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Elite only for ALL downloads?


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Elite only for ALL downloads?

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  #101 (permalink)
ENVESTR
st augustine, florida,united states
 
 
Posts: 2 since Oct 2010
Thanks: 0 given, 0 received

I VERY RARELY VISIT BIG MIKE WHEN I DO I LOOK FOR INFO FOR THINK OR SWIM HOWEVER ONLY TO FIND VERY LITTLE

BIG MIKE IS GOOD AND LIKE THE FEW THINGS I READ
I AM NOT A PROGRAMER SO I DO NOT HAVE ANY INDICATORS JUST IDEAS WHICH I DO NOT KNOW HOW TO PROGRAM

BIG MIKE DO AS U FEEL IS NECESSARY

THANKS FOR ASKING

 
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  #102 (permalink)
 clochart 
Rome
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Multicharts
Trading: Currency, Future, stocks
 
Posts: 4 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 8 given, 1 received

Hi Big Mike, I'm a newbie and unfortunately don't have much to post om your great site. First I want to thank you for the hard job you did here. Then I want to tell you that I don't think that the solutions you suggest will work for a long time, I suppose they will work only in the near future. Anyway, if you decide to let only elite member download files, I'll be with you. You deserve respect from all of us, so if you feel that this is the best solution for you, do it. I'm not a hard poster because I still have lots of things to know, but I decided that BM sure will be my "on line" trading school.
Thanks Mike (and sorry for my bad English...)

 
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  #103 (permalink)
 skip 
Bellingham, WA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: CL, 6E, ES
 
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Posts: 10 since Jul 2010
Thanks: 0 given, 6 received

I am not an active poster since I am still learning and I'm not sure that what I have to share is all that useful. Having said that, this forum is a very special place, and Big Mike, your attention to it and care for it, make it a much better and more useful site to learn from and interact with. If it takes a small personal contribution to keep the trolls at bay, I say do it. The price for Elite membership is a bargain for sure, one of the best values I have found in the world of trading, (which by and large is a bin of little or no value, for the money spent). I say, make all downloads Elite only, but make sure people can sign for free and search, since that is how they will learn how valuable the forum really is.
skip

 
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  #104 (permalink)
 bob304 
Memphis, TN
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: MirusFutures/Zen-Fire
Trading: NQ, TF, CL, GC, 6B, 6E
 
Posts: 4 since Mar 2010
Thanks: 5 given, 1 received

I think limiting downloads to elite members is a reasonable solution.

 
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  #105 (permalink)
 Private Banker 
La Jolla, CA
 
Experience: Master
Platform: Sierra Chart, X_Trader Pro, OptionsCity
Broker: Advantage, Trading Technologies, OptionsCity, IQ Feed
Trading: CL, NG
 
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Posts: 1,040 since Jul 2010
Thanks: 1,713 given, 3,850 received

Mike,

I'm actually surprised that non-elite members are able to access the general downloads area. I think an obvious business decision is to change that ASAP to elite members only. Vendors are selling the same indicators for hundreds/thousands of dollars. Paying the elite membership for unlimited indicators is a win-win for everyone.

 
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  #106 (permalink)
 FarNorth 
Austin Texas USA
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, Genesis Trad
 
Posts: 1 since Sep 2009
Thanks: 1 given, 0 received

I've been an Elite Member for quite a while and a regular member for a lot longer, and have enjoyed downloads as both. Being an Elite Member has its privileges and is well worth the small membership fee.

bigmiketrading is by far the most comprehensive board for serious traders, so to keep that status it would be a good idea to limit the downloads to Elite Members only.

Joe M

 
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  #107 (permalink)
 drytlewski322 
Fort Lauderdale Florida
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader
Trading: CL, 6E
 
drytlewski322's Avatar
 
Posts: 39 since Mar 2011
Thanks: 7 given, 60 received

I think the Elite membership is a good idea, though as it has been said already it will not stop anybody from Paying the small fee to download the indicators, the fee is chump change to them if they can profit from them.

50 Post is harsh, and even if it is put into action, for someone to do 50 posts can be done in a short period of time if needed to many different threads, so you would have a no win situation, though I do think that everybody who wants to download indicators of any kind should be a Elite status.

Though you could have the author of the threads release the indicators to a elite member by request, after he has been following the thread for a period of time, also a program that would show how many downloads a member has done and on which date, this could control the ones who are coming to mass download.

 
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  #108 (permalink)
 rpm123 
Green Bay WI
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT
Broker: AMP/CQG
Trading: 6E
 
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Posts: 321 since Apr 2010
Thanks: 337 given, 465 received

Too many people not at a picnic today! Me included.

Whatever magic you have done Mike to make this such a quality site that it is, I support you in whatever you decide.

Visit my futures io Trade Journal
 
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  #109 (permalink)
 WCwings 
Orlando, Florida United States
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: MultiCharts
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 17 since Nov 2010
Thanks: 14 given, 12 received

It is the right thing to do. It should help protect all the Traders that are kind enough, and have the skills, to post on Big Mike's Forum.


Big Mike View Post
All,

I am contemplating a major / drastic change to the behavior of all downloads on the site. The change would be to make all downloads Elite Only. I mean all downloads, in posts, threads, downloads section, everywhere globally. The only exclusion would be images (screen shots), but all other file types would be available only to Elite Members.

I have mixed feelings on this, so wanted to get some feedback from the users to consider as well before making any decisions. The main reason for the desire to change is to protect the work and to protect the value of the community.

Right now, too many "bots" are downloading our indicators and posting them on other sites as their own. Right now, too many real people register "fake" accounts because they can't even be bothered to spend 30 seconds to type in correct info when they register, all because all they want is to download something and likely never participate further in the site.

I previously tried enforcing a 10 post minimum for downloads, but all that did was have people create 10 junk posts. So that isn't going to work.

It seems the best way to protect the collection of downloads the users have worked very hard on, is to restrict access to only those who are serious about trading.

It certainly doesn't have to be Elite only, but the only other realistic option to implement is the minimum post requirement. If I change it to say 50 (instead of what we tried before, 10) then maybe it would prevent people from creating 50 spam posts just to download something, but still allow people who are serious about trading - but for whatever reason aren't Elite members - to still download. But the problem is, 50 posts is far, far more than what most people have (unfortunately), so such a requirement is likely to just piss off a lot of people.

The desire to change is not about increasing Elite sign ups. In fact, lately I have been wondering if futures.io (formerly BMT) is getting "too big" as we've started to attract some of the trolls from other sites and sometimes some of the posts are getting unfriendly lately. I am fighting this very hard as I am sure you are as well. We all want futures.io (formerly BMT) to remain a unique place, a place where everyone is truly here to help, and not start arguments, call each other names, or other troll like behavior. So this might mean making futures.io (formerly BMT) a more exclusive place where only serious traders are welcome.

Now obviously, just because someone pays for Elite membership does not automatically mean they are a serious trader. But they are probably far less likely to be a trouble maker while paying for the privilege to be here.

So a move of making all downloads Elite only might stunt our growth in terms of new user sign ups to the site, but that is fine with me if it means that what growth we have is of a higher quality and caliber user. I don't want to make the requirement solely based on post count, because there are far, far too many people who do not post much but are still working very hard to improve their trading. These people have signed up for Elite status to help support the site, and I think that entitles them to receive the downloads without a minimum post requirement.

Anyway, so there it is. Some of my many thoughts on the matter. Please share yours. I'm hoping to get a good mix of replies from both Elite Members and non-Elite Members.

Mike


 
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  #110 (permalink)
 raffu 
Espoo, Finland
 
 
Posts: 11 since Dec 2010

Hi Mike,

Actually it might have just opposite effect. Those who are going to steal a code or something would be glad that free access to those would be stopped and they are still able to get it "free" via Elite Membership and have better changes to resale it.

