Applying Fibonacci Cluster and Confluence Zones - NinjaTrader | futures io social day trading
futures io futures trading


Applying Fibonacci Cluster and Confluence Zones
Updated: Views / Replies:74,711 / 182
Created: by Fat Tails Attachments:103

Welcome to futures io.

(If you already have an account, login at the top of the page)

futures io is the largest futures trading community on the planet, with over 90,000 members. At futures io, our goal has always been and always will be to create a friendly, positive, forward-thinking community where members can openly share and discuss everything the world of trading has to offer. The community is one of the friendliest you will find on any subject, with members going out of their way to help others. Some of the primary differences between futures io and other trading sites revolve around the standards of our community. Those standards include a code of conduct for our members, as well as extremely high standards that govern which partners we do business with, and which products or services we recommend to our members.

At futures io, our focus is on quality education. No hype, gimmicks, or secret sauce. The truth is: trading is hard. To succeed, you need to surround yourself with the right support system, educational content, and trading mentors Ė all of which you can find on futures io, utilizing our social trading environment.

With futures io, you can find honest trading reviews on brokers, trading rooms, indicator packages, trading strategies, and much more. Our trading review process is highly moderated to ensure that only genuine users are allowed, so you donít need to worry about fake reviews.

We are fundamentally different than most other trading sites:
  • We are here to help. Just let us know what you need.
  • We work extremely hard to keep things positive in our community.
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendors advertising in posts.
  • We firmly believe in and encourage sharing. The holy grail is within you, we can help you find it.
  • We expect our members to participate and become a part of the community. Help yourself by helping others.

You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community.  It's free and simple.

-- Big Mike, Site Administrator

Reply
 103  
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
 

Applying Fibonacci Cluster and Confluence Zones

  #161 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
DELRAY BEACH
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader/MT4
Favorite Futures: Gold,Eur/USD
 
Posts: 41 since Jun 2012
Thanks: 19 given, 15 received

I agree with Big Mike

I have reads both Carolyns and Miners book and I not only agree with Big Mike that Carolyn's book is simpler and clearer. I have 2 beefs with Miner:

1-His book is in part an infomercial to buy his software package. Not cheap, either!

2-He gives no free trial on the package and it seems overly complicated and as Mike points out, it has simplified Elliot Wave jammed in there and I do mean "jammed" in there." My brain froze and shut down at that point. I kept seeing "You have performed an illegal operation" sign flashing all night in my dreams. lol

3-I did get a free trial to his newsletter and he was way, way off on his S&P and Gold predictions. I dont know for sure but I get the feeling Carolyn touts him because maybe he was her mentor, or maybe she gets a piece of his action, whatever. I dont care. I say her book is easier to read, and she isnt selling her own software behind the book and when I got a few of her individual stock picks sent to me on face book, she was right on 5 out of 5. I think anyone can still get her freebies by going to her facebook page and accepting her as a friend. Then you can make up your own mind. Tails, I have to hand it to you, if you find Miners book better, you must have gotten an A in college level mathematics. I'm not that smart! Way too many variables in his book to be able to use it effectively IMHO.

DT50

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to Daytrader50 for this post:
 
  #162 (permalink)
Elite Member
Cape Town, South Africa
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: CQG, Trade Navigator
Favorite Futures: ALSI, Gold
 
Pietvw's Avatar
 
Posts: 8 since Jun 2012
Thanks: 0 given, 10 received


Daytrader50 View Post
Sorry my South african colleague,

I dont agree at all,especially with your 2nd chart. There is way too much space betwwe. 38.2 and 681 for it to be confluence. I also (and so does Carolyn and others) require 3 numbers/liners to be very close together to be confluential. I would say 1/2 an inch between all three lines on a chart like yours. But....your methodology may maek that way of trading profitable for you because you have great entrys and exits. For me, I cant use that. But thanks for posting the charts. You put a lot of time into them. And IMHO thats part of the fib worlds problem. They take too much time. Now...who was saying they know of some good software to "sort this all out?" Please....do tell! Do tell! -)

DT50

Hi DT50

Are you talking about this chart? I have taken out all the other levels.

Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Just to clarify the definition of confluence how I have learned it: it is the close proximity (and this is time frame dependant, since you can't put a % price value on how close they must be - it's a visual thing) of the 38.2% and 61.8% from different reaction points in the same wave. The reaction from it was good, so the market itself confirmed the strenght of the resistance. Maybe we are just looking at 2 completely different requirements and call it the same thing...

