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Intraday RealTime Chart: Indicators show late
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Intraday RealTime Chart: Indicators show late

  #1 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
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Intraday RealTime Chart: Indicators show late

Dear Sir,
I am puzzled how to show indicators on Intraday chart from beginning. I mean, when market opens I open the chart - at 9.15 a.m.. but no indicators are visible on chart till late, not even EMI (5) on a One-minute chart. Indicators start getting visible only after 20 candles .. that means - on 5-min chart indicators become visible after 100 minutes (20candles x 5) and on 3-min chart they become visible after an hour. That is troublesome - how can I do trading in the beginning hours if indicators take so much time to be visible? I tried with indicators like RSI (14), Stochs (14,3) CCI (14) and EMI ( 5/13 ). None start showing on chart till after 20 candles of price move. Perhaps there is something seriously wrong in my setting or the way I am doing thing. I am using Ninjatrader 7 with yahoo connection for Real time Intraday chart - getting data regularly without delay. But somehow indicators do not show up. Please Help so that I could get indicators working from the very beginning (as I see on most charts). Dear friends, Please guide me.

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Intraday RealTime Chart: Indicators show late-capture_001_29082011_115901.jpg   Intraday RealTime Chart: Indicators show late-capture_033_29082011_120141.jpg  
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  #2 (permalink)
Market Wizard
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go to setting increase number of days to load.

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  #3 (permalink)
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NinjaTrader indicators do not display values for the first 20 candles. This is made on purpose, as many of the indicators display false values during the unstable period. Actually it is a bad compromise, as the number of bars required for accurate values depends

-> on the indicator and
-> on the indicator settings, such as the period.

It is technically possible to display indicator values prior to the 20th candle. You would just need to add BarsRequired = 0 in the Initialize() section of the indicator, to display the values beginning with the first candle. However, it does not help you if you display false values during the unstable period of the indicator.

Best you pay yourself a datafeed that comes with historical data, ignore all indicator values for the first 100 bars (value depends on settings) and then use the indicators, when they are stable.

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  #4 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
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Fat Tails View Post
NinjaTrader indicators do not display values for the first 20 candles. This is made on purpose, as many of the indicators display false values during the unstable period. Actually it is a bad compromise, as the number of bars required for accurate values depends

-> on the indicator and
-> on the indicator settings, such as the period.

It is technically possible to display indicator values prior to the 20th candle. You would just need to add BarsRequired = 0 in the Initialize() section of the indicator, to display the values beginning with the first candle. However, it does not help you if you display false values during the unstable period of the indicator.

Best you pay yourself a datafeed that comes with historical data, ignore all indicator values for the first 100 bars (value depends on settings) and then use the indicators, when they are stable.

Thanks Mr Cory and Mr. Hunter-Gatherer for your quick responses. But now it has become enormously more confusing. Sorry for being so ignorant .. i m such a newbie.
As Mr Cory has suggested : "go to setting increase number of days to load." I see that in NT7 default setting is 5 days .. is it not enough to provide suffient candles for an RSI (14) or even EMI (5) to show up from beginning? If not - what is the standard number of days to be there? Should I make it to 20 or 30? Is there a way to calculate it?

Now as per Mr Hunter's suggestion: "ignore all indicator values for the first 100 bars" I am more confused- I tried to google to refresh my idea of bar vs candle vs tick .. At one place I read that bar and candles are just different ways of presentation .. so if I wait for 100 bars on a 5-min chart .. that would mean 500 minute or more than 8 hours .. more than market hours.. How can I ignore 100 bars on an Intraday chart? I am sorry again .. butI am truely puzzled.. by bar do you mean tick? How to ignore 100 bars on NT 7 .. does it show bars anywhere?

Sir, One more thing - you said : "Add Bars Required = 0" .. Do you mean by BarsRequired - "Maximum Bars Look Back" which is set to TwoHundredFiftySix by default? Should Ichange this setting in each indicator? But if an indicator will not look back any bar (=0) how will it show up with proper calculation?

