Site Administrator Swing Trader Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
Posts: 49,780 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,308 given,
97,567
received
Guys,
Lately I've seen an increasing number of posts requesting changes or functionality on futures.io (formerly BMT).
I've posted some comments scattered throughout the forum, but I wanted to create a single thread to draw more attention and let more people know my intentions.
The intention is this: No more site changes to the current underlying software (vBulletin). At this time, I consider it more or less a dead product (vBulletin) and I refuse to "upgrade" to their new version because of the extreme negative feedback it has generated from admins and users alike.
So instead, I am intending to convert the backend of the site to IP Board 4.0. IPB or Invision has a thread on their site about the major changes they are introducing in version 4 of their product:
IPB is a competing product to vBulletin. The other option was XenForo, but I prefer IPB 4 at this time. I reserve the right to change my mind later.
What this means is that I am not going to continue spending time and money on the current software (vBulletin). Instead, all resources are being devoted to getting futures.io (formerly BMT) converted to IPB. I call this revision "futures.io (formerly BMT) 5.0" because 2014 is our fifth year in operation. Hopefully I can get it done before that turns to futures.io (formerly BMT) 6.0.
IPB 4.0 is expected to be released very soon. Once released, here is a very high level schedule of events:
- Install IPB
- Import the database from vBulletin to IPB
- Make a public facing beta test site which will be made available in the following order: First: Admins only, Second: Market Wizards, Third: Elite Members, Last: Everyone
- During the months of testing the public beta of futures.io (formerly BMT) on IPB, the process of converting the hundreds of customizations from vBulletin to IPB will be taking place
- This also includes a new up-to-date theme/template
The current futures.io (formerly BMT) site will be accessible during all of this. A second "beta" copy of futures.io (formerly BMT) will be on a separate URL and stand-alone. It will be restricted to admins only initially, then gradually will roll out to others as per the above. All of the existing posts and threads that are converted from the old site to the new site will be made read-only during this beta test. This will prevent split topics between the two separate databases. A new "testing only" subforum will be created on the beta test site for the function of testing out posting, it will be for tests only and nothing "serious" or "formal" -- all of which would still be posted exclusively on the primary futures.io (formerly BMT) site.
Now, let me also say the following very important things. All of this will be an extremely gradual transition. You will not wake up one day and have sweeping changes. I am all too familiar with how much people dislike change. I also realize I cannot please everyone. However, change will be coming. But it will be coming very slowly, so please do not worry too much over this.
Not every single piece of functionality on the current futures.io (formerly BMT) will be duplicated to the new IPB version of futures.io (formerly BMT). It just wouldn't be possible. But, at the same time, it will give me the opportunity to make some significant upgrades to the site that should more than make up for some loss of functionality that users my find as a "favorite" on futures.io (formerly BMT).
BTW, if you are asking "why change" the answer is simple. The current site is a nightmare to administer, especially from a security perspective. vBulletin has a terrible reputation over the last few years in this area. That, combined with the fact that vBulletin has end-of-lifed the product I am using, and my complete unwillingness to "upgrade" to their new product leaves us with just one choice - and that is to change products.
If you have questions let me know and I'll try to answer.
Site Administrator Swing Trader Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
Posts: 49,780 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,308 given,
97,567
received
You might want to browse some other forums using IPB to get a feel for it. Keep in mind these are running v3. I would not want to run v3 (which is why we aren't, and instead are using vBulletin). But v4 is a ground up rewrite more or less and has fantastic features coming.
I realise it's all a personal thing, but compared to the forums you listed above the appearance/layout of futures.io (formerly BMT) was so much better. For me that is the critical component. I really like the blue/gray/white - and making use of the full screen - as it makes things very easy to read. I'm no graphic artist, but I don't think the appearance needs too much of an overhaul. Simplicity is the key IMO. Having said that - best of luck with the project. I look forward to seeing the new product.
Site Administrator Swing Trader Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
Posts: 49,780 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,308 given,
97,567
received
I agree.
The sites I listed are not an exact representation of what you can expect. First, they are on the old product. But second, futures.io (formerly BMT) will retain its unique footprint.
My intention with the template (GUI) is to just refine it to bring it more up to date. It will also be fully responsive, meaning it will work perfectly on mobile platforms.
+1 from Koepisch. Keep the layout simple to utilize the full screen (nothing to the left + nothing to the right). The colors are a trademark of futures.io (formerly BMT), so think about that if you want to switch them. Good luck and less trouble during the transition.
Since I have plenty of futures.io (formerly BMT) pages saved as favorites I have really only one question - will the old links still work in futures.io (formerly BMT) 5.0 (at least as redirection)?
Site Administrator Swing Trader Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
Posts: 49,780 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,308 given,
97,567
received
Have no fear. I hate fixed width sites, I will not be doing that. What we have now is called a fluid width or dynamic width site, which is what it will always be.
