NexusFi: Find Your Edge


Home Menu

 





The Truth: NinjaTrader


Discussion in NinjaTrader

Updated
      Top Posters
    1. looks_one Fat Tails with 120 posts (165 thanks)
    2. looks_two Big Mike with 54 posts (93 thanks)
    3. looks_3 MetalTrade with 43 posts (10 thanks)
    4. looks_4 ZTR with 41 posts (25 thanks)
      Best Posters
    1. looks_one AynRandFan with 34 thanks per post
    2. looks_two Big Mike with 1.7 thanks per post
    3. looks_3 Fat Tails with 1.4 thanks per post
    4. looks_4 NinjaTrader with 0.9 thanks per post
    1. trending_up 355,973 views
    2. thumb_up 802 thanks given
    3. group 145 followers
    1. forum 1,059 posts
    2. attach_file 65 attachments




 
Search this Thread

The Truth: NinjaTrader

  #671 (permalink)
 
NinjaTrader's Avatar
 NinjaTrader  NinjaTrader is an official Site Sponsor
Site Sponsor

Web: NinjaTrader
AMA: Ask Me Anything
Webinars: NinjaTrader Webinars
Elite offer: Click here
 
Posts: 1,713 since May 2010
Thanks Given: 203
Thanks Received: 2,686


Fat Tails View Post
Bug #1: We did not understand each other here.

The bars with the time stamp 8:30:00, which come after the session begin return the session begin of the prior session. So if I apply GetNextBeginEnd() to that new session 8:30:00 bar, it will return yesterday 15:30:00 as the session begin, which is obviously false!

Fat Tails,

You are correct, I was not understanding you. I went back and discussed this with development/product management and concur that there is an issue. Sparing you all the granular details, we plan to have a resolution to this in our next update in the form of an additional signature for this method. Likely, this additional parameter may be a reference to the bar series which is what we need to return the correct data.

gomi,
With respect to the NT support forum post you referenced, I beleive there was also a disconnect in understanding. Thanks for bringing up this reference in this thread.

Follow me on Twitter Reply With Quote
Thanked by:

Can you help answer these questions
from other members on NexusFi?
NexusFi Journal Challenge - April 2024
Feedback and Announcements
ZombieSqueeze
Platforms and Indicators
Exit Strategy
NinjaTrader
New Micros: Ultra 10-Year & Ultra T-Bond -- Live Now
Treasury Notes and Bonds
Deepmoney LLM
Elite Quantitative GenAI/LLM
 
  #672 (permalink)
 
NinjaTrader's Avatar
 NinjaTrader  NinjaTrader is an official Site Sponsor
Site Sponsor

Web: NinjaTrader
AMA: Ask Me Anything
Webinars: NinjaTrader Webinars
Elite offer: Click here
 
Posts: 1,713 since May 2010
Thanks Given: 203
Thanks Received: 2,686


tomgilb View Post
Ninja timestamps their bars at bar close. Maybe if they timestamped bars at bar open, as Sierra Chart and other platforms do, this issue would be moot.

Other platforms and market data services time stamp bars on the close. Off the top of my head, TradeStation, IQFeed, BarChart all time stamp on bar close like NinjaTrader does.

Follow me on Twitter Reply With Quote
Thanked by:
  #673 (permalink)
 bobc635 
Tucson
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: Stage5
Trading: CL, YM
Posts: 209 since Jan 2011
Thanks Given: 137
Thanks Received: 233


I am sorry to hear about your frustrations. You sound sophissticated enough to have worked with their support to help isolate and fix the issues....They suggested that my antivirus and/or shadow drive routine was cauising issues and to exclude Ninja from the scans. That fixed my issues. I do occassionally have issues in replay, but replay seems to be every platforms problem. I still like my Ninja a lot, and I hope that your frustrations don't turn too many people away from a great platform. As part of my maintenance, I do a weekly db repair, just to help make sure everything is ok.

I am curious though, what platform did you endup with???

Bob


AynRandFan View Post
This is going to be a different kind of post. A different kind of thread. Mike, in fact, might not want it here, but I'm going to put it here, because it needs to be here, and what I have to say needs to be said.