Also - in Indiacator setting under Data - Calculate on Bars close -- Should it be "True" or "false" . I ask because Ihave set them as false in general for all charts after I found that on Daily chart indi9cators are not reaching to last (or latest) candles.

Plz help me about proper standard setting in both DataSeries and Indicators for an Intraday Chart of 3-minute and 5-minute durations. By setting I mean .. not the special parameters of indicators but basic requirement to show them on chart from the opening time of the market to ending time.

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  #5 (permalink)
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ManuAdam View Post
Now as per Mr Hunter's suggestion: "ignore all indicator values for the first 100 bars" I am more confused- I tried to google to refresh my idea of bar vs candle vs tick .. At one place I read that bar and candles are just different ways of presentation .. so if I wait for 100 bars on a 5-min chart .. that would mean 500 minute or more than 8 hours .. more than market hours.. How can I ignore 100 bars on an Intraday chart? I am sorry again .. butI am truely puzzled.. by bar do you mean tick? How to ignore 100 bars on NT 7 .. does it show bars anywhere?

100 bars (or candles) on a 5 min chart would be indeed 500 min. When I open a chart, I tyically want to have 65 days of backfill (or about 11,000 bars) on by chart. Otherwise my indicators do not work properly.

When I switch on my machine, I therefore first update historical data, before I continue with real-time data.

Mathematically a 34 period SMA requires 34 bars. During the first 33 bars - this is the unstable period - all values will be false. For indicators which use a recursive formula such as the EMA, it is more difficult to tell until when the results will be false. My monthly pivots indicator requires 65 days (worst case) to show correct pivots. My FibonacciZones indicator requires 40 days of intraday data to calculate Fibonacci confluence zones.


ManuAdam View Post
Sir, One more thing - you said : "Add Bars Required = 0" .. Do you mean by BarsRequired - "Maximum Bars Look Back" which is set to TwoHundredFiftySix by default? Should Ichange this setting in each indicator? But if an indicator will not look back any bar (=0) how will it show up with proper calculation?

BarsRequired has nothing to do with Bars.MaximumBarsLookBack. BarsRequired is used to suppress the plotting of the indicator values for the first bars. The default value is 20.


ManuAdam View Post
Also - in Indiacator setting under Data - Calculate on Bars close -- Should it be "True" or "false" . I ask because Ihave set them as false in general for all charts after I found that on Daily chart indicators are not reaching to last (or latest) candles.

If you set an indicator to "CalculateOnBarClose = false", it will calculate with each incoming tick. In a fast moving market this may cause NinjaTrader to freeze, so you should only use this setting, if it is absolutely necessary. I would consider it necessary for a volume indicator or an indicator that triggers intra-bar alerts, but not otherwise.


ManuAdam View Post
Plz help me about proper standard setting in both DataSeries and Indicators for an Intraday Chart of 3-minute and 5-minute durations. By setting I mean .. not the special parameters of indicators but basic requirement to show them on chart from the opening time of the market to ending time.

Select an appropriate session template which reflects the opening hours of the market that you want to trade, and attach that template to the instrument via the instrument manager. Then load a couple of days of historical data and your indicators should display correctly.

If you do not want that the SMA takes into accounts yesterday's price, you need to code a special SMA, which will only start calculating with the session begin.

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Intraday charts : Dark clouds of confusions are clearing now

Dear Sir,
Mr Hunter-Gatherer aka Fat Tails you are really amazing. The way you cleared my confusion giving your precious time to give categorical replies and step by step guidelines, I am thankful to you from the core of my heart. Awesome! Thanks to Bigmiketrading forum too - a real lighthouse for lost traveller .. traders like me. I am sure many new traders and users of Ninja Trader 7 will be helped immensely by this. Today I was so happy as I was able to sail through real-time charts with perfect ease and indicators worked like charm from beginning. Yahoo, too, is nowadays working nicely without delay in perfect rhythm with the market. Besides last night I had done complete backfilling for 10 days from Google finance. So now everything is in order as it should be. My setup, though free and may not be so reliable (depending on yahoo and google), is working as good as any paid data feed setup now.
Thanking you once again, sir.
Manu Adam

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