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Can identify move,can have a good stop loss,but still not consistent with profit.
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Created: by himanshuthakur11 Attachments:0

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Can identify move,can have a good stop loss,but still not consistent with profit.

  #1 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
dharamshala Himachal pradesh/India
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: amibroker,metastocks
Favorite Futures: futures
 
Posts: 10 since Jun 2017
Thanks: 0 given, 3 received

Can identify move,can have a good stop loss,but still not consistent with profit.

hello friends, hope you all are having a great time.
I have been trading for more than a year now. That includes me buying just single stocks etc etc. as i don't have much funds to risk it all in the beginning. I also did demo trading. Started real trading only once my demo funds were back to green after initial loss. Started futures trading then. Mostly intraday.

I worked on strategies to find stocks that can give move on the next day. worked on the levels to trade on. and then finally about my entry ,exit, stop loss positions etc.
I tried it by trading very fewer shares for a week. Realized and corrected some crucial mistakes during those mistakes. I controlled my losses to a very good amount on a bad day after these sessions.
NOW,
1. I can identify stocks that can give move for the next day. (not all of them)
2. The stop loss I decide results to be correct for me most of the time. ie; whenever price will hit the stop loss it will go further to that direction afterwards. So stop loss prevents much of my loss.
3.THE PROBLEM: very much consistent with the losses. Stop loss prevents much of my loss but hits most of the time. This results in controlled but consistent loss which actually results in a bad loss overall.

I want to ask if I need to go back study and analyse the way i select the stocks for the next day or should i do the same with the actual strategy which takes place during the intraday entry and exit.
Or is there anything other than these that I am missing to analyse.

I Will be very thankful for any advice on this. Thanks

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  #2 (permalink)
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  #3 (permalink)
Market Wizard
Linz Austria
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: Zaner360, TWS, Vantage
Broker/Data: DeCarley, IAB, RJO
Favorite Futures: Commodities
 
Posts: 1,076 since Nov 2014
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himanshuthakur11 View Post
hello friends, hope you all are having a great time.
I have been trading for more than a year now. That includes me buying just single stocks etc etc. as i don't have much funds to risk it all in the beginning. I also did demo trading. Started real trading only once my demo funds were back to green after initial loss. Started futures trading then. Mostly intraday.

I worked on strategies to find stocks that can give move on the next day. worked on the levels to trade on. and then finally about my entry ,exit, stop loss positions etc.
I tried it by trading very fewer shares for a week. Realized and corrected some crucial mistakes during those mistakes. I controlled my losses to a very good amount on a bad day after these sessions.
NOW,
1. I can identify stocks that can give move for the next day. (not all of them)
2. The stop loss I decide results to be correct for me most of the time. ie; whenever price will hit the stop loss it will go further to that direction afterwards. So stop loss prevents much of my loss.
3.THE PROBLEM: very much consistent with the losses. Stop loss prevents much of my loss but hits most of the time. This results in controlled but consistent loss which actually results in a bad loss overall.

I want to ask if I need to go back study and analyse the way i select the stocks for the next day or should i do the same with the actual strategy which takes place during the intraday entry and exit.
Or is there anything other than these that I am missing to analyse.

I Will be very thankful for any advice on this. Thanks

You posted in the forum for options on futures, and I am not sure if anybody here can help you. There is an own forum for stocks - you should try it there.

Good luck !

Best regards, Myrrdin

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  #4 (permalink)
Market Wizard
Germany
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Other
Favorite Futures: ES, YM, 6E
 
Posts: 2,587 since Feb 2013
Thanks: 4,766 given, 6,315 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary


himanshuthakur11 View Post
hello friends, hope you all are having a great time.
I have been trading for more than a year now. That includes me buying just single stocks etc etc. as i don't have much funds to risk it all in the beginning. I also did demo trading. Started real trading only once my demo funds were back to green after initial loss. Started futures trading then. Mostly intraday.

I worked on strategies to find stocks that can give move on the next day. worked on the levels to trade on. and then finally about my entry ,exit, stop loss positions etc.
I tried it by trading very fewer shares for a week. Realized and corrected some crucial mistakes during those mistakes. I controlled my losses to a very good amount on a bad day after these sessions.
NOW,
1. I can identify stocks that can give move for the next day. (not all of them)
2. The stop loss I decide results to be correct for me most of the time. ie; whenever price will hit the stop loss it will go further to that direction afterwards. So stop loss prevents much of my loss.
3.THE PROBLEM: very much consistent with the losses. Stop loss prevents much of my loss but hits most of the time. This results in controlled but consistent loss which actually results in a bad loss overall.

