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Personal Moral Values and Trading
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Personal Moral Values and Trading

  #11 (permalink)
The fun is in the numbers
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Don't split your spiritual life from your mundane life

"Don't split your spiritual life from your mundane life"

Though I have mentioned trading life, of course the message is for all areas of your life.

For myself, the foundation of reality is the spiritual plane. That is, things are created and energized on the spiritual plane and then through effort and persistence we bring them into manifestation on the physical or material, mundane plane.

Let us say you have an idea for a new invention, or new product or new experiment or whatever.
1. You receive the inspiration for it - the spiritual plane ("inspiration" comes from in+spirit )
2. You conceive of it on the mental plane form a mental image of it.
3. You plan out its manifestation (draw the blueprint of it) -- mental to physical.
4. You create an (action) plan.
5. You bring together the resources and people and direct them according to the plan (money stone-cutters, labourers, etc) .
6. Persist, receive feedback, adjust and continue until realization (the cathedral is built).

The process is the same for investing/trading.

Keep your mind in the future, in the now.
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  #12 (permalink)
The fun is in the numbers
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The process is the same for investing and trading

The process is the same for investing and trading

We get a hunch of something to check out, or perhaps we spot a co-incidence and wonder if it repeats. Then we check our charts looking for the pattern or whatever the inspiration is for. Next we develop a trading plan. This would include the setup rules and money management (entry/exit signals, scaling in/ out, stops etc). We add in rules for recognizing a failed trade. We add in guidelines/signals that are confirming our set-up recognition. We create a plan to build it - indicators or testing and implementation. We trade it, adjust and modify, receive feedback or new information, persist adjust and continue.

So what am I getting at here?

By aligning our thoughts and actions to good, to recognizing and supporting good, we raise our vibrational level to allow us to more easily access inspiration required to start the process of creation of good.

You could be a skilled architect but without inspiration you are left as a mere draftsman.
You could be a great programmer but without inspiration you are left as a mere coder - waiting upon others to tell you what to code.

There are tons of beautiful indicators programmed but even with all of these one does not have the inspiration required to build a great trading fortune (to build *a grand cathedral").

Instead you are left grubbing around, bouncing from indicator to indicator, guru to guru, trading educator to trading educator, black box to black box, ad for instant riches ("system to generate 7 pts every day guaranteed!!") or flailing random entries.

You are left at the mercy of your lower emotions greed and fear. Tossed by the flickering winds of emotion and whipsawed by the manipulators, you become food for the sharks, pigs for the slaughterhouse.

Inspiration is the beginning, the spark, of great creation.
Inspiration to create great good is strengthen by your actions, thoughts, deeds, and words aligned to good.

Keep your mind in the future, in the now.

Last edited by aquarian1; January 13th, 2013 at 03:31 AM.
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  #13 (permalink)
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I'm a little confused...

I understand your logic, but not sure I understand your intentions behind that logic.

When you are "investing" in these well established companies, most often, your money is not being used to help the company grow with trading even less so. The purpose of your investment/trading is for you to profit no? I can understand the emotional reasoning for not wanting to profit from companies that "behave badly", but if you hold a "bad" company for a few hours or minutes how is your trade tied to the companies behavior except in your mind?

Generally speaking, the world and the information we have available is not simple and black or white. There's a lot of complexity and gray.

Personally I think if someone wants to attempt to make investments that try to improve the world they should look into micro-loans. But even then you will most always get a heart felt simple story from the loanee that may never explain the complex gray reality they live in.

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  #14 (permalink)
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MrYou View Post

Generally speaking, the world and the information we have available is not simple and black or white. There's a lot of complexity and gray.

Personally I think if someone wants to attempt to make investments that try to improve the world they should look into micro-loans. But even then you will most always get a heart felt simple story from the loanee that may never explain the complex gray reality they live in.

I have been pondering how to respond and mr. you struck it on the head. News reports never tell the entire story so its tough for us as a little guy to make a good decision. Nowadays it's seems the media tells us what we are supposed to think, not what the unbiased story is. Tough to make a decision one way or another . . .

