NexusFi: Find Your Edge


Home Menu

 





Correlations and Inverse correlation ES


Discussion in Emini and Emicro Index

Updated
      Top Posters
    1. looks_one trendisyourfriend with 2 posts (2 thanks)
    2. looks_two donedge with 2 posts (1 thanks)
    3. looks_3 rleplae with 2 posts (1 thanks)
    4. looks_4 sixsmith07 with 2 posts (2 thanks)
      Best Posters
    1. looks_one MacroNinja with 11 thanks per post
    2. looks_two zander931 with 10 thanks per post
    3. looks_3 treydog999 with 6 thanks per post
    4. looks_4 Investorito with 3 thanks per post
    1. trending_up 13,990 views
    2. thumb_up 45 thanks given
    3. group 16 followers
    1. forum 18 posts
    2. attach_file 4 attachments




 
Search this Thread

Correlations and Inverse correlation ES

  #1 (permalink)
 
sixsmith07's Avatar
 sixsmith07 
Oslo, Norway
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT, Sierra
Broker: IQFEED Stage5
Trading: ES
Posts: 307 since Jan 2014
Thanks Given: 282
Thanks Received: 647

I hear a lot of talk from swing traders about the correlations between the Yen, the VIX, and the ES. In fact, big mike has the yen and the vix (and i believe the 30 yr note) on his charts. A search for "correlation, correlated, inverse correlation...etc" doesn't come up with much. I'm not looking for a magic bullet (I know they don't exist) but I would like to atleast understand what some of the big players are looking at when a pullback is occurring on the ES and they say something like "the Yen is falling." Is this just a confirmation tool?

If anyone has any good reads on it, can you post them here please, thanks!

James

Follow me on Twitter Started this thread Reply With Quote
Thanked by:

Can you help answer these questions
from other members on NexusFi?
Pivot Indicator like the old SwingTemp by Big Mike
NinjaTrader
How to apply profiles
Traders Hideout
Exit Strategy
NinjaTrader
MC PL editor upgrade
MultiCharts
Trade idea based off three indicators.
Traders Hideout
 
Best Threads (Most Thanked)
in the last 7 days on NexusFi
Spoo-nalysis ES e-mini futures S&P 500
29 thanks
Just another trading journal: PA, Wyckoff & Trends
25 thanks
Tao te Trade: way of the WLD
24 thanks
Bigger Wins or Fewer Losses?
23 thanks
GFIs1 1 DAX trade per day journal
18 thanks
  #3 (permalink)
 
zander931's Avatar
 zander931 
Portland, OR, US
 
Experience: None
Platform: Investor r/t, X_Trader, ToS
Broker: AMP/IQfeed
Trading: ES
Posts: 493 since Nov 2012
Thanks Given: 1,496
Thanks Received: 1,208


Correlations and Inverse correlation ES-intermarket-analysis-1-.pdf
Correlations and Inverse correlation ES-intermarket-analysis-2-.pdf
Correlations and Inverse correlation ES-intermarket-trading-strategies-1-.pdf

Visit my NexusFi Trade Journal Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)
 
sixsmith07's Avatar
 sixsmith07 
Oslo, Norway
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT, Sierra
Broker: IQFEED Stage5
Trading: ES
Posts: 307 since Jan 2014
Thanks Given: 282
Thanks Received: 647



You're the man. I've got a lot of reading to do.

Follow me on Twitter Started this thread Reply With Quote
Thanked by:
  #5 (permalink)
 ethand320 
Chicago
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: IB TWS, Tastyworks
Trading: SPY Options, Equity Options, CL, Gold
Posts: 304 since Jan 2014
Thanks Given: 124
Thanks Received: 139

Intermarket analysis has been on my reading list. Thanks for the pdf.

Follow me on Twitter Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)
BestBrokerDeals
London, UK
 
Posts: 13 since Jun 2014
Thanks Given: 5
Thanks Received: 17

Like most things, inter-market relationships come and go.

There's really not a single example that stands the test of time. Stocks and bonds are generally inversely correlated . . . Except when they're not. Or commodities and oil . . .

More data (looking at another market) will generally just confuse what you're doing.