The first chart took me very long to create, so I agree with you regarding the time it takes. The second chart took me about 5 seconds to create, since the tool allows you to add different retracements without have to reselect the tool and dragging and dropping. It's a matter of click on the focus point at the bottom, click all the reaction points and your done. This allows for speed especially when trading intraday. I can vouch for that, since I operate in the 5min world mostly and the speed of the tool allows you to do what others can't.

P

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to Pietvw for this post:
 
  #163 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
DELRAY BEACH
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader/MT4
Favorite Futures: Gold,Eur/USD
 
Posts: 41 since Jun 2012
Thanks: 19 given, 15 received

My result on the EUR/USD


To make matters worse I just now got stopped out on the EUR/USD 60 min chart at 1.2683 where I was long the Euro and had quadruple confluence support under the .382.--- 2 retracements on the 60m, 1 ext on the 60, and one retracement on the 5m. I had just a 25 pip stop putting my stop under the .382 after it broke thru the .618. Im going to bed. F. ME!

Reply With Quote
 
  #164 (permalink)
Site Administrator
Manta, Ecuador
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Favorite Futures: E-mini ES S&P 500
 
Big Mike's Avatar
 
Posts: 46,240 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 29,352 given, 83,230 received


Daytrader50 View Post
I have reads both Carolyns and Miners book and I not only agree with Big Mike that Carolyn's book is simpler and clearer. I have 2 beefs with Miner:

1-His book is in part an infomercial to buy his software package. Not cheap, either!

2-He gives no free trial on the package and it seems overly complicated and as Mike points out

You are confusing me with someone else. I have never read any of this stuff or ever been to this vendors website, nor have any interest in it.

Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

Reply With Quote
 
  #165 (permalink)
Elite Member
Berlin, Europe
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, MultiCharts
Broker/Data: Interactive Brokers
Favorite Futures: Keyboard
 
Fat Tails's Avatar
 
Posts: 9,653 since Mar 2010
Thanks: 4,226 given, 25,601 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary


Daytrader50 View Post
To make matters worse I just now got stopped out on the EUR/USD 60 min chart at 1.2683 where I was long the Euro and had quadruple confluence support under the .382.--- 2 retracements on the 60m, 1 ext on the 60, and one retracement on the 5m. I had just a 25 pip stop putting my stop under the .382 after it broke thru the .618. Im going to bed. F. ME!

I do not know, where your confluence line are. Below I have labelled the lines on my chart for 6E 09-12

1. fib confluence (1.2759), floor pivot R3 (1.2755)
2. fib confluence (1.2734)
3. floor pivot R2 (1.2716)
4. fib confluence (1.2695)
5. floor pivot R1 (1.2681)
6. fib confluence (1.2669)
7. pivot range, floor pivot PP (1.2642)
8. fib confluence (1.2632)


Detailed analysis of the confluence: For the detailed analysis of confluence I take into account the higher timeframe fibonacci lines.

1a) draw a swing from the high of June 11 (1.2695) down to the low of June 12 (1.2468) and calculate the 127.2% expansion, which comes out at 1.2757. Expansions are generally more powerful than retracements.

1b) look at the two prior swing moves, the last upswing from May 31 to June 8 was a move of 382 pips, the prior upswing between April 13 and May 1 was a move of 287 pips. Add the 287 pips to the last low which came out at 1.2468 on June 12, and you get a target of 1.2468 + 0.0287 = 1.2755. The analysis uses mergebackadjusted data to avoid the rollover gaps. For alternates I generally use higher timeframes than for expansions.

2a) draw a swing from the high that occured on March 29 (1.3416) down to the low from June 1 (1.2313) and calculate the 38.2% retracement, which comes out at 1.2734.

2b) use the fib projection tool and apply it to the low from June 5 and the high of June 7, the calculate the 38.2% extension which comes out at 1.2735

4) the high from June 11 is a S/R line on its own right

6a) the prior low from May 18 was at 1.2669

6b) a measured move calculated from today's high brings us down to 1.2672

8a) the 61.8% retracement from the last upswing that started on Jun 14 allows us to establish support at 1.2632

8b) the support is reinforced by the high from June 13, which was at 1.2636


Now keep in mind that price is primarily driven by buyers and sellers, and that Fibonacci confluence only works, if the buyers and sellers use them to guide their buying and selling decisions. Not all traders care about these lines, so watching them may give you an edge, but it is in no way easy to exploit the edge.


Chart Gallery with Explanations:

Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).

