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MetaTrader 4
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MetaTrader 4

  #11 (permalink)
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MetaTrader or NinjaTrader or…? What/How to choose for spot forex?

Hello Dear Fellow Traders,

I’m not started trading live yet, and I still have to decide which trading platform to use. I have a clean state, so I would use virtually any platform.
I know the vast majority of the traders here use NinjaTrader. I also know it has lots of features, and which is equally important, lots of brokerages offer it as a trading platform to trade through them.

How about MetaTrader?
I plan to trade primarily (but at the start, exclusively) spot forex. Because of this, and because of my pursuit of knowledge, I sometimes read ForexFactory, too. So I know that the vast majority of traders there use MetaTrader. What might be the reasons for this?

· Is it because MetaTrader is known specifically as a forex trading platform? Actually, the most widely known trading platform for forex?
· Or is it because the forex market is unregulated, and the small and little-known brokerage firms (some bucket-shops among them) offer primarily (or only) MetaTrader?
· So does this mean lots of forex traders started to use MetaTrader not because it is any better than for example NinjaTrader, but because this was their only (or best) choice? I mean lots of small forex brokers offer only MetaTrader, so you can’t chose anything else.

Maybe there are some features or advantages of MetaTrader that I don’t know…
I would like you to share your thoughts about this.
I especially would like to read the observations of @Linds and @LukeGeniol, as it seems they have first-hand experiences about MetaTrader.


I repeat, I would exclusively trade spot forex.
How should I choose?
Does MetaTrader offer something that would reason sticking to it?
Or conversely, NinjaTrader offers some things that would reason choosing a broker offering NinjaTrader (even if this considerably narrows down the number of possible brokers)?
Or finally it comes down to matter of taste?

Anyway, I would trade intraday, short time frames. I wouldn’t use fancy indicators or DOM, Market Profile, Volume Ladder, just moving averages.


Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Successful trading to all of you.
Arpad

 
  #12 (permalink)
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Platform: NT, MT4
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· Is it because MetaTrader is known specifically as a forex trading platform? Actually, the most widely known trading platform for forex?
· Or is it because the forex market is unregulated, and the small and little-known brokerage firms (some bucket-shops among them) offer primarily (or only) MetaTrader?
· So does this mean lots of forex traders started to use MetaTrader not because it is any better than for example NinjaTrader, but because this was their only (or best) choice? I mean lots of small forex brokers offer only MetaTrader, so you can’t chose anything else.


It is a widely used platform for Forex but some brokers also have gold, silver , other commodties and indexes available ( the spreads on these are usually crap but the spreads on the major forex pairs are not too bad). IMO it is widely used because it is free and so easy to access. It also has heaps of functionality and support is easy to get. It is not the devil as some will argue - but you have to know its limitations and use a reputable broker. T

Yes Forex is not done on a central exchange. But the bigger MT4 broker use substantial interbank feeds and have 'straight through processing'...if this is the case then they are not the 'bucket shop' variety who take the other side of yout trade etc.

It is not 'better' than Ninjatrader it is very different. I have never used NT for Forex persay - only the currency futures and indexes, so others who have used Ninja for Forex can comment on that.

MT4 will never compete with NT in terms of execution speed and therefore slippage. NT is superior if the instrument is exchange traded. Therefore scalping on low timeframes is not a great strategy on MT4. If you do, then expect a lot of slippage especially if you use market orders and this is especially the case for pairs other than the majors.


Mt4 is a good tool to learn on because you can get free demo platforms and sim trade to developo your plan and hone the execution skills. Then because of the great postion size flexibility on MT4 you can start off at 10c a pip and gadually size up if your result warrant it. If you get anywhere near full lots then it is probably time to seriously look at another platform IMO as the slippage will be costing you a lot.

L


Last edited by Linds; March 24th, 2011 at 02:04 AM.
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  #13 (permalink)
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MT4/MT5 is a VERY Stable platform. If you swingtrade forex, I highly suggest MT4 over any other platform, but if you are scalping, I would avoid it.

The brokers actually have MT4 software on their end and they can manipulate how much slippage to give you and what not. ECN brokers are kind of a farce. I did ECN as well and the fills are terrible except for limit orders etc..

NT has limited Forex feeds or at least they used to! I suggest scalping using the broker interface over MT4.

Good luck!

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  #14 (permalink)
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Elaborating differences, especially position sizing flexibility

Thanks for your valuable inputs!

Guys, excuse me if I seem to be a little slow on the uptake. I just want to know the reasons to make a right decision with which I can live with for an extended time period, without regretting my decision after a while.

@Linds,

· Why haven’t you never used NT for Forex, if, as you say, MT4 will never compete with NT in terms of execution speed and therefore slippage?

· “NT is superior if the instrument is exchange traded.” It’s clear. But if in that case NinjaTrader is superior, why isn’t it superior in case of forex trading?

· scalping on low timeframes is not a great strategy on MT4.” Is scalping more viable through NinjaTrader? Why is this? Do you say that if I would use an account at a big, reputable brokerage firm to trade forex (assume this broker offers both MT and NT), the slippage would be bigger in case of MetaTrader than in case of NinjaTrader? Why?

· “good tool to learn” is not a factor for me because I can open demo accounts with NinjaTrader at several brokers, also.

· “because of the great position size flexibility on MT4…” Isn’t NinjaTrader as flexible on position sizing as MetaTrader? This is very important to me, so please, elaborate this.