And of course the whole big growing traders community is not so impressed at your site without tasting something useful, That's why I think that some training should be free as well to non members as well, at least occasionally. But if You think that You should not grow futures.io (formerly BMT) any more it would do it's work.

BR
- raffu

But real name verification would be ok and might stop some bad behaviour if it exist.

 
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  #111 (permalink)
 turkmay 
New Orleans
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja
Broker: IB
Trading: TF
 
Posts: 82 since Mar 2010
Thanks: 51 given, 138 received

I was in the marketing business for over 40 years and learned one important lesson early on---If you don't attach value to something it will over time become worthless and abused. You would be surprised how even a few bucks will weed out the overwhelming majority of abusers and pretend traders. I have been to chat rooms all over the internet and have found that most ("trade2win" for instance) are pure crap populated by critics and full time paper traders. How can a guy with thousands of posts credited to his account find time to actually trade? And how can this guy contribute anything of value?

I have been an elite member since the beginning and have found this site invaluable not only for indicators but, more importantly, for support ideas when I can't get Ninja support off their butts and general trading ideas.

I also think that, if you charge, the quality of the posts will increase dramatically. Frankly, if the present free members do not
by now realize the value of futures.io (formerly BMT) enough to pay a few bucks on a quarterly or annual basis...let'em go.

 
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  #112 (permalink)
 omaron 
Europe
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: Amp Futures/Zen-Fire
Trading: Futures
 
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Posts: 76 since Aug 2009

I have mixed feelings about this. Some people may just not have much to say and be here only to learn. If some join to just read posts and download free indicators, is not a crime. He might not have anything to give back (yet). However, if some one join just to download indicators and then repost it on his site or whatever, $50 will not stop him. The membership will need to be way more expensive to stop such people. But in this case, 90% or more of the users will be "punished" to stop 10% or less.

 
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  #113 (permalink)
 snp500analyst 
Portland
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Sierra Charts
Trading: ES
 
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Posts: 84 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 12 given, 312 received

Most of my posts in this forum are questions. I am still not to a point where I can guide anyone. But I am getting there. Half knowledge is always dangerous.

I wud not vote for annual membership idea though. Elite members only download is not a bad idea.

Follow me on Twitter
 
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  #114 (permalink)
 rcabri 
Switzerland
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: ninja trader CQG Trader
Broker: Kinetick, IB
Trading: NQ DAX CL
 
Posts: 153 since Nov 2010
Thanks: 967 given, 122 received

I completely agree with your idea to limit the downloads to elite members if somebody cannot afford to support or will not support the site with 50$ it's better that he will not downloads anything
Roberto

 
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  #115 (permalink)
ReaM
Los Angeles
 
 
Posts: 132 since Mar 2011
Thanks: 97 given, 110 received

I am NOT an elite member, but I am against opening threads to everyone or allowing downloads.

I trade currencies and never use Ninja, so I spend only limited time here, but this is a very good forum and I would not want it to become anything else.

 
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  #116 (permalink)
 rogerf 
Victoria, TX
 
Experience: Master
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: Mirus Futrues, Zen-Fire, IQFeed, Kinetick
Trading: 6E, CL, GC
 
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Posts: 132 since Apr 2010

Anyone who has read my posts know the deep appreciation I have for this community and Big Mike. I think the word "FREE" used to mean something positive. But now, people seem to associate it with "you get what you pay for". "Free" now means "Free Junk" to most people and if it has any real value most don't appreciate it.

I'm not blaming the herd for this mindset. Most free stuff...especially in trading...is worthless. Conditioned response.

So, let's get those goodies out of the freebie bin and put them in Elite. There just isn't any downside.

Now, this is just my opinion, but if membership to this futures.io (formerly BMT) community isn't worth a $100 tag then nothing is. Grandfather the gang in but consider getting the Elite membership fee more in line with it's true value. Credits could be given for Elite uploads but there needs to be some ham on the plate, too.

Anyone caught plagiarizing anyone else's work is immediately ostrasized and burned as a witch.


Roger

 
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  #117 (permalink)
 boze man 
South Jersey
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Sierra
Broker: IB
Trading: ES, CL
 
Posts: 98 since Apr 2011
Thanks: 21 given, 61 received

As a guy with 1 post to his credit I will chime in...LOL

Not sure if anyone has suggested this as I haven't read all of this post yet but maybe lower the price for Elite access? I DO like the lifetime option but at a lower cost and instead of 3months maybe a yearly would work better for some? I think alot of sites do a yearly option for say 20$....which seems to me is a sweet spot for most people.

I am not trying to insult anyone with my humble opinion...Also sorry if i am rambling but I was outside cutting the lawn and the sun has gotten to my brain...enjoy the holiday!

 
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  #118 (permalink)
 fredesch 
San Diego, CA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader, Tradestation
Broker: Mirus/ZenFire
Trading: EUR/USD
 
Posts: 4 since Apr 2010
Thanks: 1 given, 1 received

There are precious few trading forums with this high level of quality. Elite membership is a small price to pay to retain this value. Restricting membership by numbers of posts will discourage serious new traders who would otherwise be only too happy to purchase an Elite membership. Mike, you have organized a terrific site and restricting downloads to Elite members seems quite reasonable. Best wishes.

 
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  #119 (permalink)
 theprophe 
prague,czech republic
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Irt,bookmap
Broker: Edgeclear
Trading: Mes
 
Posts: 41 since Nov 2010
Thanks: 46 given, 37 received

I really don't have anything to add, except you have a done a great job with the site, and im sure you'll you'll come to a fair resolution

 
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  #120 (permalink)
 infin8loop 
Vancouver, Canada
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: ES, CL, GC
 
Posts: 4 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 15 given, 3 received

I do agree with the idea of providing some protection to the content. What about using some kind of CAPTCHA to prevent/limit the bots. Maybe combine that with some download limit/frequency for non-elite members?

I think it's fine to charge a membership fee if the content is "worth it". However, you may be making it more difficult to determine that by placing the elite members only downloading restriction.

(Apologies if these points are duplicates to others in the thread - no time to read all of it first).

 
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  #121 (permalink)
 GarryM 
Tucson AZ
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja
Broker: Interactive Brokers
Trading: es
 
Posts: 123 since Jul 2009
Thanks: 31 given, 136 received

Mike,

Your forum has helped me progress in my trading education and to become a better trader. I was an elite member since day 1, but only because I saw the value of futures.io (formerly BMT). If others don't see the value and don't agree to the fees than they can pay their educational expenses elsewhere. In fairness to all, Elite membership is the best trading education bargin on the net. You have my vote.

Garry

 
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  #122 (permalink)
numa
Munich
 
 
Posts: 1 since Aug 2011
Thanks: 0 given, 1 received

Well, in my opinion the question is what do you want:
A local small forum like a village or an international site?

However, I would suggest to think that the net-world changes rapidely, big successfull sites are dead in a glimpse - think of MySpace, Yahoo and others. So making downloads harder may decrease trafic so much that at the end the natural move away kills the forum. Like in a village - if no new people are appearing, the village will die after a time....

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  #123 (permalink)
forker
Boston MA
 
 
Posts: 43 since Nov 2010
Thanks: 22 given, 10 received


cory View Post
agree then you can turn all threads into non elite make it easier to search.

Excellent point...

Forker

 
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  #124 (permalink)
 romulus 
Seattle, WA
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninjatrader
Broker: Mirus/Zenfire
Trading: YM
 
Posts: 4 since Jul 2009
Thanks: 0 given, 7 received

Mike,

This is my first post to the group. Been trading since the late 90s and have followed some of the threads on the site, but I haven't actually posted. This is not a reflection of the value I derive from futures.io (formerly BMT), but more a function of where I'm at after many years of trading. Once I gave up the search for the holy grail, and focused on simplifying my approach, ignoring the indicator of the month, I began to have greater success.