Reply With Quote
The following 4 users say Thank You to Fat Tails for this post:
 
  #166 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
DELRAY BEACH
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader/MT4
Favorite Futures: Gold,Eur/USD
 
Posts: 41 since Jun 2012
Thanks: 19 given, 15 received

Mark Braun vs Carolyn, Robert Miner and Scott Carney

Mark Braun : Has more detail in his course and gives you 2 weeks free trial in his room and he is there all day from mkt open to close. He prefers s&p futures but will look at any future or Forex pair anyone requests and give very detailed analysis for whatever time frame you choose although he is a daytrader, by choice. Only will give an opinion or take a trade if many fib numbers from different time frames or points are on his chart.

Carolyn Borodyn: I don't buy that she trained Mark. He never said that nor did he say she trained him. Her big plus is she has a book that gives you " All you ever wanted to know about fibs but were afraid to ask" in one book. Mark does not have any book. He has looooooong boring courses but they may or may not be better. Use your judgement. Also, she seems to prefer individual stocks. There may be free picks on her Facebook page you can subscribe to. Carolyn and Mark's work are very similar. I think while she praises Miner, she secretly likes Mark's work better as they are too similar for it to be coincidental.

Scott Carney: I was not impressed at his 65% or so return for his newsletter or service when it we dont know how many instruments or time frames had to be watched all year to get that number. His methods which are based on Gartley and other patterns are way too dry and complicated for me.

Robert Miner: He gives no free trial to anything from what I remember and I think he purposely over complicates Fib work with time analysis.(Maybe this is why Carolyn seems bored with trading according to one BM member) He is too commercial sounding to me. I read some of his book and almost dozed off several times.

IMHO: Go with Marks course or Carolyn's book. If neither of these 2 fell like a fit, forget Fibs, they aren't for you. Just my 2 cents from 3 years of following both of them, mostly Mark. I admit I wish I had 3 years of stats on both of them for their one top play in their day trading and also swing trading on daily charts. I'd kill if anyone could give me that one! -)

Reply With Quote
 
  #167 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
DELRAY BEACH
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader/MT4
Favorite Futures: Gold,Eur/USD
 
Posts: 41 since Jun 2012
Thanks: 19 given, 15 received

Mark will email you in the middle of any trading day....

As an aside,

When I was in Marks room he was willing to email me answers to my questions if he couldnt answer them in the room at any time of the trading day and even after hours. I dont know about Carolyns room doing this as I didnt stay there long enough. Bad move on my part.

Reply With Quote
 
  #168 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
DELRAY BEACH
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader/MT4
Favorite Futures: Gold,Eur/USD
 
Posts: 41 since Jun 2012
Thanks: 19 given, 15 received

We must get 3 fib numbers within 1/2 inch to form reliable cluster!

Another thing is, I dont understand why it seems so,so difficult to find 3 different clusters that are 1/2 inch or l;ess apart(thats the definition of a cluster to most of us including carolyn and mark) This can be 3 different pivot points on one time frame(3 lower lows or higher highs for example) or....it can be from 3 completely different time frames. It is murder to do this manually. ThAts why I keep asking everyone: IS THERE A WAY TO DEVELOP SOFTWARE THAT WILL DO THIS AND HOPEFULLY UPDATE IT IN REAL TIME????????????? This is the key to our dreams of really making fib ext.'s and retracements work, with enough clusters to make a living regardless of whether you trade on very short time frames 2 min or under, medium day trading times like 5 up tp 15 min. Or on 60 min and longer charts FOR SWING TRADING! ( or even renko or volume bars!)

To me, the ultimate would be to have a couple of longer term swing trades on, on lets say 2 different currency pairs, have a 5 min time frame as your main daytrading chart for gold and maybe even a 1 or 2 min chart for oil and then perhaps a 15 min chart for 2 day holds on SPY or ES.

This would allow one to pull money out both daily for income and also for longer term for the bulk of your yearly profit!

But you cant trade 2 or 3 different time frames or 3 different instruments or stocks if you have to find the clusters!!!!!!!!!!!! THE ENTIRE DISCUSSION ON FIB WORK MUST BE CENTERED ON ADDRESSING THIS. Then we could all share some very simple entry tools like breaks of moving averages or CCI, or stochastics or anything very very simple to be used on all time frames. Exits could be taken care of by themselves when the 1.618 comes! IT "IS' THAT SIMPLE!

