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Selling Options on Futures?


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Selling Options on Futures?

  #6601 (permalink)
Narnar
Los Angeles, California
 
Posts: 22 since Feb 2018
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ron99 View Post
I am only doing 2x3 because it had higher median ROI than other strategies tested.


But for this crash the 1x2 performed well. It only needed 4xIM to ride it out while the 2x3 had to have 5xIM to ride it out.


Hi Ron,

Can you please elaborate on how you calculate the MM% of 61.1% and 87.7% from these positions?

Would this calculation be correct (I am using the approximation based on the example you had in your webinar, although I am off by a few percentage point). MM% = (Current IM - Initial Premium Collected + Current Premium) / Account Value


Thanks again!
NN

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  #6602 (permalink)
Narnar
Los Angeles, California
 
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thomasthomsen View Post
I would never risk 20% max loss for the entire account on just one position. The 5% figure you quoted seems more reasonable but is still a bit aggressive. This week I had on 4 total positions (ES, CL, ZS, and 6A) and 3 out of the 4 were profitable. The problem with concentrating your trading in just one underlying (e.g., ES, SPX, SPY) is that you leave yourself open to devastating losses, unless of course you're trading with a very high IM of like 10-15X, but then your returns are also going to be very modest as well... Remember that equity markets are highly correlated and it's helpful to diversity in other products. However, during times of crazy market volatility even some seemingly uncorrelated investment products can and do drop in unison together.

I see your point about managing upside risk with strangles, but there are many options for how to handle this. You can start out by trading more delta neutral (i.e., selling less calls than puts), or you can roll the untested put side up when the call side is challenged, or you can even hedge the upside risk by using more complex strategies like a long butterfly spread near your call strike. I personally don't like rolling the tested side up and/or out in time because this is how you can get stuck trying to swim against a strong current of a seemingly never-ending trend. The equity markets are almost always mean reverting though -- they will have some sort of a pullback and this gives you an opportunity to exit the trade. 2017 was pretty unprecedented with mostly one way price action since August, but even then in the first half of the year there were pullbacks nearly every month and trading strangles was profitable.

Greatly appreciate your advise, Thomasthomsen. I am fairly new to options on futures, been more active on the options on equities, I will slowly learn the rope on other potential commodities that I can trade to diversify my risk. I used to have 2% risk at any given position, but I would have 10 different positions at any given moment in equities (Max 20% on portfolio). May I ask for your recommendation of a more normal/conservative risk on portfolio?

I hadn't thought about buying butterfly before. In 2017 when it was continually running up, have you had a time where the price blast through your break even point on the butterfly? (i.e., leaving the short call and butterfly at a lost). If there will ever be such a case, would add additional long butterfly to manage the position, or would you roll the untested put side up, or both (selling put to pay for the butterfly)?

NN

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  #6603 (permalink)
 myrrdin 
Linz Austria
 
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Narnar View Post
Greatly appreciate your advise, Thomasthomsen. I am fairly new to options on futures, been more active on the options on equities, I will slowly learn the rope on other potential commodities that I can trade to diversify my risk. I used to have 2% risk at any given position, but I would have 10 different positions at any given moment in equities (Max 20% on portfolio). May I ask for your recommendation of a more normal/conservative risk on portfolio?

NN

If you are interested in deversifying your portfolio please read through the thread "Diversified Option Selling Portfolio". You will find a lot of ideas, and information on balancing your portfolio, Position size etc.

Best regards, Myrrdin

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  #6604 (permalink)
Narnar
Los Angeles, California
 
Posts: 22 since Feb 2018
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myrrdin View Post
If you are interested in deversifying your portfolio please read through the thread "Diversified Option Selling Portfolio". You will find a lot of ideas, and information on balancing your portfolio, Position size etc.

Best regards, Myrrdin

Thank you, Myrrdin. I will read through the thread as well

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  #6605 (permalink)
 ron99 
Cleveland, OH
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: QST
Broker: QST, DeCarley Trading, Gain
Trading: Options on Futures
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Narnar View Post
Hi Ron,

Can you please elaborate on how you calculate the MM% of 61.1% and 87.7% from these positions?

Would this calculation be correct (I am using the approximation based on the example you had in your webinar, although I am off by a few percentage point). MM% = (Current IM - Initial Premium Collected + Current Premium) / Account Value


Thanks again!
NN

The spreadsheet is including commissions and fees.

Also MM = IM / 1.1

MM% = (current IM / 1.1) / (beginning IM * 5 + current P/L)

5 is from 5xIM. Current P/L includes commissions and fees.

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  #6606 (permalink)
 rsm005 
vancouver BC/Canada
 
Experience: Beginner
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I opened my first position since the volatility from last week. Went a bit nuts with the excess, 10x, but it will help me sleep a bit better.

/rsm005/

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  #6607 (permalink)
 
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 tturner86 
Portland, Oregon
 
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I dont know a lot about options trading. Are there any known options traders out there that y'all would be interested in seeing in a webinar? I am looking for ideas.

Thanks,
Terry

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  #6608 (permalink)
osfutures
Bucharest / Romania
 
Posts: 4 since Feb 2018
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Hi,

Has someone sold puts today on SB, KC or HE ? I think it was a good day to sell.

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  #6609 (permalink)
 ron99 
Cleveland, OH
 
Experience: Advanced
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Broker: QST, DeCarley Trading, Gain
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rsm005 View Post
I opened my first position since the volatility from last week. Went a bit nuts with the excess, 10x, but it will help me sleep a bit better.

/rsm005/

Sleep is good.

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  #6610 (permalink)
Narnar
Los Angeles, California
 
Posts: 22 since Feb 2018
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ron99 View Post
The spreadsheet is including commissions and fees.

Also MM = IM / 1.1

MM% = (current IM / 1.1) / (beginning IM * 5 + current P/L)

5 is from 5xIM. Current P/L includes commissions and fees.

Thanks, Ron! What is the 1.1 for?

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