Colors will remain. General idea is to freshen it up, make it more modern. Less bubbles and round edges, more business.
thanks for the detailed information. I realize that this will be a huge work amount for you, but in the end it will be an even better futures.io (formerly BMT) experience for all of us. Also allowing Bitcoins as payment is great for all being left out by Paypal.
been following IPB for many many years and i have to say it really is a nice board.. 4.0 should also be amazing.. this is going to be a good change. did you ever give any thought to allowing devs and what not to have donate buttons by their names?
dont believe anything you hear and only half of what you see
Mike was born for this type of "work" .... I think it is absolutely second nature for him to tweak software / hardware.
That is why this is the best trading forum on the planet.
AJ
Nashville, Tennessee
"Life On The Edge of SR"
The following 3 users say Thank You to tderrick for this post:
Sounds good BM, as one of the guys who doesn't like change generally I appreciate how you have laid out your plan to phase it in slowly. That said, it does sound much more user friendly with more features and so forth.
As IP. Suite owner myself I can only applaud your decision, besides the obvious UI advantages for us it will also be a big improvement for you on the backend
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Would it be possible to include a "Select All" button to the code boxes in threads once the switch to the new forum software is done? This is not really of importance, but this would be nice to have in case it's easily doable.
Site Administrator Swing Trader Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
Posts: 49,780 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,308 given,
97,567
received
IPB has said that 4.0 will be released by end of Q2. So depending on how productive I can be at that point with my makeshift office setup (while waiting for my container), I'll look to start not longer after that.
not a fan of code window as you have to slide back and forth, scroll up and and down in order to see the rest of the code.
But to select all you can click reply first then just cut and paste the part you interest in.
The following user says Thank You to cory for this post:
I'm probably being presumptuous here, but I'd like to offer to update the futures.io (formerly BMT) logo. Unfortunately I don't have any "traditional" credentials, but when I was in the Army one of my intel "products" (a powerpoint presentation) was so well received it was sent to the President (George W at the time - no joke). I also designed a monument for fallen Soldiers that is now in place in at the base in Dal Molin, Italy.
If you want to send me requirements I'd be happy to give it a shot, just let me know.
The following 3 users say Thank You to spiderbyte87 for this post:
Site Administrator Swing Trader Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
Posts: 49,780 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,308 given,
97,567
received
A new theme/visual style will be part of the new deployment. Anyone can feel free to post or send me mock-ups of anything they wish that shows something they think is better.
I appreciate that, but I'm sure that even the older people (like me ) on futures.io (formerly BMT) are still able to adapt some changes in color and / or style...
"If you don't design your own life plan, chances are you'll fall into someone else's plan. And guess what they have planned for you? Not much." - Jim Rohn
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Site Administrator Swing Trader Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
Posts: 49,780 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,308 given,
97,567
received
I want to give the site a facelift, I am just saying it needs to be done incrementally and not all at once because the switch from vB to IPS is already a big enough change. So I will try to maintain similar functionality and appearance in that first theme, and then once we are solidly on IPS we will roll out other changes.
"If you don't design your own life plan, chances are you'll fall into someone else's plan. And guess what they have planned for you? Not much." - Jim Rohn
This is something I finished before I read the "less bubbles and more hard edges" post.. Anyway it's just a sample not a finished product so no worries.. next one will be more "serious" and more cohesive.. I'll be posting two categories: Just Logo and Logo with Text
These are wide open to suggestions and can be mixed and matched and changed in just about every way. If you have an idea just let me know and I'll try to make it happen (I love doing this stuff)
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Totally different direction with this one.. In keeping with Mike's dog theme I thought maybe something like this might be interesting. I'm thinking it's a little too aggressive but oh well I'm just throwing ideas out there.
Next one will be an attempt to put "futures.io (formerly BMT)" together in a sort of corporate style.
Mike if I'm hijacking the thread please let me know and I'll either send them to you privately in a big batch or move to a different thread.
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This is what I'm working on right now.. The idea is that trading is a maze and futures.io (formerly BMT) is the "way out".. This is very preliminary so I'm just fishing for suggestions here. If this is WAAAAYY off base let me know and I'll drop it and move on.
..now the path is showing a more visible and lisible logo.
I like the arrow up. As this line is mostly used on "success-sites" I would recommend to
try to exchange the line with japanese candlesticks to show it is a "trader's platform and to
combine it with the exploding arrow's top.
Maybe a smoother font for the background could make it even "rounder". Like the Bodoni bold
for example.
Just some thoughts.
GFIs1
The following user says Thank You to GFIs1 for this post:
I'm having a hard time imagining what you mean by combining the candlesticks with the arrow. Can you post a sketch to give me an idea?