I suggest all of you to take trials with Fibonacci trader software which is the best fib software you can get a free trial on and Mark Braun uses it exclusively and has profited for years from it. Then get back to me or the thread and we can maybe form our own group or our own chat room. I just did 80% of the work for you guys, someone take the baton and run the final mile. -)

DAYTRADER 50

Reply With Quote
 
  #169 (permalink)
Elite Member
Berlin, Europe
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, MultiCharts
Broker/Data: Interactive Brokers
Favorite Futures: Keyboard
 
Fat Tails's Avatar
 
Posts: 9,653 since Mar 2010
Thanks: 4,226 given, 25,601 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary


Daytrader50 View Post
Another thing is, I dont understand why it seems so,so difficult to find 3 different clusters that are 1/2 inch or l;ess apart(thats the definition of a cluster to most of us including carolyn and mark) This can be 3 different pivot points on one time frame(3 lower lows or higher highs for example) or....it can be from 3 completely different time frames. It is murder to do this manually. ThAts why I keep asking everyone: IS THERE A WAY TO DEVELOP SOFTWARE THAT WILL DO THIS AND HOPEFULLY UPDATE IT IN REAL TIME????????????? This is the key to our dreams of really making fib ext.'s and retracements work, with enough clusters to make a living regardless of whether you trade on very short time frames 2 min or under, medium day trading times like 5 up tp 15 min. Or on 60 min and longer charts FOR SWING TRADING! ( or even renko or volume bars!)

To me, the ultimate would be to have a couple of longer term swing trades on, on lets say 2 different currency pairs, have a 5 min time frame as your main daytrading chart for gold and maybe even a 1 or 2 min chart for oil and then perhaps a 15 min chart for 2 day holds on SPY or ES.

This would allow one to pull money out both daily for income and also for longer term for the bulk of your yearly profit!

But you cant trade 2 or 3 different time frames or 3 different instruments or stocks if you have to find the clusters!!!!!!!!!!!! THE ENTIRE DISCUSSION ON FIB WORK MUST BE CENTERED ON ADDRESSING THIS. Then we could all share some very simple entry tools like breaks of moving averages or CCI, or stochastics or anything very very simple to be used on all time frames. Exits could be taken care of by themselves when the 1.618 comes! IT "IS' THAT SIMPLE!

I suggest all of you to take trials with Fibonacci trader software which is the best fib software you can get a free trial on and Mark Braun uses it exclusively and has profited for years from it. Then get back to me or the thread and we can maybe form our own group or our own chat room. I just did 80% of the work for you guys, someone take the baton and run the final mile. -)

DAYTRADER 50

The FibonacciTrader is a good but dated software package. I do respect Robert Krausz for his numerous contributions to technical analysis.

But there is nothing that this software package offers that you cannot do with a modern software like NinjaTrader.

Can you tell me a reason why I should use an outdated software package from the Nineties?

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to Fat Tails for this post:
 
  #170 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
DELRAY BEACH
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader/MT4
Favorite Futures: Gold,Eur/USD
 
Posts: 41 since Jun 2012
Thanks: 19 given, 15 received

Why is ninja platform better for fibs?????


First let me say guys that Carolyn Boroden is having a free webinar tomorrow at 3:3-0 est on fibs. Lets all check it out as she bases all her work on clusters.

Secondly tails, Im not sure I agree. I just got rid of NT because it wouldnt do much for me in fibs except let me plot the same 3 things all fib programs do. FT however uses 3 timeframes although only one is shown to do their calculatiuons.(i dont understand it perfectly yet but im digging.) so...tell me why NT is better?) At least let the newbies get a free week trial there and judge for themselves,right?

DT

Reply With Quote

Reply



futures io > > > > Applying Fibonacci Cluster and Confluence Zones

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Upcoming Webinars and Events (4:30PM ET unless noted)

Jigsaw Trading: TBA

Elite only

FuturesTrader71: TBA

Elite only

NinjaTrader: TBA

Jan 18

RandBots: TBA

Jan 23

GFF Brokers & CME Group: Futures & Bitcoin

Elite only

Adam Grimes: TBA

Elite only

Ran Aroussi: TBA

Elite only
     

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Jackson Zones max-td The Elite Circle 32 July 8th, 2012 01:42 AM
Complex Cluster Indicators sidney7g MetaTrader 8 April 8th, 2012 02:35 PM
Excel for updating zones Avartanian EasyLanguage Programming 2 August 25th, 2011 02:35 PM
High degree of confluence in CL GaryD Commodities Futures Trading 26 July 23rd, 2011 02:01 AM
Fib confluence philloo The Elite Circle 19 May 9th, 2010 10:47 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:35 AM.

Copyright © 2017 by futures io, s.a., Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama, +507 833-9432, info@futures.io
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice.
There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
no new posts
Page generated 2017-12-14 in 0.17 seconds with 20 queries on phoenix via your IP 54.221.76.68