I want to ask if I need to go back study and analyse the way i select the stocks for the next day or should i do the same with the actual strategy which takes place during the intraday entry and exit.
Or is there anything other than these that I am missing to analyse.

I Will be very thankful for any advice on this. Thanks

Try to find out why your stop losses are hit most of the time.


Bad luck aside, normally there are two main reasons if stop losses are hit regularly:

A) no edge / no valid strategy:

Your stop losses prevent larger losses, but the basis of the trades is faulty from the start (i.e. your expectancy is
negative also without money management).

That's fairly typical for beginners and represents an invitation to work - i.e. learning how your asset(s) behave(s)
and how to deal with this behavior under different market conditions.


B) lack of risk acceptance:

Your basic expectancy is positive, but your stop losses are too small regarding your position size and/or within
the noise zone of your time/volume/trade frame.

This is rather a psychological issue - as Ari Kiev puts it: "Psychologically, most of us prefer comfort and safety
to risk-taking."


Losses are a natural part of trading, and every trader (I know of) has kinds of comfort - stretch - panic zones that
are related to losses. Those who have a risk tolerance that's too small sooner or later drop out (e.g. by bleeding to
death by a million small cuts) or remain paralyzed, barely / not trading at all. The rest of us has to fight for inner
peace with risk-taking and the inherent potential of losses again and again.

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The following 2 users say Thank You to choke35 for this post:
 
  #5 (permalink)
Elite Member
India
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Amibroker/Presto
Broker/Data: Amibroker/Global data feed
Favorite Futures: Futures\Options
 
Posts: 2 since Feb 2011
Thanks: 18 given, 0 received


himanshuthakur11 View Post
hello friends, hope you all are having a great time.
I have been trading for more than a year now. That includes me buying just single stocks etc etc. as i don't have much funds to risk it all in the beginning. I also did demo trading. Started real trading only once my demo funds were back to green after initial loss. Started futures trading then. Mostly intraday.

I worked on strategies to find stocks that can give move on the next day. worked on the levels to trade on. and then finally about my entry ,exit, stop loss positions etc.
I tried it by trading very fewer shares for a week. Realized and corrected some crucial mistakes during those mistakes. I controlled my losses to a very good amount on a bad day after these sessions.
NOW,
1. I can identify stocks that can give move for the next day. (not all of them)
2. The stop loss I decide results to be correct for me most of the time. ie; whenever price will hit the stop loss it will go further to that direction afterwards. So stop loss prevents much of my loss.
3.THE PROBLEM: very much consistent with the losses. Stop loss prevents much of my loss but hits most of the time. This results in controlled but consistent loss which actually results in a bad loss overall.

I want to ask if I need to go back study and analyse the way i select the stocks for the next day or should i do the same with the actual strategy which takes place during the intraday entry and exit.
Or is there anything other than these that I am missing to analyse.

I Will be very thankful for any advice on this. Thanks

It is best u automate ur trading strategy, backtest, forward test, chk for robustness, then take it live, u will have more conviction

Sent using the futures.io mobile app

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  #6 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
dharamshala Himachal pradesh/India
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: amibroker,metastocks
Favorite Futures: futures
 
Posts: 10 since Jun 2017
Thanks: 0 given, 3 received


choke35 View Post
Try to find out why your stop losses are hit most of the time.


Bad luck aside, normally there are two main reasons if stop losses are hit regularly:

A) no edge / no valid strategy:

Your stop losses prevent larger losses, but the basis of the trades is faulty from the start (i.e. your expectancy is
negative also without money management).

That's fairly typical for beginners and represents an invitation to work - i.e. learning how your asset(s) behave(s)
and how to deal with this behavior under different market conditions.


B) lack of risk acceptance:

Your basic expectancy is positive, but your stop losses are too small regarding your position size and/or within
the noise zone of your time/volume/trade frame.

This is rather a psychological issue - as Ari Kiev puts it: "Psychologically, most of us prefer comfort and safety
to risk-taking."