No doubt this comes from digging deeply for years, and absorbing all the valuable along with the not so valuable. The result is, it makes me a quieter, more disciplined trader, albeit, a somewhat passive forum participant, though no less interested. I've particularly found, of late, great value to your webinars as they pertain to new software, and new revs of existing packages, and of various traders and authors.

That said, I believe that making a minimum number of posts will only generate a lot of short, redundant content, as responders count their numbers (to payday), and this will fill the threads, make them overly lengthy thinner in content.

Making all downloads Elite reserved is a better solution to me. If people are unwilling to contribute a small sum to assist in the economics of the site, I see no reason why you should carry the herd on your shoulders. It's clear you put tremendous effort into this labor, I don't think anyone would argue this point.

When, early on, I saw the request for donations to become an Elite member, I was happy to contribute. It wasn't a dramatic amount, but it was a contribution. That's not too much to ask.

I believe this is a better model. Some will whine, but I don't think those voices matter all that much.

Best,

Eliot

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  #125 (permalink)
 aussiex 
Oslo/Norway
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Several
Trading: ES,YM,NQ,TF
 
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Posts: 1 since May 2011
Thanks: 16 given, 0 received

First post, and for me the idea of having to post 50 to get to the downloads, would not be that apealing to me. Paying for elite membership, is a better idea. And i support that. Its an execellent site an i am learning a lot from the guys her.


 
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  #126 (permalink)
 greek179 
Buffalo, NY
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: multicharts, TOS
Trading: stocks
 
Posts: 1 since Feb 2011
Thanks: 0 given, 0 received

You provide a lot of value for the $50 membership and I think elite only for downloads makes sense. Using a lot of postings as a requirement would just encourage a lot of useless postings.

 
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  #127 (permalink)
 sigmatrader 
Blythe, CA
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader7 and 8
Broker: Rithmic
Trading: CL, GC, NG, NQ, RTY, YM, 6 Series ZB,
 
Posts: 61 since Sep 2009
Thanks: 43 given, 56 received

Yes for classifying all downloads as Elite.
Yes for increased Elite fee or institute annual fee.
No for contribution threshold limits.

 
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  #128 (permalink)
 mizzoutrader 
Kansas City, MO
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: Futures
 
Posts: 36 since Jul 2010
Thanks: 494 given, 10 received

Mike,

You have done a great job with this site. I am definitely in favor of requiring Elite membership in order to access any downloads. Thanks for everything you have done here to build this site into what it is today.

 
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  #129 (permalink)
 Mindset 
Singapore
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT
Broker: ib
Trading: MES
 
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Posts: 362 since Sep 2009
Thanks: 89 given, 289 received

Elite access and $1 per download.
50/50 with the author. Doesn't really make any money but helps toward the site upkeep and a half decent contribution might even earn minimum wage - oh and nobody could really complain about $1.

 
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  #130 (permalink)
 TangoCharlie 
Phoenix, Arizona, United States
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: CQG
Trading: CL and YM
 
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Posts: 13 since Aug 2010
Thanks: 11 given, 0 received

Mike, I'm still gaining trading and programming experience and futures.io (formerly BMT) has helped me in that regard. The ideas that one finds in the professionally written scripts on this site go a long way in getting someone interested in learning moving in the right direction. One day I hope to contribute a quality indicator of my own.

I agree with you that making access too easy brings a lot of trouble makers on the site. However, access is what got me to see the greatness of this site. I've been a member for a short time and see how dedicated the elite members are to making this site what is today. I would say do what you have to do in making this a trouble free experience for your elite members.

Thanks,
TangoCharlie

 
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  #131 (permalink)
 mdan 
Chicago, IL
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: ES,NQ,YM
 
Posts: 2 since Aug 2011
Thanks: 0 given, 0 received

I'm new to futures.io (formerly BMT) and still trying to learn as much as I can about trading. I have not posted very much because I don't feel like I have anything of value to contribute right now. I don't think that requiring people to post would enhance the site, it would just add noise. This seems like a great site to learn from and I was happy to contribute $50 to become an elite member. That is an absolute bargain for the quality of content that some of the more experienced members are willing to share here. Most of the "investment education" companies I have come across charge thousands of dollars for mostly basic stuff that anyone could find in a book.

I think that anyone who looks around at this site and some of the others would come to the same conclusion, so charging to download content is fine with me.

 
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  #132 (permalink)
 razor99 
Ft Worth
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja, TS
Broker: IB, TS, TOS
Trading: ES, CL
 
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Posts: 10 since Sep 2009
Thanks: 16 given, 9 received

Mike,
Congrats to you for the poll seeking input before making the "Executive" decision. I don't think that the small fee to get full use of the site is unreasonable.

razor

 
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  #133 (permalink)
 zt379 
UK London
 
Experience: None
Platform: NT and XTrader
Trading: Tomorrow
 
Posts: 1,419 since Sep 2009
Thanks: 1,365 given, 1,596 received

My thoughts.

Thx for asking or putting this to your members Mike.

1). No to x number of posts.
2) No to x number of anything.
3) Make all Downloads Elite.
4) There's so much more then indicators for free on futures.io (formerly BMT) available to non-Elite members.
5) There's a sense of integrity somewhere in there. You know when it's worth it.
7) Lastly...I paid the Elite fee twice (messed up the first one as a 3 month thing).
So there's always that option for the "testers"...

8) Perhaps limit the number of downloads for that reduced 3 month subscription ?
9) I wouldn't particularly like any increase for present Elite members
10) No to any other monthly/annual fee. That wouldn't be what I thought the ethos of the site was.
11) Some things are organic and I believe that members would themselves, make this site what they want it to be !
(perhaps with "ignore" and "report" facilities to help" ?)

Kind regards to all at futures.io (formerly BMT)..

"Every moment I wake up I realize I know nothing, and then I smile..." zt379
 
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  #134 (permalink)
 Swishy27 
Orlando, FL
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Sierra Chart, BookMap
Trading: ES, NQ,YM, ZB, ZN
 
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Posts: 68 since Dec 2009
Thanks: 105 given, 81 received

Big Mike

I'll be honest and tell you I do not make a lot of posts and still I have downloaded alot of Ninjatrader indicators in my time here to test different ideas and strategies in my search for the holy grail. I haven't posted mostly because I don't feel I have reached a level where I have anything of value to contribute. I do appreciate your site and the knowledge base it has provided to me and I am sure many others. I have always been very impressed that there are members here who make their hard work available free of charge to anyone who wants to download their custom indicators.

But sometimes free ain't free and the party has to come to an end. If you want to change the downloads section to elite only so be it. But I am afraid this will lead down the road to monthly fees and other paid requirements. What happens if this remedy doesn't fix the problem of the bots or trolls and the members who just aren't nice enough to the other members to just say "Thank You"?

I enjoy that this site allows me to see different points of views about trading. As long as that doesn't change or cost me more than I am willing to spend I am cool with whatever you want to do. At the least I appreciate you asking before you went ahead and made a change.

Thank You

 
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  #135 (permalink)
 tigertrader 
Philly, Pa
 
Experience: Master
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: ES, ZB
 
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Posts: 6,255 since Jul 2010
Thanks: 6,574 given, 34,957 received

Not that I'm an elitist, mind you; but elite only is the way to go!

Follow me on Twitter
 
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  #136 (permalink)
 andersonnd 
CT USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Variety
Trading: ES, Stocks
 
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Posts: 7 since May 2011
Thanks: 0 given, 1 received

I agree the post minimum creates a lot of noise on the site as people rush to fill quota with what is often meaningless content. As for protecting people's hard work (i.e. downloads) it needs to be a priority. Successful communities stand up for their members. Part of doing that on this site is preventing predatory downloaders.

