts and execute defined-risk futures options trades. I'm not asking for a polished rock from Mars here.

Any opinions welcome. I don't want to change platforms every year, but I'm not opposed to it either. I was going to take a look at NinjaTrader next. I don't think there is any potential to be an advisor down the road with them, but maybe that's just too much to ask.

Thanks,
CJ

Reply With Quote

Can you help answer these questions
from other members on futures io?
TD Sequential for NT or MW?
Platforms and Indicators
Portfolio Management Tool/Software
Psychology and Money Management
TradingView help in improving Anchored Vwap
Platforms and Indicators
Holding futures overnight
Traders Hideout
Experience with AGN (Introducing Broker)
Brokers
 
 
(login for full post details)
  #2 (permalink)
 SMCJB 
Legendary Market Wizard
Houston, TX
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Trading Technologies
Broker: Primary Advantage Futures. Also ED&F and Tradestation
Trading: Primarily Energy but also a little GE, GC, SI & Bitcoin
 
Posts: 4,205 since Dec 2013
Thanks: 3,519 given, 8,356 received

Re: Brokers and Short Options
As you are probably aware buying an option has limited downside and unlimited upside and selling an option has limited upside and unlimited downside. Because of this some brokers will not allow any short options at all while others may be very restrictive. While this may be broker dependent it is also probably very account size/net worth/financial guarantee dependent.

For what its worth I have sold futures options with Advantage, ED&F Man and Interactive Brokers, and sold stock options with Tradestation, so I know they all allow it. Have no idea how my financial situation compares to yours though. There are several brokers here that can probably give additional insight into this, and what they personally offer. @CannonTrading @FuturesTrader71 @mattz

Re: Platforms and Option Strategies
Most (all?) exchanges who list options also list option strategies. Some but not all software give you access to those strategies. Imagine the 100 call is quoted 10/11 and the 110 call is quoted 5/6. Simple calculations will tell you that the 100/110 call spread is 4/6 but if you were to quote the 100/110 call spread as a strategy you will probably find it is 4.5/5.5 maybe even 4.75/5.25. Also if you execute as a strategy there is no leg risk. Some platforms give you the ability to execute these 'exchange' strategies and some don't. Other platforms may allow you to create your own spreads (ie the 4/6 market) while others won't even allow you to do that and will force you to enter two discretely different orders. Platform functionality can vary greatly. I would assume that you get what you pay for this in category, but have little experience so could be completely wrong.

Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to SMCJB for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #3 (permalink)
 SBtrader82 
Rovigo (ITALY)
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: SierraChart, MotiveWave
Broker: Rithmic, Dorman, Interactive Brokers
Trading: Emini, Nasdaq, DAX, Bund, IBEX
 
SBtrader82's Avatar
 
Posts: 459 since Feb 2018
Thanks: 177 given, 1,043 received



bithead007 View Post
I am interested in trading futures and options on futures (risk-defined trades like iron condors, etc). TDAmeritrade lets me do all that in one account, along with my options on equities stuff, but the futures commissions aren't what I'd call inexpensive, but the platform costs are zero. So still, I'm making money there so I'm not complaining.

But I think there is more out there, so I got set up with a broker and CQG QTrader. As a bonus, there might be potential down the road to have other people use my trading success as an advisor. So I thought that might be cool as a career potential kind of thing, and so I did tons of paperwork. That was all fun and games until my first CQG order failed, whereupon I asked and the broker told me I'd have to call the order desk to place a trade containing any short option. What? This wasn't specified in the agreement paperwork, and I've never called a broker to place a trade, so not doing that. To top it off, when I called the clearing firm and asked what other brokers I could use, they wouldn't give me a list and said someone from compliance would have to call me back and they haven't.

So I found an article online and started calling. Tradeovate has no ability to do iron condors. Infinity Futures has a full voicemail box. At this point I made a drink. It's like I've landed in a hot tub time machine and gone back to 1890 or something. Why is this so difficult to find a competitive commission provider and choose a platform? All I want to do is buy/sell futures contracts and execute defined-risk futures options trades. I'm not asking for a polished rock from Mars here.

Any opinions welcome. I don't want to change platforms every year, but I'm not opposed to it either. I was going to take a look at NinjaTrader next. I don't think there is any potential to be an advisor down the road with them, but maybe that's just too much to ask.

Thanks,
CJ

I am not an expert on options but for sure the followin platforms allow you to trade both options and futures:
1) ThinkOrSwim (this is the standard platform for options traders, it is very advanced and you can trade anything)
2) Tradestation
3) ProRealtime (this is not well known in US but in Europe we use it a lot, you can trade futures and options. It's a French company and has a special deal with Interactive Brokers with reduced fees)

I hope it helps

Follow me on Twitter Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #4 (permalink)
 cordoba 
Essen, Germany
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Quantower
Trading: Futures Spreads and Options on Futures
 
Posts: 28 since Feb 2016
Thanks: 14 given, 46 received


SBtrader82 View Post
I am not an expert on options but for sure the followin platforms allow you to trade both options and futures:
1) ThinkOrSwim (this is the standard platform for options traders, it is very advanced and you can trade anything)
2) Tradestation
3) ProRealtime (this is not well known in US but in Europe we use it a lot, you can trade futures and options. It's a French company and has a special deal with Interactive Brokers with reduced fees)

It is not the possible to trade options on futures with a standard TradeStation account. To do so, it is necessary to use their Futures + platform, which requires setting up a separate account: https://www.tradestation.com:443/platforms-and-tools/futures-plus/ Futures + is a rebranding of the TT web platform, from Trading Technologies.

ThinkorSwim is indeed popular with equity options traders but the OP wasn't referring to equity options. ThinkorSwim charges $2.25 one-way for a futures option trade. This is 50% more expensive than doing the same trade on TradeStation Futures + and 164% more expensive than placing the trade via Interactive Brokers. (All prices referenced are net of exchange and regulatory fees).

AMP supports a range of platforms that are actually relevant to those trading options on futures and they have reasonable pricing: https://www.ampfutures.com/options-trading-platforms/

Reply With Quote


futures io Trading Community Traders Hideout Options > Futures, Options on Futures, and the meaning of life


Last Updated on January 6, 2021


Upcoming Webinars and Events
 

NinjaTrader Indicator Challenge!

Ongoing

Your Charts Should Speak To You w/Bob Cometta

Elite only
 

Our 12-year anniversary w/ $$,$$$ prizes (check soon)

August
     



Copyright © 2021 by futures io, s.a., Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama, Ph: +507 833-9432 (Panama and Intl), +1 888-312-3001 (USA and Canada), info@futures.io
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice.
There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
no new posts