NexusFi: Find Your Edge


Home Menu

 





The Truth: NinjaTrader


Discussion in NinjaTrader

Updated
      Top Posters
    1. looks_one Fat Tails with 120 posts (165 thanks)
    2. looks_two Big Mike with 54 posts (93 thanks)
    3. looks_3 MetalTrade with 43 posts (10 thanks)
    4. looks_4 ZTR with 41 posts (25 thanks)
      Best Posters
    1. looks_one AynRandFan with 34 thanks per post
    2. looks_two Big Mike with 1.7 thanks per post
    3. looks_3 Fat Tails with 1.4 thanks per post
    4. looks_4 NinjaTrader with 0.9 thanks per post
    1. trending_up 355,973 views
    2. thumb_up 802 thanks given
    3. group 145 followers
    1. forum 1,059 posts
    2. attach_file 65 attachments




 
Search this Thread

The Truth: NinjaTrader

  #1021 (permalink)
 Traderji 
Australia
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, Multicharts
Trading: Spot Forex, Gold, Silver
Posts: 176 since Oct 2010
Thanks Given: 114
Thanks Received: 114


Traderji View Post
What does the NT dev team do all day? Play video games? Browse gonewild videos? Click 'dislike' on Multicharts and Sierra Charts facebook pages and run away giggling like little girls?


Dammit just heard the new World of Warcraft expansion pack is out next month. I guess that means NT8 is now on hold while the developer(s?) kill some dragons

Reply With Quote

Can you help answer these questions
from other members on NexusFi?
NexusFi Journal Challenge - April 2024
Feedback and Announcements
Futures True Range Report
The Elite Circle
ZombieSqueeze
Platforms and Indicators
The space time continuum and the dynamics of a financial …
Emini and Emicro Index
Deepmoney LLM
Elite Quantitative GenAI/LLM
 
Best Threads (Most Thanked)
in the last 7 days on NexusFi
Get funded firms 2023/2024 - Any recommendations or word …
61 thanks
Funded Trader platforms
38 thanks
NexusFi site changelog and issues/problem reporting
26 thanks
GFIs1 1 DAX trade per day journal
19 thanks
The Program
18 thanks
  #1022 (permalink)
 wavey 
Germany / Italy
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NT8, TS, TV
Trading: Index Futures, FX
Posts: 83 since Nov 2009
Thanks Given: 51
Thanks Received: 37


Traderji View Post
Dammit just heard the new World of Warcraft expansion pack is out next month. I guess that means NT8 is now on hold while the developer(s?) kill some dragons

Just one game? You're brutal ... it needs more variance to sparkle inspiration ... and I'm sure NT8 will come out nicely ahead.

Reply With Quote
  #1023 (permalink)
 Harrison 
Dnepropetrovsk
 
Posts: 7 since Apr 2013



wavey View Post
Just one game? You're brutal ... it needs more variance to sparkle inspiration ... and I'm sure NT8 will come out nicely ahead.

perhaps I am not so informed... I understnd that new versions are nice abd wellcomed.
But as for me, its difficult becasue you can not use your indicators which worked at previuos version of Ninja...

Reply With Quote
  #1024 (permalink)
tradethis
detroit, mi
 
Posts: 5 since Apr 2013
Thanks Given: 0
Thanks Received: 2

other than multicharts, are there any better alternatives to NT? having order entry errors time and time again

Reply With Quote
  #1025 (permalink)
 renvik 
Boston MA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: Ninja/CQG
Trading: ES, ZB, CL
Posts: 259 since Apr 2010
Thanks Given: 344
Thanks Received: 119


Fat Tails View Post
As long as you do not edit anyone of the indicators, there is no memory usage.

................................
The problem is that once you close the editor, RAM requirement remains at 900k. So you better close down NinjaTrader and restart it again, if you want to use it for trading.

Either code or trade, but never edit any NinjaScript files while trading.

@Fat Tails THANKS.

I just read this, will not edit anything during the trading hours!

Cheers,
Kumar

Follow me on Twitter Reply With Quote
  #1026 (permalink)
 leinster 
Brussels / Dublin
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: ninjatrader
Trading: Stdev + 2
Posts: 468 since Jun 2010
Thanks Given: 844
Thanks Received: 595

Id like to add some comments to this thread regarding ninjatrader.

I have been running it for 2 years live trading system now with money on the table and now i have decided to port away from ninja.