However, directly linking that to the "profitability" of the site complicates the issue. If there is a way to prevent the meaningless noise (post minimum) and protect the downloads as a matter of community principle without the need to involve cash, I believe we'll find the most efficient solution and in the end the members and the site will both benefit. So, I'd encourage people to come up with strong alternatives that don't involve what essentially becomes paying for downloads.

I elected to become an elite member because the of the quality of the content in the posts, not actually for the downloads (though they are terrific as well).

Pull the string.
 
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  #137 (permalink)
 Silver Dragon 
Legendary Data Wizard!!!
Cincinnati Ohio
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TastyWorks
Broker: TastyWorks
Trading: FX, Stocks, Options
 
Silver Dragon's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,005 since Feb 2011
Thanks: 5,755 given, 4,868 received

Mike,

I have mixed feelings about making it all elite. In order to attract new members you need to throw a enticement their way. Perhaps rotating a small selection of the current free downloads in and out of elite status on a quarterly basis would be a way to entice new members and keep the bots at bay. Let the owner of the code decide if they want to be part of the rotation.

To be honest, the free download section is why I joined in the first place. It was soon after I realized the futures.io (formerly BMT) members had a wealth of knowledge and experience which I have never seen on any other site. I remember thinking if they have this kind of information in the free section then the elite must be even better! At that point I knew I had to become a elite.

I dont know what the right answer is however, cutting the world totally off will eventually make futures.io (formerly BMT) stale. On the other hand if you dont limit the size somehow it will grow beyond manageability and make futures.io (formerly BMT) just another trading site.

For the record, I am not opposed to paying annual fee. I have learned more here about real world trading than all the books I have read combined. 50 bucks a year would be money well spent.

SD

nosce te ipsum

You make your own opportunities in life.
Visit my futures io Trade Journal
 
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  #138 (permalink)
dkrumholz
Trenton, NJ
 
 
Posts: 2 since May 2011
Thanks: 0 given, 1 received

Let me start by stating the obvious - you have every right to do what you want.

I am a web developer and consultant to several other web communities so here is what I would counsel -

If your goal is to earn income then of course you should charge - as much as you can!

If you are really only trying to thwart bots then you just have a technical issue.

If you are trying to prevent copyright infringement then it is time to discuss the issue with a lawyer. I see nothing wrong with soliciting dollars from community members to go toward legal fees.

If your goal is to expand this community - limiting access will have the opposite effect.

I would however pursue everyone that did not provide acceptable attribution.

The community and it's content has value. I assume that your goal is to maximize that value. Just make sure that you reallistically decide what it is that you want to accomplish before deciding how best to proceed.

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  #139 (permalink)
 daveste99 
Bellevue
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Tradestation
Trading: YM
 
Posts: 18 since Jul 2010
Thanks: 0 given, 2 received

but I do not post much here. I value the information that others post and am willing to pay for it.

I don't exactly understand the problem but my suggestion would be to charge $50 annually for the site and have all the downloads available to only the Elite members.

IMHO

Dave S.

 
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  #140 (permalink)
 babuinus 
Ukraine
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 3 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 14 given, 0 received

Ok, Mike, let's do it!

 
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  #141 (permalink)
 purvirakesh 
locust grove/ga
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
 
Posts: 2 since Mar 2010
Thanks: 0 given, 0 received

I would go for $100 for elite membership. Not to big but not to small amount either. This will atleast screen out fews and i have another idea which i will have to PM it to you for a reason.

But i really enjoyed futures.io (formerly BMT) membership. Very first day when i visited futures.io (formerly BMT), After reading few threads, i signed up for Elite membership just because i wanted to appreciate the effort you and other elite member are putting into it.

 
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  #142 (permalink)
 ematt66 
Toronto, Canada
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Ninja 6.5
Trading: currency futures
 
Posts: 1 since Oct 2010
Thanks: 1 given, 0 received


babuinus View Post
Ok, Mike, let's do it!

I totally agree

 
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  #143 (permalink)
 miallvro 
az
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: tos
Broker: tos td ib
Trading: futures
 
Posts: 5 since Apr 2010
Thanks: 0 given, 1 received

Personally, I would favor all downloads requiring an elite membership. I gladly paid the $50, and quite honestly if someone can't afford $50 then they shouldn't be trading in the first place.

I will take it one step further and offer that if the downloads go paid, I will setup a real-time web-based chat for all elite members. I wold do it either way, if Mike is ok with it.

I am partners in a trading website that charges a monthly fee. (not going to mention it here out of respect).

We have been talking about offering a 'free' chat for trading. It would probably benefit our site as well, but I don't think my partners would object to using the platform we have built to offering something back to this site. We do regular webinars, so maybe I can offer them here too.

Thank you to everyone who takes their own time to make this site possible.

Follow me on Twitter
 
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  #144 (permalink)
 km5po 
Irving, Texas
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader & TradeStatio
Trading: CL
 
Posts: 1 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 0 given, 0 received

Mike- please implement this idea. Elite only to download. I also think you should charge a lot more for membership. Somehow "Elite" and 50 bucks don't seem right in the same sentence to me.

-Jim, Arlington Texas

 
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  #145 (permalink)
 WaveForm 
Essex
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT
Trading: GBP/6B, 6E, ES, CL
 
Posts: 1 since Mar 2010
Thanks: 1 given, 0 received

I have no problems with Elite-only downloads. I valued the work on the indicators here and paid into the Elite member thing very early on anyway.

 
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  #146 (permalink)
 bobbakerr 
Riverdale, Idaho, USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Optimus Futures + MultiCharts + TradeStation
Broker: Optimus Futures, Rithmic Data, TradeStation
Trading: CL, ES
 
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Posts: 113 since Aug 2010
Thanks: 229 given, 49 received


Massive l View Post
IMO have two different account types. One for elite and one for downloads only. The downloads only group should be much cheaper than the elite. Maybe someone might start out as a download only and pay $10 or whatever and then later on decide to go elite, making a total of $60.

I somewhat agree with Massive. Only the opposite for the cost: Elite contributions the same; but the Downloads section much more expensive. If someone truly wants to download, he must truly pay for it, with the amount split 50-50 between Big Mike and the person who wrote the code.

 
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  #147 (permalink)
 Tradesailor 
Chicago U.S.
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja, Ensign 10
Trading: es
 
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Posts: 1 since Mar 2011
Thanks: 1 given, 0 received

Nothing is for free that is worth having no easy road to trading success. Everyone must pay their fair share and be respectful and responsible to others that have invested time and money to make trading templates and methods that work.

 
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  #148 (permalink)
 ct1942 
Kansas City,MO
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja
Broker: zen fire
Trading: es
 
Posts: 44 since Jan 2010
Thanks: 112 given, 18 received

I think restricting to Elite only is the way to go....I know I would never join any site that required 50 posts to become a full member. I also want to discourage riff raft.

 
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  #149 (permalink)
 Zwaen 
Netherlands, Blaricum
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Excel, Python, R
Broker: IB
Trading: Options
 
Zwaen's Avatar
 
Posts: 250 since Dec 2010
Thanks: 848 given, 238 received

Since I didn't posted downloads for other people I don't feel I have the " right" to have an opinion about it, and the creators of the share-ware should decide.

For my opinion, I joined futures.io (formerly BMT) also first just for 1 or 2 downloads, but as my experience / knowledge expanded I really liked the serious posting ( and lack of junk-posts ) on this forum. To me the enormous threads on other forums are often too time-consuming to read. So I think a small fee is oke as a firewall for junk-posts.

