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NT7 problem

  #1 (permalink)
 George P 
Ath. Gr.
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: ES, 6E
Posts: 40 since Nov 2016

NinjaTrader NT7 will be DEAD afer a few years ! Do you, Ninja traders, around the world, know ? Are you awared about this issue ?? I have been very recently informed about that ! Nobody (neither Ninja) told me about it when I invested my money on Ninja platform a few years ago. And I am sure most of the traders worlwide knew NOTHING about that. I should have been notified (by Ninja) WELL IN ADVANCE for that. Many of my NT7 indicators and strategies will be obsolete/garbage after a few years because of this situation or at least will require a lot of effort, money and time to be operative in the new NT8 enviroment (if they will be, who knows!). I dont want (and I cannot afford) to work again from "scratch" all this work I 've done for years (working many hours per day) on NT7 platform and s/w in order to create my indicators and strategies which will not be working on NT8 s/w (ot any other Ninja's next version) and/or pay again those vendors (fortheir NT8 new indicators and strategies) who I alraedy paid and who are not willing to issue and give me, without extra money, their NT8 indicators/strategies versions. So, after a few years NT7 will be DEAD and everything I have done so far will be LOST, all my money, all my work, will be LOST. If I knew this IN ADVANCE I would certainly would not invested my money and time to Ninja, I would go somewhere else. I would have bought something which I could have it working for many years, for as long as I wanted, or, if that was not the case I would certainly choose to invest my money somewhere else where I could get from profits for much longer time. As far as I know many traders around the world have the same opinion as mine, even in this forum. Many traders already expressed their (similar) surprises and opinions about this issue. This is a big damage to me, and I think to many others. So, I wonder if there is some kind of misleading (or other crime) regarding this damage and situation. I wonder what will happen, if traders around the world start legal actions for any of their damage against whoever is or will be considered as responsible for this situation. The good thing about Ninja is that they try to offer "some" partila solutions to some issues relating to this problem, but, as far as I know, there is no FINAL solution which solves completely all these problems. Personally I think Ninja people are technically capable to offer a final solution for those traders who do not want to switch to their NT8 version and want to continue to NT7 , but I have not seen yet this "final" solution so far and I dont know if and when ther will be a TOTAL FINAL SOLUTION (even with a small fee). So, I urge Ninja to do their best to offer to the worldwide Ninjatraders this final solution. And I ask all Ninjatraders to express their opinions openly and freely. We are the people and we have the POWER to make things done !
Thanks.

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  #4 (permalink)
 
rleplae's Avatar
 rleplae 
Gits (Hooglede) Belgium
Legendary Market Wizard
 
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Broker: Ninjabrokerage/IQfeed + Synthetic datafeed
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The path is at least a few years, as I understood it.

Some indicators exist already and many are coming.
There is no urge to migrate, each can do it as his tempo

I do understand your frustration, but don't over-dramatize, while NT8 has still a way to go to be 100% stable
the multi-threading is a major step forward and will compensate you for the migration effort in the long run..

I would recommend to make a list of what you have on your plate, see what is available and what not

It is very human to be against any 'change', there has been full libraries written on change management
and people being averse to change. Image we were still running NT 6 on windows 5, that would have meant
not advantage of the new intel/amd hardware with 8 or 20 cores..

We need to move on with the time and from time to time change and adapt..

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  #5 (permalink)
 
davidfa's Avatar
 davidfa 
Barcelona / Spain
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT
Broker: ZenFire
Trading: CL
Posts: 118 since Feb 2010
Thanks Given: 366
Thanks Received: 148

Hi George,
I support your request.

I am starting to hate NinjaTrader service and software that acquired many years ago.
I remember when they launched NT7 version.. we then needed more than 2 patch-updates to have an stable version. It was a must to keep version 6 installed if you wanted to have a backup solution.

Then for some time it was working kinda normally
But there are many issues that we NT users know we must go through the known workarounds to keep it working as expected.

I fear the change to NT8.
And I have to find that lot of time needed to migrate indicators and setup everything on the new platform.

