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Release date for NinjaTrader 8
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Release date for NinjaTrader 8

  #21 (permalink)
Site Administrator
Manta, Ecuador
 
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Everyone relax...

There is more than one platform out there, everyone can find the one that is best for them and then carry on with their career...

Some of the "tone" of this thread is quickly deteriorating and unwelcome on futures.io (formerly BMT).

Keep things factual and polite and without being condescending and we are good to continue.

My grandma always told me you'll catch more flies with honey than vinegar, or something like that... If you want the value of your lifetime license to increase then I think you should find a better way to get Ray on your side than by attacking him.

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  #22 (permalink)
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Indianapolis, IN USA
 
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Traderji View Post
Who said anything attacking any individual?

As paid customer of Ninjatrader (the company) I can't even make a criticism on the lack of any upgrades without being accused of attacking the character of the CEO? What the hell?

I hate this culture of mindless adulation.

Actually, it's not your criticism in isolation that's the problem. The problem is that there are a ton of posts that put NinjaTrader down in one form or another. In many cases, those posts do, in fact, insult the company, it's leadership, their business model, etc. And in the overwhelming majority of cases, the problem is not NinjaTrader at all - but rather poorly coded indicators and / or inferior end-user technology.

I am amazed that @Big Mike allows this to continue. I have used NinjaTrader for a long time - traded it through countless major news events - and it remains solid as a rock. I love the platform and it is WAY under-priced. Does anyone remember what we had before we had Ninja? Yeah. Thank you NinjaTrader for putting out a great product and continuing to support / improve it.

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  #23 (permalink)
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Here are a couple of things I've asked Ray to consider:

a) Public project management system, tracking feature requests and development, user voting and input, ability to see where ones request stands in the list. He has given me his point of view in response.

b) Multiple 'channels', like a release (stable) channel and a developer or beta channel. Similar to Chrome, FireFox, and etc. This way power users can subscribe to frequent updates that might break things but help test for the community, and less technical users can subscribe to the stable but less frequently updated release channel.

c) Incremental releases, like a "dot" release every six months or less with not just bug fixes but significant new development. As an example: NT 8.0 January 1 2014, and NT 8.1 by July 1 2014. Between the two bug fixes would come out weekly or as needed to the beta channel, and then monthly or as needed to the stable channel.

Anyone that knows me knows I've told Ray "how I feel" from time to time in a public fashion. To his credit, Ray has always been receptive. I honestly believe Ray knows his weaknesses already with the gap from 7.0 to 8.0, and instead of harping on them it would be better if everyone instead focused on how to strengthen the product once 8.0 is released.

I've heard him ask for a lot of feedback and input from users in making decisions about 8.0, so I encourage everyone to spend the time and give him that feedback. Not just "I want feature xyz", but why you want it, why you think NT should develop it (vs a third party), and try to always keep in mind both points of view --- the view of the consumer (you) and the view of the developer.

Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
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4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
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  #24 (permalink)
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timefreedom View Post
I am amazed that @Big Mike allows this to continue.

Balancing act

One group of people think I am pro-NT, the other anti-NT, another thinks I am too lenient for allowing users to share their true thoughts, and another thinks I am a forum nazi if I tell people to keep it polite.





Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

Reply With Quote
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  #25 (permalink)
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Big Mike View Post
Balancing act

One group of people think I am pro-NT, the other anti-NT, another thinks I am too lenient for allowing users to share their true thoughts, and another thinks I am a forum nazi if I tell people to keep it polite.





Mike

You do a great job. That's one of the reasons you have the best trading forum on the web.

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  #26 (permalink)
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Traderji View Post
I know you have hundreds of "fans" on this website, who will now come out of the woodwork and accuse me of heinous crimes for having spoken a word against Ninjatrader.

No I will not accuse you of "heinous crimes", but it does seem many users do not realize what efforts are required to add broker services to their products:

Asking any vendor to support a broker is (apparently) asking a lot. Here is an example where Sierra Chart has been asked to support MB Trading (one of the most reputable and popular US-based Forex brokers) and their explanation is a common one among vendors: "Integration to a service is a massive development task which is very costly. This is not something to be taken lightly."