 
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  #150 (permalink)
 ValutaTrader 
Oslo,Norway
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: EUR/USD
 
ValutaTrader's Avatar
 
Posts: 66 since Apr 2011
Thanks: 4 given, 52 received

I am quite a new member on this site, and have only been actively following the forum for the last Month, but with experience from other forums I agree to having the download section restricted to Elite members

Follow me on Twitter
 
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  #151 (permalink)
 dowtrader 
London
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader, MarketDelta
Broker: Zen-Fire, DTN IQ
Trading: YM
 
Posts: 16 since Oct 2010
Thanks: 44 given, 10 received

Like several other posters have already mentioned, it all depends on what you are trying to achieve at futures.io (formerly BMT) by making the changes.

I am all for Elite-only downloads but I think that whatever changes are made should definitely not have any adverse affect on existing Elite members and hopefully will enhance Elite membership.

dowtrader

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  #152 (permalink)
 peter hughes 
australia
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: ninja trader
Trading: eur/usd
 
Posts: 12 since Nov 2010
Thanks: 0 given, 1 received

I don't have a lot to say but;
1. you provide a forum unequalled in quality
2. the education within your site is extrordinary
3 .a lot of the elite members are amongst the few willing to share MEANINGFUL information and experience
4. not all the charlatans and b******t artists are on the sell side of this industry. anonymous egomaniacs abound

my thoughts on your dilemma
1. double the fee to $100
2. have a trial (say 14 days) which does not allow downloads
3. if any member is found guilty of posting forum downloads to other sites without the poster's specific permission- automatic expulsion
4.use some of the extra money to check membership info e.g. email ,phone ,address
5. don't allow nicknames - "hotrod harry" should be "peter hughes from australia"

In the end it's your site if you're not comfortable with the c**p then get rid of it

 
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  #153 (permalink)
 Silver Dragon 
Legendary Data Wizard!!!
Cincinnati Ohio
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TastyWorks
Broker: TastyWorks
Trading: FX, Stocks, Options
 
Silver Dragon's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,005 since Feb 2011
Thanks: 5,755 given, 4,868 received

if this route is taken then some type of evaluation of the code would have to be done. If not the download section would be clogged up with garbage indicators from people trying to make a quick buck.


bobbakerr View Post
I somewhat agree with Massive. Only the opposite for the cost: Elite contributions the same; but the Downloads section much more expensive. If someone truly wants to download, he must truly pay for it, with the amount split 50-50 between Big Mike and the person who wrote the code.


nosce te ipsum

You make your own opportunities in life.
Visit my futures io Trade Journal
 
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  #154 (permalink)
 GaryD 
Orlando, Florida
 
Experience: None
Platform: shoes
Trading: happy
 
GaryD's Avatar
 
Posts: 6,462 since May 2011

I was actually surprised to find so many indicators to download without joining the site as an elite member. Requiring a $50.00 paid membership to download quality indicators is cheap.

There are some incredible programmers who share their work here. I'd even support allowing members to charge per single indicator, at the contributor's discretion. The images and descriptions give an idea of what the indicators do, and programmers could post threads as a free example to show how they use them.

But, my general comment on indicators is that none can save you. An indicator is a tool, but no more makes one a trader that owning a circular saw makes one a carpenter. The real value to futures.io (formerly BMT), in my opinion, is the wealth of knowledge that is shared in the journals and posts. Seeing how other traders use the indicators that they have, learning the psychological make up of succesful traders, etc.

 
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  #155 (permalink)
 topedge 
calgary,canada
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: mt4,nt
Trading: forex, CL, GC, ES
 
Posts: 4 since Apr 2011
Thanks: 0 given, 3 received

I think this is one of my first posts here. I don't think I have downloaded any thing from this site. Givers gain! It seems to me this thread is full of what we as traders see most often - fear and greed. Who cares if someone is benefiting from our work? If you feel like futures.io (formerly BMT) is not charging enough then donate. Sounds like Warren Buffett's argument. If greed is not an issue then give it away. It hasn't stopped people from posting up till present. I think it takes away from community of giving. I am not a socialist and think its time capitalists recognize that system needs adjustments. I don't like government intervention but somehow the greed needs to be dealt with. If someone has a code they don't want to give away then have a charge zone. Givers Gain! I will make a better contribution. It has been a real challenge to learn this trade and now have some experience and knowledge which may benefit others. Thanks for this site futures.io (formerly BMT).


 
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  #156 (permalink)
idefix
Stuttgart
 
 
Posts: 2 since Sep 2011
Thanks: 0 given, 0 received

Hi there ,

my first post - here it comes !
As I am a total newbie to trading and this forum - I'd just add :

Let the designer of the code decide !

Then you've got it all - resonable appreciation of hard work (Elite) and still the option to share freely if desired.


Thanks for this plattform - Mike! I feel it's worth millions


cheers
pascal

 
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  #157 (permalink)
 ilikeread 
San Mateo, CA, USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 44 since Aug 2010
Thanks: 196 given, 26 received


dkrumholz View Post
Let me start by stating the obvious - you have every right to do what you want.

I am a web developer and consultant to several other web communities so here is what I would counsel -

If your goal is to earn income then of course you should charge - as much as you can!

If you are really only trying to thwart bots then you just have a technical issue.

If you are trying to prevent copyright infringement then it is time to discuss the issue with a lawyer. I see nothing wrong with soliciting dollars from community members to go toward legal fees.

If your goal is to expand this community - limiting access will have the opposite effect.

I would however pursue everyone that did not provide acceptable attribution.

The community and it's content has value. I assume that your goal is to maximize that value. Just make sure that you reallistically decide what it is that you want to accomplish before deciding how best to proceed.

dkrumholz, I like your post a lot. This is very clear judgement about the situation.

BigMike, Thank you very much for making this wonderful site. I guess now there are so much voice on this subject, would you think this suggestion useful? Design a questionaire, the big structure could be just like dkrumholz's idea. Let's do some online poll as this thread are moving forward.

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  #158 (permalink)
 don10 
Noosaville QLD Australia
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader, Genesis
Trading: Futures, SPI 200
 
Posts: 15 since Sep 2010
Thanks: 37 given, 5 received

Hi Mike,

I think it sounds like a good idea to have downloads only for Elite members only. If anyone is serious they will pay the membership to get access to the downloads. For me futures.io (formerly BMT) is excellent value with so much good info for not a lot of cost to members, so I think what you are saying is very reasonable.

Regards,

Don

 
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  #159 (permalink)
 longboat 
Philadelphia, Pa
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Sierra Charts
Broker: Amp/CQG
Trading: CL, ES
 
longboat's Avatar
 
Posts: 144 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 901 given, 214 received

Yea I think elite only for downloads is probably the best way to go

 
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  #160 (permalink)
 Superdoug3 
Vernon, BC, Canada
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Sierra Charts
Broker: Zaner Group (Transact)
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 103 since Apr 2010
Thanks: 113 given, 63 received

I love this site. As I am a newbie, I haven't posted much BUT I plan to start a journal in the next week.
If the following are the issues
1. Honoring the work put in by indicator contributors. - How do the developers feel about poaching of their work?
2. Keeping a community feeling and generosity of spirit on this site. Haven't the moderators done a very good job of this?
3. encouraging enthusiastic forum participation by all members. I guess I fit into this one. I was attracted to this site by Beth's thread. I did post to her thread and I have hanked a few contributors but until I have a few months of screen time under my belt, I am not qualified to coach.
4. Since you see a problem, I can not disagree because you have the biggest overview. I would totally support your suggestion if implemented.
B.T.W. I am an elite member and am very happy I chose to be one.

 
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  #161 (permalink)
 bizman70 
toronto, ontario
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: ninja trader
Broker: sterling, iqfeed
Trading: es, nq, 6e
 
bizman70's Avatar
 
Posts: 363 since May 2010
Thanks: 41 given, 140 received

I think that there should be the opportunity for elite and non elite memebers to be able to download - some traders who are not in the elite section but are good traders and contribute to the site by downloading and testing and communicating info about the indicators ( good and bad) it makes the programes and the traders better .