This is frustrating too say the least as i will have to port to another platform and rewrite the strategies.

With Ninja the more you use it the more you see the flaws which are not fully apparent until you look under the hood.

Here are some.

1.)
Performance metrics are in dollars even if im trading a euro / sterling position which means if your performing some sort of statistical arbitrage you have to manually calculate it out.
2.)
The initialize not been allowed to dynamically load instruments (again if your doing some sort of arbitrage this doesnt make sense as if the connection drops you need to auto reload. ) There is a workaround but the bug / feature should not be there.
3.)
A major issue is the resynchronisation of positions to active positions that are open. In the case whereby Ninja attempts to syncrhonise the position to the running strategy it uses the number of contracts. So say i have 10K position on a stock that trades at 4.10 i have 2439 shares open. Now as Ninja appears to messup on a reload of historical data (which causes the charts to all appear squidged together it may think you went long at a price of 4.15 not find the current order and relaunch another order into the market to syncrhonise it (2409 shares opened).
4.)
Sometimes market data doesnt stream into the chart so you have a case whereby the chart ticks / minutes are not updated which is an epic failure with statistical arbitrage.
5.)
Ninja broker support is distinctly lightweight and badly built. A case in question is the Ninja TWS API Interface does not support CFD's. CFD's are just a marker position where to route the trade yet they do not support it. Effectivly they do not fully support the broker they support the majors and thats it. I cannot understand this and it must mean its not quite thought out enough.
6.)
The constant crashes and disconnects (especially if 1 IB server is down) are unreal and cause the charting to not work correctly on incoming data.
They claim reload data which doesnt help if your in positions etc.
7.)
When you save a workspace and chart it doesnt save the from / to date so you have to manually set these everytime a reload / crash of ninjatrader happens.

Its been quite a ride with ninjatrader but now im off to port away from ninja and most probably into Panda. Panda is what is used significantly by hedge funds / quants etc so if in doubt follow them!

https://nbviewer.org/urls/raw.github.com/ematvey/pybacktest/master/examples/tutorial.ipynb

Reply With Quote
Thanked by:
  #1027 (permalink)
 Xeno 
UK
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja
Broker: Mirus/Zen
Trading: Futures - bonds, currencies, index
Posts: 288 since Oct 2010
Thanks Given: 70
Thanks Received: 274

Excellent post leinster.

I became pretty disillusioned with NT years ago. I've been using it for maybe six years now. Your comment hit home about the more you use it the more you realise all the little things you need to cope with to try and make things work properly. I coudn't really trade with version 6. I waited ages for 7 to come out, then helped to beta test it for what seemed like years. But despite all that, the only real thing 7 gave me was it crashed much less - there was nothing for the professional trader to really get hold of. Various things I asked for years ago - really useful stuff like consolidated results for multi instrument tests, or simple stuff like fixing the date format on my graphs so it uses my locale, to massive things like sorting out multi currency (or at least reporting in the right currency - is it ever right to subtract 90 pounds from 100 dollars and say you made a profit?)

All asked for many years ago, along with loads of other really important stuff, and never done. Then it *all* went on hold and now I have to go through the whole process again with NT8?? I'm sorry but this is years of my trading career. And when NT8 is released, all of the marketing, advertising, features etc will concentrate on the new trader, or the occasional discretionary trader who might like pretty charts. There'll be nothing really great for the professional algorithmic traders...

Reply With Quote
Thanked by:
  #1028 (permalink)
 timefreedom 
Indianapolis, IN USA
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninjatrader TOS Custom
Broker: Several
Trading: ES CL ZB
Posts: 374 since Dec 2009
Thanks Given: 226
Thanks Received: 381


Xeno View Post
Excellent post leinster.

I became pretty disillusioned with NT years ago. I've been using it for maybe six years now. Your comment hit home about the more you use it the more you realise all the little things you need to cope with to try and make things work properly. I coudn't really trade with version 6. I waited ages for 7 to come out, then helped to beta test it for what seemed like years. But despite all that, the only real thing 7 gave me was it crashed much less - there was nothing for the professional trader to really get hold of. Various things I asked for years ago - really useful stuff like consolidated results for multi instrument tests, or simple stuff like fixing the date format on my graphs so it uses my locale, to massive things like sorting out multi currency (or at least reporting in the right currency - is it ever right to subtract 90 pounds from 100 dollars and say you made a profit?)

