Sosnoff craps on system trading - News and Current Events | futures trading

Sosnoff craps on system trading
Started:August 30th, 2016 (02:40 PM) by Hodon Views / Replies:281 / 3
Last Reply:October 22nd, 2016 (12:50 AM) Attachments:0

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Sosnoff craps on system trading

Old   #1 (permalink)
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Sosnoff craps on system trading

Sosnoff said it a few days ago on Chat With Traders. You can throw out all that quant crap. It doesn't work and never will (not necessarily verbatim but in content).

Tom is a smart guy and I respect what he says but this means nobody is making any money with an algo and it is luck if they are.

I would really like to hear what others think. I am grinding away building strategies and seeing all the activity going on by other very qualified and respected individuals.

How do we embrace Sosnoff and algo trading?

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Old   #2 (permalink)
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Pedro40's Avatar
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Well, pretty much nobody has a positive P/L on Tastytrade, so he isn't the best person to judge others.

Also just because he doesn't know anybody who makes money with system trading, that doesn't mean they don't exist....

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Old   #3 (permalink)
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DionysusToast's Avatar
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I guess you have to quantify the statement.

My estimate is that there are zero people making money from automated systems in NinjaTrader, Tradestation and other retail systems that allow it.

Now - I hold that opinion partly because these platforms put you in a box.
- They do not support spread/arbitrage trading
- They force you into making decisions/backtesting based on price along

So the type of trading you are forced to automate is going to be using historical prices to anticipate a future move.

That's quite different from what HFTs/automated market makers do.

From a longer term perspective, the only person I know that does longer term strategies at a quant firm is trading multi-instrument strategies, so a sort of longer term arbitrage.

So whilst automation is possible - the sort of automation strategies you can employ with retail trading platforms is very specific and not really what is going on (in my experience) in the professional world.

So no backtesting of order flow, no real support for arbitrage, no order book etc. It's very limited. It's basically letting you test combinations of indicators.

If you have any questions about the products or services provided, please send me a Private Message or use the "Ask Me Anything" thread

Last edited by DionysusToast; August 31st, 2016 at 08:06 AM. Reason: cant spell.... ;-)
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Old   #4 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
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He really came off as arrogant and full of himself in that interview. Apparently no trading is profitable except HFT and selling volatility the way Sosnoff does. I wonder if he consulted with Ray Dalio or Jim Simons on that?

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