It is possible to maybe have a social concept where the programers or elite members invite others to communicate with and share with in a type of closed network.

the programers in turn have the right or ability to post to the regular or elite downloads but can choose who to actually work with or communicate with or share with.

Visit my futures io Trade Journal
 
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  #162 (permalink)
 TheWizard 
Houston, TX
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: Optimus Futures, AMP, CQG
Trading: 6E
 
TheWizard's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,736 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 517 given, 4,214 received

Make EVERYTHING Elite. This is one of the reasons I don't post very much anymore. I simply can't remember where I got this indicator or that indicator or this template or that template or... whatever. And I don't want to spend the next 2 hours hunting & searching so I can determine whether or not it was originally *Elite*. And I don't want to keep an Excel spreadsheet tallying where I got what, and when I got it and from whom I got it, so I can check & double-check before posting anything anywhere.

Make EVERYTHING Elite. That way, no worries for any posters. If anyone wants any of this stuff, (and there's quite a lot of good stuff here to want!), let them fork over some $$.

Imagine getting an entire trading library of goodies, indicators, templates, strategies, education - all for the low price of $xx (I haven't checked to see what Elite costs these days. It's more than when I joined 3 years back, but still worth the price).

Make EVERYTHING Elite. If Downloads are changed to Elite and threads are not, then you've solved nothing. Just shuffled the problem around. People (myself included!) are in the habit of posting indicators to threads - no matter the status of the thread. An Elite indicator could still creep into a non-Elite thread. And we're still faced with the hassle of determining where we got the indicator in the first place. Was it posted to a non-Elite thread, an Elite-only thread - regular downloads - Elite downloads? OY!!!!!

Make EVERYTHING Elite. No need to re-visit the problem again.

After all, it's what you learn AFTER you know it all, that counts!
 
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  #163 (permalink)
 JohnnyCash 
Mechanicsville, va
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader
Broker: amp
Trading: ES, YM, TF, NQ, 6B, 6e
 
JohnnyCash's Avatar
 
Posts: 49 since Jul 2009
Thanks: 133 given, 27 received

This is the trading site out there because of Big Mike and if Big Mike thinks something needs to be done, then make it happen! Can't wait to see how the new change makes this site even better....thanks for everything Big Mike!!

 
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  #164 (permalink)
 PamelaL 
Navarre FL US
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja, TradeStation
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 7 since Dec 2010
Thanks: 2 given, 1 received

I think that the downloads should be for Elite members only. If they are not willing to put the very small amount to join the Elite, then they are not really interested in learning about trading. I am not strong on the idea of number of posts. I do not post much if at all in futures.io (formerly BMT) but I do not think that is a measure of interest or ability to contribute. I think many of us have very busy lives and while I visit futures.io (formerly BMT), I do not live at futures.io (formerly BMT). I do not mind paying for the Elite download ability but I think to measure someone's interest based on much they are willing to chat is not reasonable.

 
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  #165 (permalink)
Firehawkaz27
Phoenix
 
 
Posts: 2 since Aug 2011
Thanks: 0 given, 1 received

Whatever you decide is fine by me i dont abuse anything but if there are people taking advantage of certain things then maybe restrictions should apply you know this is the internet there are stupid people out there who like to ruin it for everyone

 
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  #166 (permalink)
 gswarner 
Graeagle, CA USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: EUR/USD - 6E Futures
 
Posts: 1 since Sep 2010
Thanks: 0 given, 0 received

I agree with having only Elite members have access to downloads.

 
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  #167 (permalink)
 Laurus12 
Norway
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: MultiCharts, CQG, NinjaTrader
Broker: CQG, DTN IQFeed
Trading: EURO
 
Laurus12's Avatar
 
Posts: 376 since Nov 2010
Thanks: 561 given, 355 received

Mike, do what you need to do. It is you who have the main responsibility in this forum and if you see "bots" from the outside downloading stuff and so on, you should restrict downloads for elite only.

Regarding 50 posts. Maybe 20 could be enough to filter out spammers. If report buttons was added the whole community could help out. Even if there is quality content in the forum, 50 posts could give people the feeling of not getting forward with the content. Anyhow I see it as a difficult decision to make. As a beginner even 20 posts could be much, especially when there is one specific topic one are interested in. Often people do not have anything to contribute or ask about until they have tried things out.

There are three things that make me stay in this forum:

1. Nice people.

2. Quality content.

3. I experience no crappy behavior. (except one time where two users were undiplomatic, but it stopped right away)

I have experienced crappy behavior in couple of other forums, which made me stop using them at once. Even if it was not directed at me personally. If this starts to become familiar here also, something unique will be lost.

To sort out the crap add "Report Spam" and "Abuse" buttons. I am aware that this could change the innocent atmosphere in the forum to some degree, so just camouflage it with adding some buttons with some not too serious symbols instead of text.

Laurus

“If you wish to see the truth, then hold no opinions for or against anything.” - Hsin Hsin Ming
 
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  #168 (permalink)
 rfiske 
temecula,ca
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NT
Broker: AMP/Zen
Trading: Euro
 
Posts: 46 since May 2010
Thanks: 32 given, 8 received

Yes - Elite only to download!!

 
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  #169 (permalink)
 Mabi 
sweden
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader,MetaTrader
Trading: futures, FX
 
Mabi's Avatar
 
Posts: 141 since Oct 2010
Thanks: 121 given, 135 received

I would think this might be my first post which is somewhat ridiclous after all i have read on here from You guy´s. When i first saw this site i only spend about 1 hour checking it out before i joined the elite and i am happy for it. My work is pretty demanding and tiresome but i do trade some now and then. I do think reading all great journal´s , webinars etc have made me a more confiden´t trader. Indicator´s i stopped using them nowdays since i know what they would be displaying if i had them on anyway, all though it´s fun to play with and you never know some one might have found an edge to exploit. This forum is so good and well organised and contains so much valuble information that paying 50 buck´s for it is pure luck!

So Mike , Please do whatever is nessecary to keep it so.

 
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  #170 (permalink)
 eerivera 
Escondido, CA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader, Ensign, ESignal
 
Posts: 1 since Sep 2009
Thanks: 0 given, 0 received

I joined the Elite access specifically for NT indicators. I am very grateful for what I have been able to download and test and frankly don't know of any other site, including Ninjatrader itself that has offered more value. I have no programming skills and doubt I will ever venture even into auto-trading it is so daunting without a resource like futures.io (formerly BMT) and the contributors to it. So as far as I am concerned the very least I must do is pay for the this fantastic resource. And you have made that an easy option. For those that do and have contributed, it seems they have given and deserve a break on membership costs. For those that are new and have even less of a clue than I have, they should get to see what is available before they decide to buy. So, I also vote for Elite only download access, and a slightly higher, even annual renewal for those like myself that have little to contribute but a fee to keep it going.

 
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  #171 (permalink)
 bobc635 
Tucson
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: Stage5
Trading: CL, YM
 
Posts: 191 since Jan 2011
Thanks: 134 given, 195 received

I agree with your points BigMike. In fact, I would go one step further and add the funky text that you need to confirm for each download. The real traders that are enjoying the value of your site would probably not be too bothered by having to verify some short word to ensure that the site is not being taken advantage of. You have built a wonderful site that is easy to navigate and really helps all of us, and we have a great community of cooperation.

Thanks for your great work...
BobC


Big Mike View Post
All,

I am contemplating a major / drastic change to the behavior of all downloads on the site. The change would be to make all downloads Elite Only. I mean all downloads, in posts, threads, downloads section, everywhere globally. The only exclusion would be images (screen shots), but all other file types would be available only to Elite Members.