As for the font, I'm trying to stay within the "hard edges" direction Mike mentioned, so I'm trying to keep it as clean as possible. If I get more support for changing the font I'll change it but for now I'm keeping it. Also right now I'm just throwing ideas out there; if there's enough support for one particular thing I'll refine it, but right now I'm trying to put content out without worrying about perfection too much.
I have no problem to see and follow your way creating the new futures.io (formerly BMT) logo.
As this forum is mostly bound to trading and not to create stuff for web and print
I will try to step back right now and let the things play out.
If any time you like to get some insights in font development you can pm me.
lol this is very rough but something like this where you take the verticals of the letters. Somehow the candles need their own unique position and shape so they don't just look like rectangular boxes. (I doubt mike would like the bmt in renko lol)
And then if you want to put the cherry on top make the first letter B a double distribution volume profile.
I can't tell if this looks absolutely horrible or somewhat decent.
R.I.P. Joseph Bach (Itchymoku), 1987-2018.
Please visit this thread for more information.
Site Administrator Swing Trader Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
Posts: 49,780 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,308 given,
97,567
received
Best guess is at the worldwide forum conference next month. I imagine they will announce public beta. But that is good enough for me to get started testing the migration, I mainly didn't want to waste time doing a 3.x migration. It will be a long and difficult process.
The hardest part is finding developers, I've already tried to get some of them to put me at the top of their list. I let them know I have a 5-figure budget for the conversion and I know it will take hundreds of hours of custom time.
once that process is done with i know it will all be worth it.. i think they actually have a migration 'team' at IPS for just this problem.. especially for all the users switching from VB..
dont believe anything you hear and only half of what you see
This sounds great
Guessing there will be new Wiki entries and webinars on how to navigate after switching to IPS 4.0; if needed so you can tell I know little about IPS 4.0, even after going to their site.
My only wish would be for downloadable user help files if they exist already from Invision Power Services, Inc.
Not looking to add to your already full plate.
Even though I asked to Mike, let me express here that I would like to have the possibility to have the timestamp of the recent posts in the format "June 19th, 2014, 09:13 PM" instead of "5 Hours Ago" (more precission and better idea of "when" IMO).
I would like to suggest (and comment) some things about the "Thanks System", most of all thinking in the new improvements (futures.io (formerly BMT) 5, etc).
First of all I have to say that this is (always IMO) a very good paralell system to get feedback from the Community (very important) without overdoing the whole messaging system (that's why I said paralell, very important also).
There are some ideas that come to me in order to perhaps improve it.
Without any special order (suggestions and comments):
* The actual interface doesn't makes possible to get results statistics oriented (as I know). What for?. For example because if we could get a list of our thanked posts ordered by number of thanks, probably we could get unexpected findings; for example knowing some contribution that we never thought it was so well received. And many many other search results findings (as other example; may be we didn't know that some people are really our fans!).
To get this results, perhaps not so necessary database and interface works if offering just the data in order to be treated by our own (Access, Excel, etc). And not only over just us, over all the Community (always open to Mike's judgment).
* It's really important the agility of the system (as currently is), without display refreshes to see reflected our actions (our thanks).
* It's also important (as currently is) the position of the button/s (a very strategic position).
* Are not there things we do not like?. Why not a "No, thanks" button?.
* May be sometimes, just sometimes so it should be optional and without disturbing the usual agility, we would like to leave a comment to our "Thanks" / "No, thanks" action.
i know you have had problems with devs and contractors, have you looked into anyone from the IPB community? i feel like there might be more luck there.
dont believe anything you hear and only half of what you see
Site Administrator Swing Trader Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
Posts: 49,780 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,308 given,
97,567
received
I tried a few months back. I need to start the process over once I have 4.0 installed. I will need some really good developers, my gut feeling is this is about 10-20k of work and will take a small army.
Site Administrator Swing Trader Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
Posts: 49,780 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,308 given,
97,567
received
Since futures.io (formerly BMT) 5.0 is going to be a major rollout, I'm considering other changes as well.
Let me be frank. Should the name of the site be changed?
Is "Big Mike Trading" an appropriate name that represents the community today? When I started this site over 5 years ago, I never imagined it would be the largest/most active futures community on the planet.
What will the next 5 years look like? Is the current name the best way to proceed?
Does the current name negatively impact or act as a hindrance? Does it act positively or as encouragement?
Would changing the name be completely disruptive?
I'd like to hear from as many people as possible on this, and I hope you take the time to think through all the angles and let me know your thoughts. Some that come to mind are:
- Name recognition
- Community representation
- Community values
- Marketing, traffic, SEO
I bring up the question of the name now simply because with all the changes that will come as part of the futures.io (formerly BMT) 5.0 initiative, it would be a good time if a change is to be made.