Kind regards,

Nick

Reply With Quote
Thanked by:
  #7 (permalink)
 MacroNinja 
Buenos Aires Argentina
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NT, MT4, Sierra
Trading: S&P, Bonds, Crude, FX
Posts: 250 since Sep 2014
Thanks Given: 37
Thanks Received: 256

In general (assuming no bizzaro QE considerations):

USDJPY down is bearish for the ES. (Keep in mind this can be tricky with Japan engaging in their own QE, so you have to figure if the Yen movement is safe haven flow or weakening dilution to the Japanese QE)

AUDJPY up is bullish for ES due to risk on sentiment with a carry trade.

ZB/ZN up is bearish for the ES. Again, assuming no QE logic is in play where both ZB and ES will both go up. The logic is if haven flow goes to bonds seeking safety, it flows out of equities.

VIX up is bearish for the ES, since put options are being purchased for safety and volatility is going up.

Gold up could mean bearish for ES if it's a safe haven flow, but it could also just be dollar weakening, so you really have to understand the nuances across everything: yen, bonds, equities, and the US dollar.

This is what I would recommend: Because it can be confusing to see if the correlations are lagging or leading indicators, focus instead of understanding what is causing each of those respective instruments to move. If for example you see both yen strengthening and bonds strengthening, and there's a lot of geopolitical risk brewing but the equities haven't moved (maybe because it's overnight), then there's a good chance that equities will drop. And even if equities do not drop, you should at least be aware of the possibility based upon where everyone else is starting to park their money.

Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)
 
rleplae's Avatar
 rleplae 
Gits (Hooglede) Belgium
Legendary Market Wizard
 
Experience: Master
Platform: NinjaTrader, Proprietary,
Broker: Ninjabrokerage/IQfeed + Synthetic datafeed
Trading: 6A, 6B, 6C, 6E, 6J, 6S, ES, NQ, YM, AEX, CL, NG, ZB, ZN, ZC, ZS, GC
Posts: 3,003 since Sep 2013
Thanks Given: 2,442
Thanks Received: 5,863

Any recommendation how to best calculate correlation ?

Pearson ? Spearman's rank ? Kendall's rank ? Brownian correlation ? Any other ?

I am trying to implement a practical correlation between instruments...
Any thoughts/ideas welcome

Follow me on Twitter Visit my NexusFi Trade Journal Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)
 
trendisyourfriend's Avatar
 trendisyourfriend 
Quebec Canada
Market Wizard
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: AMP/CQG
Trading: ES, NQ, YM
Frequency: Daily
Duration: Minutes
Posts: 4,527 since Oct 2009
Thanks Given: 4,175
Thanks Received: 6,020


sixsmith07 View Post
...I would like to atleast understand what some of the big players are looking at when a pullback is occurring on the ES and they say something like "the Yen is falling." Is this just a confirmation tool?
...

James

if the trader who trades the ES look at the Yen, what about the trader who trades the Yen? Does he look at the ES?


Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)
 
rleplae's Avatar
 rleplae 
Gits (Hooglede) Belgium
Legendary Market Wizard
 
Experience: Master
Platform: NinjaTrader, Proprietary,
Broker: Ninjabrokerage/IQfeed + Synthetic datafeed
Trading: 6A, 6B, 6C, 6E, 6J, 6S, ES, NQ, YM, AEX, CL, NG, ZB, ZN, ZC, ZS, GC
Posts: 3,003 since Sep 2013
Thanks Given: 2,442
Thanks Received: 5,863



trendisyourfriend View Post
if the trader who trades the ES look at the Yen, what about the trader who trades the Yen? Does he look at the ES?


influence is not necessary reciprocal
i this case, i am sure it is not reciprocal

Yen can be influential on ES
while ES is minor on Yen
i would think Asian and Australian stocks have more influence on Japanese currency than US stocks
makes sense, due to there proximity

Follow me on Twitter Visit my NexusFi Trade Journal Reply With Quote
Thanked by:




Last Updated on September 7, 2015


© 2024 NexusFi™, s.a., All Rights Reserved.
Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama City, Panama, Ph: +507 833-9432 (Panama and Intl), +1 888-312-3001 (USA and Canada)
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice. There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
About Us - Contact Us - Site Rules, Acceptable Use, and Terms and Conditions - Privacy Policy - Downloads - Top
no new posts