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  #6 (permalink)
 
xplorer's Avatar
 xplorer 
London UK
Site Moderator
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: CQG
Broker: S5
Trading: Futures
Posts: 5,944 since Sep 2015
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George P View Post
NinjaTrader NT7 will be DEAD afer a few years ! Do you, Ninja traders, around the world, know ? Are you awared about this issue ?? I have been very recently informed about that ! Nobody (neither Ninja) told me about it when I invested my money on Ninja platform a few years ago. And I am sure most of the traders worlwide knew NOTHING about that. I should have been notified (by Ninja) WELL IN ADVANCE for that. Many of my NT7 indicators and strategies will be obsolete/garbage after a few years because of this situation or at least will require a lot of effort, money and time to be operative in the new NT8 enviroment (if they will be, who knows!). I dont want (and I cannot afford) to work again from "scratch" all this work I 've done for years (working many hours per day) on NT7 platform and s/w in order to create my indicators and strategies which will not be working on NT8 s/w (ot any other Ninja's next version) and/or pay again those vendors (fortheir NT8 new indicators and strategies) who I alraedy paid and who are not willing to issue and give me, without extra money, their NT8 indicators/strategies versions. So, after a few years NT7 will be DEAD and everything I have done so far will be LOST, all my money, all my work, will be LOST. If I knew this IN ADVANCE I would certainly would not invested my money and time to Ninja, I would go somewhere else. I would have bought something which I could have it working for many years, for as long as I wanted, or, if that was not the case I would certainly choose to invest my money somewhere else where I could get from profits for much longer time. As far as I know many traders around the world have the same opinion as mine, even in this forum. Many traders already expressed their (similar) surprises and opinions about this issue. This is a big damage to me, and I think to many others. So, I wonder if there is some kind of misleading (or other crime) regarding this damage and situation. I wonder what will happen, if traders around the world start legal actions for any of their damage against whoever is or will be considered as responsible for this situation. The good thing about Ninja is that they try to offer "some" partila solutions to some issues relating to this problem, but, as far as I know, there is no FINAL solution which solves completely all these problems. Personally I think Ninja people are technically capable to offer a final solution for those traders who do not want to switch to their NT8 version and want to continue to NT7 , but I have not seen yet this "final" solution so far and I dont know if and when ther will be a TOTAL FINAL SOLUTION (even with a small fee). So, I urge Ninja to do their best to offer to the worldwide Ninjatraders this final solution. And I ask all Ninjatraders to express their opinions openly and freely. We are the people and we have the POWER to make things done !
Thanks.

Hi,

Please can you avoid posting the same content in duplicate threads




I understand your concerns but once expressed, that should be sufficient to attract people's comments.

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  #7 (permalink)
 George P 
Ath. Gr.
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: ES, 6E
Posts: 40 since Nov 2016


xplorer View Post
Hi,

Please can you avoid posting the same content in duplicate threads




I understand your concerns but once expressed, that should be sufficient to attract people's comments.


Hi,

this is my explanation :
when I posted my first thread I cheched out if my message was actually/correctly posted but I did not see my thread. I supposed that I made some posting mistake. This is why I posted again. I then checked again, and this time I saw my posted message. Please dont make quick conclusions about me. Sometimes there is a logical explanation.
Thanks anyway for yr reply.

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  #8 (permalink)
 George P 
Ath. Gr.
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: ES, 6E
Posts: 40 since Nov 2016


rleplae View Post
The path is at least a few years, as I understood it.

Some indicators exist already and many are coming.
There is no urge to migrate, each can do it as his tempo

I do understand your frustration, but don't over-dramatize, while NT8 has still a way to go to be 100% stable
the multi-threading is a major step forward and will compensate you for the migration effort in the long run..

I would recommend to make a list of what you have on your plate, see what is available and what not

It is very human to be against any 'change', there has been full libraries written on change management
and people being averse to change. Image we were still running NT 6 on windows 5, that would have meant
not advantage of the new intel/amd hardware with 8 or 20 cores..

We need to move on with the time and from time to time change and adapt..

Hi,

thanks for yr reply.
I dont want any such "compensation" as you said, because I dont want to make this HUGE EFFORD with MY MONEY AND MY TIME, and, finally,spending (again) MY LIFE. I suppose very few NT7 trader will be willing to spend their life and money to do Ninja's job. I prefer Ninja to offer to NT7 traders this migration effort. They are capable and they are very good in doing what they decide to do.
Futhermore, in yr reply you do not answer on one CRITICAL point of my thread: Why Ninja did NOT tell this story IN ADVANCE , from the VERY BEGINNING, to ALL traders, so them to freely decide if they would want to make their initial investments - under these terms and conditions - or not. Nobody says (nor me, of course) that we must not go forward. Yes we can and we will. But this is a completely irrelevant story. On this forward path/process the rules of the game and the intentions must be clarified from the begining to everybody interested. Right ? Who and when (and to whom) made this clarification ? Tradersalready spent their own money, and they invested on the basis of good faith. I wonder if this faith and trust was fully respected and satisfied by the responsible people. This is my opinion based on etchics, values and principles. I am sure you (and most of the world) have the same values.