· If one can find a reputable forex broker (e.g. a big commodity broker also offering forex), and it offers not only MetaTrader but NinjaTrader also, isn’t it a straightforward decision to choose NinjaTrader because of your claims about MT?



@bluemele,

· “if you are scalping, I would avoid it”. It’s clear; it is in conformity with Linds’ statements.
But why do you highly suggest MT4 over any other platform in case of swing trading?
Because it is more stable than NinjaTrader (fewer hang-ups, freezing)?
Or because it has more features?
Or because you have more brokers to choose from?
How NinjaTrader is weaker or worse in case of forex swing trading?



Thanks for your help!

 
  #15 (permalink)
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@Linds,

· Why haven’t you never used NT for Forex, if, as you say, MT4 will never compete with NT in terms of execution speed and therefore slippage?

· “NT is superior if the instrument is exchange traded.” It’s clear. But if in that case NinjaTrader is superior, why isn’t it superior in case of forex trading?

· scalping on low timeframes is not a great strategy on MT4.” Is scalping more viable through NinjaTrader? Why is this? Do you say that if I would use an account at a big, reputable brokerage firm to trade forex (assume this broker offers both MT and NT), the slippage would be bigger in case of MetaTrader than in case of NinjaTrader? Why?

· “good tool to learn” is not a factor for me because I can open demo accounts with NinjaTrader at several brokers, also.

· “because of the great position size flexibility on MT4…” Isn’t NinjaTrader as flexible on position sizing as MetaTrader? This is very important to me, so please, elaborate this.

· If one can find a reputable forex broker (e.g. a big commodity broker also offering forex), and it offers not only MetaTrader but NinjaTrader also, isn’t it a straightforward decision to choose NinjaTrader because of your claims about MT?


Good questions and its important to make good decisions based on your trading needs. I swing trade with MT4 and trade lower timeframes on NT using tick and range bars- which you wont find on MT4 afaik. With swing trading, execution speed and slippage are far less significant and really not an issue. This is because with a swing trade you are targeting maybe hundreds of pips so if slippage costs you a few pips so what. But if you are scalping for 10 pips and lose 3 on slippage -that is going to screw the bottom line quickly.


Trading forex on NT still means using forex brokers and so of course it is still not through a central exchange. You need to hear from someone who uses NT for Forex who can comment on execution speeds and slippage and how it might work for scalping. Of course if you are happy to stick with 6E, 6B, 6A, 6C, 6S and 6J, the indexes and gold then you can avoid forex brokers altogether and use a futures broker. If you do this then the way is open for scalping by taking advantage of good execution speeds through the regulated exchanges. But the dilemma then is your position sizing is very limited and you'll need a decent account size when you go live. I think NT forex brokers ('Gain' for instance?)do offer good flexibility with position sizing but again you would have to hear from someone doing it or talk directly to the brokers.

With regard to your last point.possibly yes..but as I dont have direct experience of NT for Forex I cant say that with any conviction.

Some advantages of MT4
Free - no limit on how many occurances you can have running
Easy access to heaps of historical data
Good position size flexibility
Plenty of free phone apps for monitoring swing trades
Widely used so can get support easily

Some Disadvantages
Execution speed is often poor ( I often see 3 to 5 seconds)
No access to volume or volume derived indicators

Some NT Advantages
Access to futures exchanges and so good execution speed for scalping

NT for forex: Can someone with experience please comment.

best

Linds

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  #16 (permalink)
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Linds View Post
NT for forex: Can someone with experience please comment?

NT + Interactive Brokers = excellent for intraday forex trading.

However, I think min account size may now be $10k and position size =or>$25k.

If <$10k account, I suggest start on MT4 with Oanda & switch if you are not happy with Oanda when account large enough.

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  #17 (permalink)
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This is my opinion on MT4.
MBT or Dukascopy with NT permits to handle mini and micro lots, doa search for both on forum.
Or now SierraChart supports FXCM and PFG Best.

Take your Pips, go out and Live.
Luke.
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  #18 (permalink)
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Arpad View Post
“if you are scalping, I would avoid it”. It’s clear; it is in conformity with Linds’ statements.
But why do you highly suggest MT4 over any other platform in case of swing trading?
Because it is more stable than NinjaTrader (fewer hang-ups, freezing)?
Or because it has more features?
Or because you have more brokers to choose from?
How NinjaTrader is weaker or worse in case of forex swing trading?



Thanks for your help!

MT4 is the defacto trading platform for retail traders on forex. This creates a large group of sophisticated retail traders using the same platform. This creates a lot of programmers and or indicators and flexibility in changes to be made etc.. More brokers to choose from for forex.... It is so much more stable, I have left it on for a month without issues and taking many many trades automatically "LIVE" per day. Good platform, but easily manipulated by broker so swing trading is the only thing I suggest.

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  #19 (permalink)
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bluemele View Post
MT4 is the defacto trading platform for retail traders on forex. This creates a large group of sophisticated retail traders using the same platform. This creates a lot of programmers and or indicators and flexibility in changes to be made etc.. More brokers to choose from for forex.... It is so much more stable, I have left it on for a month without issues and taking many many trades automatically "LIVE" per day. Good platform, but easily manipulated by broker so swing trading is the only thing I suggest.


Can you please explain how MT4 easily manipulated by brokers. Thanks in advance

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  #20 (permalink)
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KJAVED View Post
Can you please explain how MT4 easily manipulated by brokers. Thanks in advance

Take a look here MT4 Brokers' Virtual Dealer Plug-In @ Forex Factory

Take your Pips, go out and Live.
Luke.
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