I have just removed NinjaTrader from my computer. Literally, I am done with it. I will not ever be using it ever again. I spent close to $500 buying indicators for it, and that's money wasted, as well.

The sad truth is that NinjaTrader is an unstable piece of junk. I truly wish that it wasn't a piece of junk -- really, I do. The non-stop freezing, the constant hang-ups, the complete inability of NinjaTrader to deal with any meaningful amount of tick data... all of these are deal-breakers for me.

They should also be deal-breakers for you.

Look, I run a very powerful system, here. Quad-core, 8GB of RAM, multiple monitors, cross-fired video cards, my own UPS (uninterruptable power supply) -- some of the most demanding Engineering software in the world doesn't crash my system -- but NinjaTrader somehow manages to crash itself constantly.

Listen to me:

When it comes to managing your own real money, I don't see how it can even be debated that platform stability is essential. I can not trust NinjaTrader to even run correctly -- let alone entrust it to trade for me.

The truth is that you can't trust it, either.

And if you've used it enough, you know it.

Those of you who are thinking about using NinjaTrader to automatize trading for you need to really think twice -- no joke, here. The "software" NinjaTrader sells is, in my opinion, the junkiest, buggiest, piece of amateurish crap I've seen in quite some time -- maybe all the way back to the spreadsheets of the 1980's. If I had purchased it, I would literally file a suit at law to obtain my money back -- and not because I even care about the money: this junk they're selling is pure garbage.

You, as a trader, deserve better. And you should NOT settle for this kind of shoddy, second-rate crap to trade with.

Mike, thanks for creating a very cool forum here, and thanks for all the free indicators and advice. It's a very cool thing you've put together here for everybody, no question about it.

But the sad truth is that NinjaTrader, as a platform, isn't worthy of all of this effort.

It's junk.


Reply With Quote
  #674 (permalink)
 NickA 
London
 
Experience: None
Platform: MC & Ninja mainly
Posts: 135 since Jan 2010
Thanks Given: 5
Thanks Received: 50


MetalTrade View Post
hi

it's not a problem in the coding it's a problem in the deal NT made because of the patent with TT

I think that's what NT is trying to say

Such a shame with a patent that was always pretty dubious imho. I can completely understand why ninja acquiesced, some much larger companies got embroiled in what I guess was expensive litigation.

It always struck me very like the Microsoft Apple look and feel lawsuits where A court ruled that, Apple could not get patent-like protection for the idea of a graphical user interface. Just as there was nothing new with a DOM there was nothing new in Apple & MS's operating systems (Xerox had done it all before). Seems to me a DOM is very much a Graphical User Interface.

I also seem to remember that TT pursued the exchanges at one point asking for a surcharge on every single transaction. Their argument being that as the exchange could not sure that any particular trade infringed there (dubious) patent they should extract a fee from all trades and pass it on just to be safe. (The threat was just to be safe from litigation of course).

OK, I'll get off my soapbox now.

Reply With Quote
  #675 (permalink)
 NickA 
London
 
Experience: None
Platform: MC & Ninja mainly
Posts: 135 since Jan 2010
Thanks Given: 5
Thanks Received: 50


Mindset View Post
As a balance to this harsh treatment of NT.... what else is out there that does all this backtesting stuff that you want to do?

snip

To be fair most 'off the shelf' packages have various issues of one sort or the other dealing with tick data properly (especially historical). Ninja is what it is. If you want to work at tick level precision your choices are fairly limited. Having said that 'robust' trumps all imho!

Reply With Quote
  #676 (permalink)
 
monpere's Avatar
 monpere 
Bala, PA, USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: Mirus, IB
Trading: SPY, Oil, Euro
Posts: 1,854 since Jul 2010
Thanks Given: 300
Thanks Received: 3,371


NickA View Post
Such a shame with a patent that was always pretty dubious imho. I can completely understand why ninja acquiesced, some much larger companies got embroiled in what I guess was expensive litigation.

It always struck me very like the Microsoft Apple look and feel lawsuits where A court ruled that, Apple could not get patent-like protection for the idea of a graphical user interface. Just as there was nothing new with a DOM there was nothing new in Apple & MS's operating systems (Xerox had done it all before). Seems to me a DOM is very much a Graphical User Interface.