Thanks

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  #9 (permalink)
 
rleplae's Avatar
 rleplae 
Gits (Hooglede) Belgium
Legendary Market Wizard
 
Experience: Master
Platform: NinjaTrader, Proprietary,
Broker: Ninjabrokerage/IQfeed + Synthetic datafeed
Trading: 6A, 6B, 6C, 6E, 6J, 6S, ES, NQ, YM, AEX, CL, NG, ZB, ZN, ZC, ZS, GC
Posts: 3,003 since Sep 2013
Thanks Given: 2,442
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George P View Post
Hi,

thanks for yr reply.
I dont want any such "compensation" as you said, because I dont want to make this HUGE EFFORD with MY MONEY AND MY TIME, and, finally,spending (again) MY LIFE. I suppose very few NT7 trader will be willing to spend their life and money to do Ninja's job. I prefer Ninja to offer to NT7 traders this migration effort. They are capable and they are very good in doing what they decide to do.
Futhermore, in yr reply you do not answer on one CRITICAL point of my thread: Why Ninja did NOT tell this story IN ADVANCE , from the VERY BEGINNING, to ALL traders, so them to freely decide if they would want to make their initial investments - under these terms and conditions - or not. Nobody says (nor me, of course) that we must not go forward. Yes we can and we will. But this is a completely irrelevant story. On this forward path/process the rules of the game and the intentions must be clarified from the begining to everybody interested. Right ? Who and when (and to whom) made this clarification ? Tradersalready spent their own money, and they invested on the basis of good faith. I wonder if this faith and trust was fully respected and satisfied by the responsible people. This is my opinion based on etchics, values and principles. I am sure you (and most of the world) have the same values.

Thanks

I understand your point.

NT 8.0 has been announced for at least 2/3 years, i have always read that the upgrade would require some rewrite of indicators. I know there was also an important jump from NT 6 to NT 7 in the past.

Would you been happy if the NT8 had been 100% back-ward compatible ?

In software it is quite common that after 5 years or 10 years, there is a major change.
This is the case also for hardware and Operating system.

I am already very happy that the NT 8 is available to all users free of charge, this is not always the case
with other software vendors, like Microsoft just to name one of them ...

I have been building the last 2 years with NT 8 coming in mind, i took some decisions that will allow
me to migrate smoothly, but that is not on my radar now as an urgent to-do.

In your case, your NT 7 will just keep working. I have not seen an end-date been announced.
I remember a communication that both version will co-exist for a long period.

On what time horizon do you see an issue ?

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  #10 (permalink)
 
xplorer's Avatar
 xplorer 
London UK
Site Moderator
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: CQG
Broker: S5
Trading: Futures
Posts: 5,944 since Sep 2015
Thanks Given: 15,447
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George P View Post
one CRITICAL point of my thread: Why Ninja did NOT tell this story IN ADVANCE , from the VERY BEGINNING, to ALL traders, so them to freely decide if they would want to make their initial investments

I understand how this may be viewed as an issue. However the reason why software manufactures (including Ninjatrader) are unable to support earlier versions in perpetuity is simply down to two factors

Progress
Most people tend to move on to newer versions of software products as time passes. In most cases the newer versions offer features that are not available in previous releases. Most importantly, newer software takes advantage of hardware features that were not available even 1-2 years earlier.

Cost
It would be impractical for SW manufacturers to still support versions from, say, 10 years ago. The costs involved would not justify the effort, especially given the first point, when the vast majority of users no longer uses the early product.


Do I agree with this model? Not necessarily. Do I understand why it's in place? Yes I do.

As rleplae pointed out, this is simply a price to pay for progress.

Having said that, nothing prevents you from not migrating. What I do when I want to stick with a certain SW product that is now obsolete is, I save the install executable files so in the event I have to reinstall it, I can. So even when, in a distant future, NT7 may no longer be around, you could still use it.

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