I have mixed feelings on this, so wanted to get some feedback from the users to consider as well before making any decisions. The main reason for the desire to change is to protect the work and to protect the value of the community.

Right now, too many "bots" are downloading our indicators and posting them on other sites as their own. Right now, too many real people register "fake" accounts because they can't even be bothered to spend 30 seconds to type in correct info when they register, all because all they want is to download something and likely never participate further in the site.

I previously tried enforcing a 10 post minimum for downloads, but all that did was have people create 10 junk posts. So that isn't going to work.

It seems the best way to protect the collection of downloads the users have worked very hard on, is to restrict access to only those who are serious about trading.

It certainly doesn't have to be Elite only, but the only other realistic option to implement is the minimum post requirement. If I change it to say 50 (instead of what we tried before, 10) then maybe it would prevent people from creating 50 spam posts just to download something, but still allow people who are serious about trading - but for whatever reason aren't Elite members - to still download. But the problem is, 50 posts is far, far more than what most people have (unfortunately), so such a requirement is likely to just piss off a lot of people.

The desire to change is not about increasing Elite sign ups. In fact, lately I have been wondering if futures.io (formerly BMT) is getting "too big" as we've started to attract some of the trolls from other sites and sometimes some of the posts are getting unfriendly lately. I am fighting this very hard as I am sure you are as well. We all want futures.io (formerly BMT) to remain a unique place, a place where everyone is truly here to help, and not start arguments, call each other names, or other troll like behavior. So this might mean making futures.io (formerly BMT) a more exclusive place where only serious traders are welcome.

Now obviously, just because someone pays for Elite membership does not automatically mean they are a serious trader. But they are probably far less likely to be a trouble maker while paying for the privilege to be here.

So a move of making all downloads Elite only might stunt our growth in terms of new user sign ups to the site, but that is fine with me if it means that what growth we have is of a higher quality and caliber user. I don't want to make the requirement solely based on post count, because there are far, far too many people who do not post much but are still working very hard to improve their trading. These people have signed up for Elite status to help support the site, and I think that entitles them to receive the downloads without a minimum post requirement.

Anyway, so there it is. Some of my many thoughts on the matter. Please share yours. I'm hoping to get a good mix of replies from both Elite Members and non-Elite Members.

Mike


 
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  #172 (permalink)
 445NDO 
New York
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja Trader
Broker: ZenFire
Trading: ES / OIL / GLD
 
Posts: 3 since Dec 2009

Here is my view since i have been fighting for and on behalf of futures.io (formerly BMT) for quite a while and it seem the hard work on this board is going into wrong hands :

1. Welcome to AlphaTrend Software Services (Michael Paul Kanuika)

2. EZ Signal - Your Gateway to the Futures World! - Home --> (fake account under the name of Beth and owner is wgreenie)

3. Indicator Warehouse | NinjaTrader | 877-646-5249


Mike i am very surprised that you have not taken any step to protect your team members here on this board. ( Apologize for being a little rude but i have been voicing my concerns past alomost 1 year)


PLEASE BAN FAKE ACCOUNTS AND ALSO AUTHENTICATE ALL ACCOUNTS WITH IP ADDRESSES SO THAT WE KNOW WHO IS AND FROM WHERE HE IS LOGGING.


MAKE THIS WHOLE BOARD FOR ELITE ONLY AND MAKE EVERYONE ACCEPT futures.io (formerly BMT) TERMS AND CONDITIONS NOT TO POST OR SELL INDICATORS WHICH ARE HERE FOR EDUCATION AND TRADERS HELPING EACH OTHERS

 
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  #173 (permalink)
bgeorge
Thessaloniki
 
 
Posts: 29 since Jun 2010
Thanks: 4 given, 8 received

I am not an Elite member, and I have made very few posts. And I agree it is fair to allow only Elite members to download.

 
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  #174 (permalink)
 macro 
South Pasadena, California, Un
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: ES
 
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Posts: 5 since Dec 2010
Thanks: 0 given, 2 received

Add my vote for downloads for elete members only.

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  #175 (permalink)
 Devil Man 
Legendary Capt. Johnny Jameson
Fort Lauderdale
 
Experience: None
Platform: Optimus Flow, NT8. TS
Broker: CQG, Rithmic
Trading: ES
 
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Posts: 811 since Oct 2009
Thanks: 3,055 given, 1,426 received

I say make everything elite.....

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  #176 (permalink)
 tradernovice 
Venice/Italy
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: MetaTrader4
Broker: Oanda
Trading: EurUsd
 
Posts: 23 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 361 given, 9 received

Hello Mike,
you made the best forum for traders in the world and, for me, you are the one that better knows what it is necessary to do to keep it on top.
I learned a lot since when I joined here.
I apologies with everybody because I posted nothing usefull for the others untill now, but believe me, I am still trying to survive for the moment, and I really have nothing good to share with others yet.
Many thanks for what you did.
TN

 
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  #177 (permalink)
 Shaun Z 
Las Vegas, NV USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: MT4 & NinjaTrader
Broker: AMP & CQG
Trading: EURUSD
 
Shaun Z's Avatar
 
Posts: 1 since Jul 2011
Thanks: 6 given, 0 received

I really agree with your proposal to only allow ELITE members to download. I am not an ELITE member but given what is happening to the site it makes sense that precautionary measures need to be implemented.

Thanks - Shaun Z

 
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  #178 (permalink)
 smatthew 
Amsterdam, The Netherlands
 
 
Posts: 1 since Aug 2011

I registered to get the indicator for displaying news events in Ninjatrader.
I've never intended to make a contribution to this site.
Therefore I'd recommend to make it harder for people like me to just register, download stuff and give back nothing.
Would be a waste to see a good source of information go down because of leeches like myself.

 
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  #179 (permalink)
 dstrader 
Chicago, USA
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: TS, NT, TOS, SSE, IRT
Trading: ES, currency futures, options, stocks
 
Posts: 195 since Dec 2010
Thanks: 329 given, 273 received

I agree, downloads just to Elite members. I would also consider having just Elite members on the site, so we make sure that just people truly interested in trading would participate. The site is becoming so big that there are too many useless posts. People should prevent adding posts just for the sake of posting. Sometimes you go thru 20 or 30 pages of posts to find just a few that are truly useful.
If someone doesn't have 50/100 bucks to participate in a serious trading forum, they probably shouldn't even be thinking about trading.

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  #180 (permalink)
 Bama Bob 
Birmingham, Alabama
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: IRT/Linnsoft Stage 5
Broker: Stage 5
Trading: NQ, ES, Bonds, Euro, Crude
 
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Posts: 4 since Aug 2010
Thanks: 89 given, 6 received

All, give them 2 downloads then the 3rd should make elite status if they are serious. the Bots are invading all of twitter as well. It is a pain for those who are trying to learn only to have some geek who thinks they are being funny screw up the works for the rest of us.

 
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  #181 (permalink)
 Will 
Providence
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT, TradeStation
 
Posts: 6 since Nov 2010
Thanks: 104 given, 2 received

I agree all should be Elite. We should all think further about how to prevent unauthorized re-posting elsewhere.

 
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  #182 (permalink)
 zordell 
Warrenpoint, Newry, Co Down, N
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader
Trading: Stocks
 
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Posts: 3 since Feb 2011
Thanks: 0 given, 0 received

Hi this is my first post as i am new to trading and have never felt i have anything to contribute but i agree that downloads should be made elite. The price is a small one and some of these indicators are great.
Anyway that's my 2 cents worth

Cheers
Eugene

 
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  #183 (permalink)
kuroro13
paris
 
 
Posts: 2 since Apr 2010
Thanks: 0 given, 1 received

Hello,

First post here but I am a silent follower even tough I do not contribute mainly because I have nothing interesting to say.
I had once a forum and met the same problem you do so I will give you my experience on this topic.
We tried a system based on reward according to the content of the posts/threads made by our members.
If they got enough points they would be allowed to download various interesting things documents,code etc...but it did not work since some members participate only to get their hands on something they wanted then disappeared.
We then tried to make a system close to your elite membership but once again it failed. Why ? Same problem here...making them pay doesn't mean that they will participate more. Plus some people clearly disagreed with our policy and left the forum. After a while,the forum slowly died...