I also seem to remember that TT pursued the exchanges at one point asking for a surcharge on every single transaction. Their argument being that as the exchange could not sure that any particular trade infringed there (dubious) patent they should extract a fee from all trades and pass it on just to be safe. (The threat was just to be safe from litigation of course).

OK, I'll get off my soapbox now.

I don't know how TT was able to get away with this. I have always been personally outraged by that idea, it is downright extortion, and for that I will never use any TT product. If we all boycott them, then let's see how much their patent is worth.

Reply With Quote
  #677 (permalink)
 MetalTrade 
 
Posts: 1,055 since May 2010

Monpere, I have to disagree with you.

They invented the DOM.

How would you feel when you think and create something and then your competitor says: oh this is nice, let me program the same. That's not how Intellectual Copyright works in our Western world.

Copying everybody else ideas works in other countries but it's resulting in lack of innovation.

Last time we got something useful newly invented from China was 1500 years ago.

Reply With Quote
  #678 (permalink)
 
monpere's Avatar
 monpere 
Bala, PA, USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: Mirus, IB
Trading: SPY, Oil, Euro
Posts: 1,854 since Jul 2010
Thanks Given: 300
Thanks Received: 3,371


MetalTrade View Post
Monpere, I have to disagree with you.

They invented the DOM.

How would you feel when you think and create something and then your competitor says: oh this is nice, let me program the same. That's not how Intellectual Copyright works in our Western world.

Copying everybody else ideas works in other countries but it's resulting in lack of innovation.

Last time we got something useful newly invented from China was 1500 years ago.

I understand that they are in business to make money, and have the right to profit for their original work, but I think the TT leadership have a predator mentality, trying to wield legal advantage to squeeze money out of every avenue they can think of. Going as far as trying to charge the exchanges just because the end user may or may not be using a static dom? That is not just capitalistic anymore, that is predatory. Who do you think is paying for all those fees they are charging? And, I think we can all agree that TT is not charging everybody and their brother because they want to foster innovation from their competitors, they just want to rape everybody.

Reply With Quote
  #679 (permalink)
 
ThatManFromTexas's Avatar
 ThatManFromTexas 
Houston,Tx
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: Mirus Futures/Zen-Fire
Trading: TF
Posts: 2,265 since Feb 2010
Thanks Given: 1,206
Thanks Received: 4,348


MetalTrade View Post
Monpere, I have to disagree with you.

They invented the DOM.

How would you feel when you think and create something and then your competitor says: oh this is nice, let me program the same. That's not how Intellectual Copyright works in our Western world.

Copying everybody else ideas works in other countries but it's resulting in lack of innovation.

Last time we got something useful newly invented from China was 1500 years ago.

@MetalTrade

I agree with you... as long as the patent is legitimate.

Case in point;

NTP filed suit against RIM (BlackBerry) for $1 billion dollars and got an injunction that would have forced RIM to stop doing business in the US until the suit was settled. The suit hinged on an obscure patent that NTP had bought.

Facing being shutdown, RIM settled the case for $615 million.

Several weeks later the patent office issued its second final rejection on NTP's patents -- meaning that it was almost to the point where the patents were ruled invalid.

I'm just a simple man trading a simple plan.

My daddy always said, "Every day above ground is a good day!"
Reply With Quote
  #680 (permalink)
 MetalTrade 
 
Posts: 1,055 since May 2010


Yes, I agree it's not an easy call.

But in the case of the DOM. It's clearly an invention by Trading Technologies and copied without shame by anybody who makes a trading program.

I hate paying the extremely high x-trader fee, but the X-trader dom works just so darned good. I understand they sue anybody around there about it. I would do just the same when everybody in the business copied my idea, and if I would have the funds for it. You could also reverse it, and say x-trader is so expensive because they have to sue everybody.

Reply With Quote




Last Updated on April 22, 2017


© 2024 NexusFi™, s.a., All Rights Reserved.
Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama City, Panama, Ph: +507 833-9432 (Panama and Intl), +1 888-312-3001 (USA and Canada)
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice. There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
About Us - Contact Us - Site Rules, Acceptable Use, and Terms and Conditions - Privacy Policy - Downloads - Top
no new posts