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  #15 (permalink)
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One stock that has definite business and moral ambiguity, HLF, Herbalife. The products are overpriced generic weightloss shakes. And it's a total MLM. Yet major funds are supporting and speculating on this stock. Just realized while Mr. Ackerman brought attention to MLM at HLF yet he is shorting the stock 1 billion for his fund himself. Sign of the times?

Herbalife Report.tk - The Truth Behind the Lies

" Its been stated that 1 in 3,300 people succeed as a Herbalife distributor. And it is those people that are usually the ones that have had to cheat and scam to get to where they are. "

I have been guilty of sim trading option spreads on HLF, even if it was just sim and I was only looking at the technical analysis, i.e. the price action of the equity and didn't realize the extent of the scam until recently in the news. Something to think about for me. If I traded live delta neutral options spreads on HLF maybe I would still be party to adding to the speculation volume and interest in the stock.


Last edited by Cloudy; January 15th, 2013 at 07:11 PM.
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  #16 (permalink)
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I would like to understand this thread, so this is a debate whether buying a stock or for that matter equity in a given company would constitute a moral or a immoral decision based on their business model?

I am YET to see one stock that is good all around ethically.
To me they all "push" something and as a investor you simply assess whether the
environment is ripe for a certain Assett to go up or down.

Just one example......

What is good? Let's assume WholeFoods
Promote good food, organic, healthy
Reality: 80% regular products full of sugar, 20% organic.
Nice paper bag. Unethical CEO that depressed Wild Oats via Yahoo forums then bought them.

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  #17 (permalink)
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I agree there is a lot of grey with stocks or any business for that matter. I thought HLF would be a better example because it is overwhelmingly fraught with doubts as to it's business ethics and whether the majority of it's revenue comes from MLM rather than the products themselves where tens of thousands lose at least a thousand or more just for temporarily working for HLF. And I'm not sure why I posted except this thread seemed kind of challenging and thought provoking. Maybe commiserating some guilt of trading.

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  #18 (permalink)
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The HLF thing bothers me because the guy who supposedly blew the whistle on them holds a short position of a billion dollars (according to some reports I read)
He knows his power in the media and the extent of his reputation via the firm he built, Pershing.
He is determined to go to congress on that or Supreme Court, not sure what legislation he mentioned.
Translation: Even if he is wrong on the trade, he will muscle his trade to profits.

But, soon they will announce their earning, and he could possibly get the MOASS (mother of all short squeezes)

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  #19 (permalink)
The fun is in the numbers
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There are ways you help the company by investing in their stock


aquarian1 View Post
You know in your heart you are helping bad. You know that if everyone stopped buying their stock the management wouldn't get their multimillion dollar bonuses and would change their behavior.

Another way is access to capital.
If the company stock market capital goes way up they can use that capital to purchase other companies and assets.

However, there is more to what I am driving at and the direct causal relationship.

I spent some time on page2 speaking of intuition. The topic may be a stretch for many who are traders from their usual way of thinking. However, new ways of looking at things can be rewarding.

Many people only look at life from the surface. The only look at what they can touch or kick.
"If I can't see it or touch it then it doesn't exist" - might sum it up.

However, there is a spiritual basis underlying physical form, causal to physical.

Keep your mind in the future, in the now.
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  #20 (permalink)
The fun is in the numbers
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MrYou View Post
I'm a little confused...

I understand your logic, but not sure I understand your intentions behind that logic.

When you are "investing" in these well established companies, most often, your money is not being used to help the company grow with trading even less so. The purpose of your investment/trading is for you to profit no?


Hi

I get the feeling you haven't read the whole thread and are trying to simplify it without really reading it.

I realize that some of my posts are more lengthy than just a sound bite that most people are used to today.
(you can skip the Hudbay post.)


The purpose of life is not just to make make money.
The purpose of life isn't just to see how many toys you can gather around you.
The purpose of life isn't to win at all costs.
The ends do not justify the means.


Money is money - is a false statement.
It doesn't matter how you make it just that you make it. - is a false statement.
It isn't wrong if you don't get caught. - is a false statement.
(If these statements were true then you would feel OK being a gangster or in the mafia as long as you're not caught. )

Once again the thread is about more than just the apparent causal relationship of your investing and if it helps or hurts a bad company.

Keep your mind in the future, in the now.
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