Losses are a natural part of trading, and every trader (I know of) has kinds of comfort - stretch - panic zones that
are related to losses. Those who have a risk tolerance that's too small sooner or later drop out (e.g. by bleeding to
death by a million small cuts) or remain paralyzed, barely / not trading at all. The rest of us has to fight for inner
peace with risk-taking and the inherent potential of losses again and again.


Thanks for the response friend.
I want to say that the amount that I risk in a trade is small. But i must say that these stop losses save much of my loss. I have analyzed many of my trades and most of them show that stop loss has saved much of my loss. It happens less often that a trade continues to run in the previous direction after i pull out on a stop loss.
So i think you got me right on the first .
I want to tell you that i decide on the stocks to trade the next day. I get it right most often thankfully. Ie; these stocks give move the next day. Stop loss works good most often. But I think as you said I fail on the strategy.

Can you mentor me how can I develop another strategy, or how can i refine my already made strategy, or what analysis or studies i need to do on ny strategy.
( Have done a lot of analysis on my already made strategy, thought it was good enough but failed though)

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  #7 (permalink)
Market Wizard
Germany
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Other
Favorite Futures: ES, YM, 6E
 
Posts: 2,587 since Feb 2013
Thanks: 4,766 given, 6,315 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary


himanshuthakur11 View Post
Thanks for the response friend.
I want to say that the amount that I risk in a trade is small. But i must say that these stop losses save much of my loss. I have analyzed many of my trades and most of them show that stop loss has saved much of my loss. It happens less often that a trade continues to run in the previous direction after i pull out on a stop loss.
So i think you got me right on the first .
I want to tell you that i decide on the stocks to trade the next day. I get it right most often thankfully. Ie; these stocks give move the next day. Stop loss works good most often. But I think as you said I fail on the strategy.

Can you mentor me how can I develop another strategy, or how can i refine my already made strategy, or what analysis or studies i need to do on ny strategy.
( Have done a lot of analysis on my already made strategy, thought it was good enough but failed though)

Finding FIO certainly gave you a headstart

There's a lot of knowledgeable and seasoned traders around. I'd suggest you spend some time reading threads
with different approaches and find out which kinds of trading are right for you (e.g. in terms of assets, size,
volatility, time zone, style, trading ideas/methods/strategies etc.).

As soon as you have established your initial framework, the most money-protecting step is backtesting - and
modifiying if necessary - your framework until you have setups that reproducibly net positive expectancies AND
that you can trade consistently (esp in terms of risk and drawdowns). Concerning (back)testing trading ideas
correctly and systematically, @kevinkdog 's threads are an excellent start.

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  #8 (permalink)
Market Wizard
Germany
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Other
Favorite Futures: ES, YM, 6E
 
Posts: 2,587 since Feb 2013
Thanks: 4,766 given, 6,315 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary

@Big Mike / @sam028

@himanshuthakur11 double-opened the thread here and in Stocks and ETFs Trading (https://futures.io/stocks-etfs-trading/42389-can-identify-move-can-have-good-stop-loss-but-still-not-consistent-profit.html). Could you please move this thread to Stocks and ETFs Trading or merge it with the other thread (which doesn't have any replies
at the moment)?

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The following 2 users say Thank You to choke35 for this post:
 
  #9 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
dharamshala Himachal pradesh/India
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: amibroker,metastocks
Favorite Futures: futures
 
Posts: 10 since Jun 2017
Thanks: 0 given, 3 received


choke35 View Post
@Big Mike / @sam028

@himanshuthakur11 double-opened the thread here and in Stocks and ETFs Trading (https://futures.io/stocks-etfs-trading/42389-can-identify-move-can-have-good-stop-loss-but-still-not-consistent-profit.html). Could you please move this thread to Stocks and ETFs Trading or merge it with the other thread (which doesn't have any replies
at the moment)?

Want to merge it with that thread but can't find any way to do so.
Guide me on this please

Reply With Quote
 
  #10 (permalink)
Market Wizard
Germany
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Other
Favorite Futures: ES, YM, 6E
 
Posts: 2,587 since Feb 2013
Thanks: 4,766 given, 6,315 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary



himanshuthakur11 View Post
Want to merge it with that thread but can't find any way to do so.
Guide me on this please

To the best of my knowledge you need a moderator for this.
That's why I asked Mike/Sam.

Another possibility would be reporting your own post with the yellow warning sign and asking your question
that way (which also alerts a moderator).

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