All asked for many years ago, along with loads of other really important stuff, and never done. Then it *all* went on hold and now I have to go through the whole process again with NT8?? I'm sorry but this is years of my trading career. And when NT8 is released, all of the marketing, advertising, features etc will concentrate on the new trader, or the occasional discretionary trader who might like pretty charts. There'll be nothing really great for the professional algorithmic traders...

Cool. You should probably update your profile to reflect the trading platform you're using now. Good luck.

Reply With Quote
  #1029 (permalink)
 
Beljevina's Avatar
 Beljevina 
Toronto, Canada
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, SierraCharts
Broker: Amp/CQG, IB
Trading: CL, GC, 6E, ES, RTY, EURUSD, GBPJPY, AUDUSD
Posts: 352 since Sep 2010


Fat Tails View Post
As long as you do not edit anyone of the indicators, there is no memory usage.

If you edit anyone via File -> Utilities -> Edit Ninjascipt, then the RAM requirement rises. On my machine (workspace open + connected) NinjaTrader uses about 260 MByte of RAM. When editing an indicator this increases to about 900 k. The amount required depends on the number of indicators and strategies, which are stored as part of the NinjaTrader assembly.

The problem is that once you close the editor, RAM requirement remains at 900k. So you better close down NinjaTrader and restart it again, if you want to use it for trading.

Either code or trade, but never edit any NinjaScript files while trading.

I cannot believe I have not come across this anywhere until now (and from a 1+ yr old post! While I am not completely up to date on current programming techniques and do not have full Ninjascript knowledge, I can make changes to indicators, and add code, that modifies and/or enhances existing programming code in an indicator. I am only writing this because I have really gotten into the weeds on many things NT7-ish over the 3yrs I have been using it, and I can't believe I have never ever come across this documented anywhere. It is (another) major shortcoming of NT7, if true. It would appear that launching the editor - while I can grasp it is a separate program/module that needs resources - it is shocking that it does not release the memory and resources it usurped, after I exit it.

And to not have it noted anywhere (I have spent a lot of time in the NT7 forums too), is disenchanting. Partially, because I have been dumbfounded why my ninjatrader.exe will grow from ~500M to ~800M+ at times; it's at least every few days that I will launch the editor. As a matter of principle, I religiously do not want to exit NT7, since it would interrupt the writing of GOM data. BUT, since I have had intermittent issues where NT7 slows down significantly almost once a session, I do have to exit it, upon which relaunching it, then returns the normal speed. (Yes, this may be some indicator, but, I can't tell which one [due to NT7's lack of troubleshooting tools], and I have minimized my charts down to the 35 that I feel I need. )

Thanks to @Fat Tails for pointing this out.

Follow me on Twitter Reply With Quote
  #1030 (permalink)
 leinster 
Brussels / Dublin
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: ninjatrader
Trading: Stdev + 2
Posts: 468 since Jun 2010
Thanks Given: 844
Thanks Received: 595


I must admit i have nothing against Ninjatrader and still use it today as soon as i complete my conversion to python ill update the platform in my user details, however for now im still with it / stuck with it.

To be fair the support from Ninja is excellent and thats a credit to the team of employees and management. Truly excellent support.

However even if support is excellent there are serious issues with the product architecture that really need to be resolved / looked into closer. If im putting significant money on the line to trade and my platform cracks up due to something silly then i am not happy about it. This is much less of a concern if your not using automated trading.

Basic connection handling and infallible fallover support should be a minimum prerequiisite to a trading platform.

Even the post regarding the submit your automated strategy shows how fallible it is i have read numerous times ohh this is just the same as been live this disconnect this forgotten rollover etc etc, im sorry but im certain a hedge fund will not accept this.

For the price its okay as a product but its like taking a fiat punto to a formula 1 track and thinking ur going to win, its not going to get around the track.
@Xeno what platform are you using / looking at now ?

Reply With Quote
Thanked by:




Last Updated on April 22, 2017


© 2024 NexusFi™, s.a., All Rights Reserved.
Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama City, Panama, Ph: +507 833-9432 (Panama and Intl), +1 888-312-3001 (USA and Canada)
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice. There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
About Us - Contact Us - Site Rules, Acceptable Use, and Terms and Conditions - Privacy Policy - Downloads - Top
no new posts