Selling Options on Futures? (Page 536) - Options on Futures | futures.io
futures.io futures trading
 

Go Back   futures.io

> Futures Trading, News, Charts and Platforms > Traders Hideout > Options on Futures


Selling Options on Futures?
Started:July 19th, 2011 (06:16 PM) by ron99 Views / Replies:568,065 / 5,727
Last Reply:Yesterday (12:40 PM) Attachments:642

Welcome to futures.io.

Welcome, Guest!

This forum was established to help traders (especially futures traders) by openly sharing indicators, strategies, methods, trading journals and discussing the psychology of trading.

We are fundamentally different than most other trading forums:
  • We work extremely hard to keep things positive on our forums.
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendor advertising in posts.
  • We firmly believe in openness and encourage sharing. The holy grail is within you, it is not something tangible you can download.
  • We expect our members to participate and become a part of the community. Help yourself by helping others.


You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community. It's free and simple, and we will never resell your private information.

-- Big Mike
     

Reply
 642  
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread

Selling Options on Futures?

Old March 22nd, 2016, 01:08 AM   #5351 (permalink)
Elite Member
vancouver BC/Canada
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Zaner360, OX
Broker/Data: DeCaley
Favorite Futures: options
 
Posts: 213 since Jan 2015
Thanks: 13 given, 172 received

@chubbly2

Here's an example of the draw down and behavior of my account if my position is hit by a major market move down... Right now I keep about 10x in my account. As you can see the draw down is big but there are chances to exit while keeping the damage to a minimum...waiting out the storm and then re-entering.

I'm also using some technical indicators for entry/exit. Mostly support/resistance and watching what the guys are doing on the ES-Spoo thread to get an idea of market psychology. Not ideal given most of them scalp but it's good knowledge to have.

Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).

Reply With Quote
     
The following 2 users say Thank You to rsm005 for this post:
     

Old March 22nd, 2016, 06:00 AM   #5352 (permalink)
Elite Member
Linz Austria
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: Zaner360, Vantage, Trade Navigator
Broker/Data: DeCarley, RJO
Favorite Futures: Commodities
 
Posts: 679 since Nov 2014
Thanks: 1,031 given, 550 received


chubbly2 View Post
As I mentioned in an earlier post I am still working on finding optimal hedging for selling puts.

I still sell the ES puts naked. In my opinion there are too many different ways the S&P index moves downwards. Fast, slow, far, or just a bit. And each way needs another protection via long puts.

There are two major ways I protect my positions:

I get out below the 200 dma.

Most of the time the index is above this index, and, thus, most of the time I am able to sell ES puts. This method costs me some money in case I get out, and back in soon after. But in August 2015 my losses were very limited.

Additionally I hold many other short option positions (see separate thread). This allows for using a larger part of the account for trading, and keeps risk for each position at a reasonable level. It is important to check if the positions are sufficiently independent from each other.

Currently I do not hold any ES puts. I intend to wait for a test of the 200 dma before re-entering.

Best regards, Myrrdin

Reply With Quote
     
The following 3 users say Thank You to myrrdin for this post:
     

Old March 22nd, 2016, 09:31 AM   #5353 (permalink)
World'sWorstTrader
Knoxville Tennessee USA
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TOS
Favorite Futures: ES, NQ, CL, /6E futures options.
 
Posts: 257 since Oct 2012
Thanks: 126 given, 75 received



myrrdin View Post
I still sell the ES puts naked. In my opinion there are too many different ways the S&P index moves downwards. Fast, slow, far, or just a bit. And each way needs another protection via long puts.

There are two major ways I protect my positions:

I get out below the 200 dma.

Most of the time the index is above this index, and, thus, most of the time I am able to sell ES puts. This method costs me some money in case I get out, and back in soon after. But in August 2015 my losses were very limited.

Additionally I hold many other short option positions (see separate thread). This allows for using a larger part of the account for trading, and keeps risk for each position at a reasonable level. It is important to check if the positions are sufficiently independent from each other.

Currently I do not hold any ES puts. I intend to wait for a test of the 200 dma before re-entering.

Best regards, Myrrdin

What is wrong with having a position with positive THETA and positive VEGA?

Reply With Quote
     

Old March 22nd, 2016, 11:18 AM   #5354 (permalink)
Elite Member
Linz Austria
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: Zaner360, Vantage, Trade Navigator
Broker/Data: DeCarley, RJO
Favorite Futures: Commodities
 
Posts: 679 since Nov 2014
Thanks: 1,031 given, 550 received


datahogg View Post
What is wrong with having a position with positive THETA and positive VEGA?

Nothing - there are many ways to achieve the same target.

For me diversification of my portfolio and selling ES puts only in "safe" situations (index > 200 dma) is a good solution. But there are many other solutions. The problem: None of these solutions is perfect.