@Big Mike I kind of like the hometown feel of the name. But if I was searching web on saw it in search results I might not click on it because of the name. That being said is a toss up as far as my opinion goes. From an SEO perspective it is challenging to change a name. I would really examine the SEO part of the equation when making that decision.
"The day I became a winning trader was the day it became boring. Daily losses no longer bother me and daily wins no longer excited me. Took years of pain and busting a few accounts before finally got my mind right. I survived the darkness within and now just chillax and let my black box do the work."
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Your site is recognized world-wide as Big Mike's Trading forum. Leave it alone! (This, from someone who detests change - odd that I chose trading - who's price is always changing).
After all, it's what you learn AFTER you know it all, that counts!
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Trading is in your name and URL, your not gonna get much more SEO benefit. Plus your site has current SEO that you could damage if you switch names and URL's.
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I think I agree with this. I didn't want to express my gut feeling without giving it some thought, but this does resonate with me, and I think that now you have some name recognition, it would not be a good idea to give it up.
Sure, brands do change their names and the new names do get accepted, but my thought is that there would be a period of confusion, and it would require a lot of explaining, and there would likely be a lot of misunderstanding.... and you aren't going to be hiring a big advertising marketing firm to push the new name out to the world , so the change would be rockier.
Maybe, when the site was first established, it could have been a good choice to use a non-personalized name for it, but now it is established and known, with the name it has. Changing it probably would not be a great idea.
It's a great question, but I think it would do more harm than good at this point.
Bob.
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As long as people search for free ninjatrader indicator your site will come up so there is no worry about changing name will harm it. I like to make a case for why the name should be change, seems like lots of big guys name Mike out there so the name is kind of generic. Lets keep 'trading' part and call it futures.io (formerly BMT) the Biggest Trading Site. The change would not be disruptive if you have a banner saying soon to be called futures.io (formerly BMT) the Biggest Trading Site. With the revolutionary free indicators thread this site can only get bigger and bigger, my 2c.
Think of Google, eBay, Yahoo, Verizon, JP Morgan, etc. that are known for the services or products they represent and are brands. The literal meaning of those brand names is less relevant. Why give away a recognized brand name and start all over?
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I completely subscribe to that, nothing more to add...
"If you don't design your own life plan, chances are you'll fall into someone else's plan. And guess what they have planned for you? Not much." - Jim Rohn
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I think at this point most of the members identify the futures.io (formerly BMT) name with this site as a "brand". People like being on a "team", and the older the team the more invested its members become. Elitetrader's members have their heads so far up their own asses to see that it's just a forum, not the hinge for their giant egos. To me T2W is also irrelevant, as they are too focused on new members. Basically the only real 'work' that gets done is on futures.io (formerly BMT), which I think is why futures.io (formerly BMT) is so successful.
The point being that a name change might be all it takes to shift futures.io (formerly BMT) into one of those categories, where either it pushes away innovators and becomes a place for only newbies, or it becomes a place for people who think they are God's gift to trading just because they are profitable and reputations are constantly questioned.
I vote don't change it.
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I agree with the people voting "Don't change" unless you have a better option. And this is the great question; what is a better option?. But attention; not just completely rational. Don't look for better options just by a rational way because for some or perhaps many reasons, at this point of the race, the name must have an important emotional ingredient; cool, familiar, as among the sum of home people forces, and without denying the past that arrived here (also the really truth is that Mike, for all kind of results, pivots the forum).
So, is there something better?, Yes?, sure?; then change, but don`t do tests at this point.
I once read that it takes about $6MM to build a recognisable brand, why instantly undermine your existing brand equity without having an +EV reason to do so? From my experience name changes only happen when it makes strategic sense, for example when PR things go bad. Considering that futures.io (formerly BMT) is an internet company, SEO hits matter a lot. I get that you want to grow/ evolve your business, however the brand and user base are some of your key assets. A name change could easily alienate existing users? I would not recommend you to change your name unless you intend to pick up undisclosed business activities that require you to do so in order to create more synergy opportunities.
Already implemented on current futures.io (formerly BMT), and will be implemented on futures.io (formerly BMT) 5.0 as well. It is non-optional in my opinion because of the broken images (later), but also because of cookie abuse where spammers embed bbcode img's that point to sites that just load Amazon cookies on your computer, so they get credit for anything you buy (etc).
The cache script implemented on futures.io (formerly BMT) solves all that, plus improves performance.
well dang, if i did know that was the case on futures.io (formerly BMT) i had forgotten. you should post that there so those guys see the logic behind such a thing from someone who maintains a fairly large forum.
dont believe anything you hear and only half of what you see
nah. i used to play around with stuff back in the day. ive been following that IPB project for many years. more or less just interested in software i guess.
dont believe anything you hear and only half of what you see
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
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dont believe anything you hear and only half of what you see 