So as Ray mentioned some features/updates could come sooner than later, but broker support seems to be a different issue. Its not the best argument against any trading software vendors product support.

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  #27 (permalink)
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MrYou View Post
No I will not accuse you of "heinous crimes", but it does seem many users do not realize what efforts are required to add broker services to their products:

Asking any vendor to support a broker is (apparently) asking a lot. Here is an example where Sierra Chart has been asked to support MB Trading (one of the most reputable and popular US-based Forex brokers) and their explanation is a common one among vendors: "Integration to a service is a massive development task which is very costly. This is not something to be taken lightly."

So as Ray mentioned some features/updates could come sooner than later, but broker support seems to be a different issue. Its not the best argument against any trading software vendors product support.


Thanks for your post. I think some context is necessary here. In the link you posted, SC rep says the following


Quoting 
We did have a look at the MB Trading trading service interface and we see that they provide nonproprietary OS independent methods of connectivity for trading and market data and this is exactly what we like.

Do not know if you saw our comment about proprietary API components in our prior post that we deleted, but what they offer is good and we will keep the possibility open. It's just right now we are too overburdened take on anything new.


Now when he/she says "It's just right now we are too overburdened take on anything new", in the context of Sierra Charts that is quite likely the exact truth because they iterate their releases so rapidly. They really do push out new stuff at quite a fast rate.

Where as in the case of Ninjatrader, can you honestly say they are so busy with constantly evolving their software they can't take on board user requests? In three years apart from the occasional bug fix, what exactly has been done?

I remember when I saw the futures.io (formerly BMT) webinar of Ray's first preview of NT 8 late last year. I was very excited going into the presentation but I was stunned when I saw how little they had actually accomplished in three years since NT 7. Most of it was just some mock up screenshots. You can't on one hand have nothing to show for years and then on the other hand claim that they are just overloaded with work as an excuse.


@Big Mike This is my last post on the subject. Please don't take it the wrong way but I don't agree with your assertion that I should, to paraphrase, "be nice to Ray".

A) I think that just further illustrates my argument that in the case of NT I, the customer, have zero leverage. The balance of power is completely lopsided and you need to resort to pleading to get what you need.

B) I strongly believe that getting frank feedback from your paying customers is good for any business. While some of the mindless adulation heaped on Ninjatrader might be good for Ray's ego but it needs to be balanced with the occasional brutal honest truth.

In any case, I will cease posting in this thread. Thank you for letting me post my honest opinion.

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  #28 (permalink)
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@Traderji it is not about being nice as much as not being confrontational. Intent is sometimes difficult to follow in forum posts.

I have no issue with a good discussion and debate just want to keep it professional.

Sent from my LG Optimus G Pro

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

Reply With Quote
 
  #29 (permalink)
Elite Member
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@Traderji
>>I remember when I saw the futures.io (formerly BMT) webinar of Ray's first preview of NT 8 late last year. I was very excited going into the presentation but I was stunned when I saw how little they had actually accomplished in three years since NT 7. Most of it was just some mock up screenshots. You can't on one hand have nothing to show for years and then on the other hand claim that they are just overloaded with work as an excuse.<<

Agreed! Those webinars were not very helpful, sorry Mike! I remember mid-2013 being suggested as possible launch date but obviously marketing vaporware. Being nice includes giving useful feedback to Ray. You US guys are far too sensitive.

Thankfully NT7 is fine as it is, so no hurry.

Richard
Hong Kong
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  #30 (permalink)
Site Administrator
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Posts: 46,238 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 29,350 given, 83,217 received


I cannot understand how the three NT8 webinars could be classified as not helpful.

Tons of info is in each that is not published elsewhere.

However, I have found that many users do not pay attention - often and repeatedly asking questions that have been answered. In this case maybe a more laymen user might not appreciate the webinars as much because they were to technical or did not visually demonstrate every new feature.

You can't please everyone... But I for one want to see Ray continue to publish on futures.io (formerly BMT).

Sent from my LG Optimus G Pro

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

Reply With Quote
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