Best regards, Myrrdin

Reply With Quote
     
The following 2 users say Thank You to myrrdin for this post:
     

Old March 23rd, 2016, 10:22 AM   #5355 (permalink)
Market Wizard
OH
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: QST
Broker/Data: QST, DeCarley Trading, Gain
Favorite Futures: Options on Futures
 
Posts: 2,323 since Jul 2011
Thanks: 634 given, 3,902 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary

Futures Edge on FIO

Are you a NinjaTrader user?

 
I just found this CME website QuikStrike Tools. Some interesting data. Options, COT, etc

QuikStrike Options Valuation Tool ? CME Group

Reply With Quote
     
The following 3 users say Thank You to ron99 for this post:
     

Old March 24th, 2016, 10:57 AM   #5356 (permalink)
Market Wizard
OH
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: QST
Broker/Data: QST, DeCarley Trading, Gain
Favorite Futures: Options on Futures
 
Posts: 2,323 since Jul 2011
Thanks: 634 given, 3,902 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary

Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).

Reply With Quote
     
The following 3 users say Thank You to ron99 for this post:
     

Old March 24th, 2016, 11:52 AM   #5357 (permalink)
Market Wizard
OH
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: QST
Broker/Data: QST, DeCarley Trading, Gain
Favorite Futures: Options on Futures
 
Posts: 2,323 since Jul 2011
Thanks: 634 given, 3,902 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary

The chart above was 9:30 am ET to 4 pm ET. Here is data looking from settlement to settlement. Not much of a pattern comparing settlement to settlement.

Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).

Reply With Quote
     
The following 4 users say Thank You to ron99 for this post:
     

Old March 27th, 2016, 02:02 AM   #5358 (permalink)
Elite Member
vancouver BC/Canada
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Zaner360, OX
Broker/Data: DeCaley
Favorite Futures: options
 
Posts: 213 since Jan 2015
Thanks: 13 given, 172 received

@ron99

I have a quick question about your spread sheet. I've been playing with some other ideas and struggling with 2 columns that just don't seem to add up, Futures Month and Options Month.

For example, i'd like to see how a 45 day to expiration spread would have behaved during the swoon in January but just can't find the right letter/date combination. Same with August of last year.

Is there a location tells you exactly what options month codes line up with which futures month codes? If not what's the best way to figure that out.

Thanks,
/rsm005/

Reply With Quote
     

Old March 27th, 2016, 08:38 AM   #5359 (permalink)
Market Wizard
OH
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: QST
Broker/Data: QST, DeCarley Trading, Gain
Favorite Futures: Options on Futures
 
Posts: 2,323 since Jul 2011
Thanks: 634 given, 3,902 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary

rsm005, For ES, the futures months are always quarterly. H, M, U, Z. Nothing else.

There are all 12 option months.
F, G, H option months go with H futures month.
J, K, M go with M.
N, Q, U go with U.
V, X, Z go with Z.

The options month is always the months after the prior futures month up to and including the futures month.

For Corn the futures months are H, K, N, U, Z. And then for example option months J & K go with futures month K.

Reply With Quote
     

Old March 27th, 2016, 01:46 PM   #5360 (permalink)
Elite Member
vancouver BC/Canada
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Zaner360, OX
Broker/Data: DeCaley
Favorite Futures: options
 
Posts: 213 since Jan 2015
Thanks: 13 given, 172 received


Thanks Ron,

I'm not sure if it's something I'm doing but the pivot table seems very fragile. I run the spreadsheet and there's data under historical but I see this in the pivot table...regardless of date or prices..


Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).




Am I missing something?

/rsm005/


Last edited by rsm005; March 28th, 2016 at 12:42 AM. Reason: Grammar
Reply With Quote
     

Reply



futures.io > Futures Trading, News, Charts and Platforms > Traders Hideout > Options on Futures > Selling Options on Futures?

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Upcoming Webinars and Events (4:30PM ET unless noted)
 

NinjaTrader 8: Features and Enhancements, Tips and Tricks

Dec 6
 

Al Brooks: Stop Losing when a Good Trade goes Bad, Correcting Mistakes

Elite only
 

Trading Technologies: Algo Design Lab hands-on

Dec 13
     

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Crude Oil (CL) futures inverse pairing options Big Mike Commodities Futures Trading 8 December 12th, 2013 12:00 PM
Recommend futures, options Broker? sam1197 Brokers and Data Feeds 17 March 27th, 2013 01:42 AM
Trading Futures with options as protection Gooffy2010 Commodities Futures Trading 6 October 2nd, 2012 05:55 PM
Selling Njniatrader sam1197 NinjaTrader 22 June 28th, 2012 01:40 PM
Zen-Fire Futures options tici88 Brokers and Data Feeds 1 July 30th, 2011 10:16 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:53 PM.

Copyright © 2016 by futures.io. All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice.
There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
 
no new posts

Page generated 2016-12-03 in 0.13 seconds with 20 queries on phoenix via your IP 54.166.48.3