The thing is you can't force people to do what they don't want to...trying this will only worsened things.
Yeah this is sad but that is how it works nowadays. I think FREEDOM is the most important value to keep when you want to create a community or at least this is the lesson I have been given. Once you add money and duties to the equation people tend to leave and go to some other place they will judge better for their taste.

Personnally I do not mind paying for elite membership or having to post 50 or so posts to download stuffs even tough I cannot remember the last time I download anything on futures.io (formerly BMT) but I won't contribute more because I do not have time to do so but even if I had the time I would not contribute much. Here is why :
-I certainly have very interesting scripts but I am not willing to share them since I used them for a living and they are more advanced than those on your forum (I am not talking about the elite stuffs since I don't have an elite membership). Every (serious?) trader has a dark side and there is a limit on the things you can share.
I could of course share all the codes I do not use but I know they do not work and people using them would only lose money.
-After all those years, I became wary of the net. I read topics I find interesting but do not participate anymore.
Almost all the posts I read,the scripts I look at give me this feeling of "been there done that". I think I lost the will to contribute efficiently on any forum mainly because the level is a little bit low to me now. I am not trying to be pretentious or anything it is just that I might have grown to the point I do not need to search for answers on a forum...I sometimes follow threads or download scripts out of curiosity BUT I never found anything that could be of value for my trading.

Oups, I forgot to tell a little bit more about me. So I have been trading for 12 years or so and approximately 4 for a living. I am exclusively doing algorithmic trading, mathematics oriented, no technical analysis (I believe it does not work).

Hope my little experience will help you mike, I wish you the best for your forum

kuroro13, member of the silent majority.

 
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  #184 (permalink)
 madLyfe 
Des Moines, Iowa
 
Experience: None
Platform: Ninja, TOS
Broker: AMP/CQG, TOS
Trading: CL, TF, GC
 
madLyfe's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,644 since Feb 2011
Thanks: 9,220 given, 1,015 received

here is my take on it, im all for the original idea.. looking for for myself and others who are already elite members i do not endorse raising the price on anything unless the current group of elite members up to the point of the change are grandfathered in to the terms that we signed up for. not that you are even considering raising pricing, but i see people tossing that idea around. do i think this site is worth allot more given the information and indicators provided here? yes of course. what i do believe in is upholding the contract that we(elite members) agreed upon. i still have the email that shows what we received with our purchase for the life time of us or the site. if others have the extra cash and think it should go to the site then i think there should be a donate button if there isnt one. i guess thats gunna make me sound cheap but thats why i wrote that explanation.

here is a reason why a reoccurring payment method is flawed and the one time fee is perfect... the purpose of the site is to create a community of traders to help each other out in a way that no other site does so that we can further our trading abilities. there is no incentive to the people who are really helping others out to charge them on a reoccurring basis to do so. a one time flat fee will keep people around to help others and be apart of the community..

again i know that this is not what was proposed in your original post of the thread, but mostly for the people who are bringing up that kind of idea..

dont believe anything you hear and only half of what you see

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
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  #185 (permalink)
 pinto552 
New York, NY
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Trade Navigator, CQG, Tradestation, Ninja, Interactive Brokers
Trading: Futures
 
Posts: 10 since May 2011
Thanks: 121 given, 7 received

I agree with the idea that downloads should be restricted to the elite.

As far as the whole site being elite i could go either way. You would certainly loose the majority of the troublemakers if everyone had to pay. But you would loose alot of good contributers that don't post down loadable files.

So i would vote pay to download, free if not.

 
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  #186 (permalink)
 davidfa 
Barcelona / Spain
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT
Broker: ZenFire
Trading: CL
 
davidfa's Avatar
 
Posts: 116 since Feb 2010
Thanks: 349 given, 145 received

I also agree to have that elite membership requirement on for downloads.
Keep up the good work guys, thanks for asking Mike.

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  #187 (permalink)
 edge19 
NH
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja,Tradestation
Broker: Zen
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 5 since Sep 2009
Thanks: 7 given, 1 received

Mike, I agree that all downloads should be for Elite members only. It will weed out people that aren't serious about trading or who are here for deceptive reasons.


Thanks for your tremendous effort in creating and managing this trading community!


Ron

 
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  #188 (permalink)
 allinfun1 
Spicewood
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT
Trading: CL
 
Posts: 3 since Dec 2010
Thanks: 1 given, 0 received

Require Elite to download. thanks all.

 
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  #189 (permalink)
 julien 
denver
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: ninjaTrader
Trading: es,oil
 
Posts: 2 since Sep 2010
Thanks: 0 given, 0 received

The Elite Members has been for me the best source of knowledge I have seen

This include other free sites as wells as people who charge thousands of dollars for indicator that are in many case inferior to what I have seen here

My belief is that paying 50 bucks for such a large database of knowledge and experience is a bargain but a necessary contribution to keep futures.io (formerly BMT) alive and well

I just wanted to thank you all for giving the opportunity to share your work and ideas

I agree with the idea that download should be elite and know I have been a pretty silent member but I am also in the process to develop my own thing and hopefully share it with you guys

thanks again

 
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  #190 (permalink)
 tomgilb 
Nashville TN USA
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: SierraChart
Broker: Sierra Futures/SC Denali
Trading: NQ ES YM
 
Posts: 430 since Nov 2009
Thanks: 168 given, 531 received

I'm in favor of allowing downloads only for Elite members.

Elite membership preserves the integrity of the community, and just the fact that it costs something will deter the riffraff.

Even though I don't post very often, I really appreciate this forum for it's professionalism and that it is very well moderated. Some trading forums are just trash talk, but futures.io (formerly BMT) is the exact opposite. Anything that helps keep it that way is a plus.

-Tom

 
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  #191 (permalink)
 nmk85roll 
chicago, il
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: ninja Trader
 
Posts: 26 since Mar 2010
Thanks: 3 given, 8 received

My only concern would be the minimum post requirement. I myself am an elite member, but I rarely post. However, I can tell you I've ready close to 90% of all the threads on this board to learn as much as I possibly can. I'll ask a question here and there, but I'm trying to soak up as much information as a beginner as possible. This is the only downside I can see about minimum post requirements.

 
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  #192 (permalink)
 marcelo_s 
BUENOS AIRES
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: ninja
Broker: AMP
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 34 since Nov 2009
Thanks: 0 given, 13 received


Big Mike View Post
All,

I am contemplating a major / drastic change to the behavior of all downloads on the site. The change would be to make all downloads Elite Only. I mean all downloads, in posts, threads, downloads section, everywhere globally. The only exclusion would be images (screen shots), but all other file types would be available only to Elite Members.

I have mixed feelings on this, so wanted to get some feedback from the users to consider as well before making any decisions. The main reason for the desire to change is to protect the work and to protect the value of the community.

Right now, too many "bots" are downloading our indicators and posting them on other sites as their own. Right now, too many real people register "fake" accounts because they can't even be bothered to spend 30 seconds to type in correct info when they register, all because all they want is to download something and likely never participate further in the site.

I previously tried enforcing a 10 post minimum for downloads, but all that did was have people create 10 junk posts. So that isn't going to work.

It seems the best way to protect the collection of downloads the users have worked very hard on, is to restrict access to only those who are serious about trading.

It certainly doesn't have to be Elite only, but the only other realistic option to implement is the minimum post requirement. If I change it to say 50 (instead of what we tried before, 10) then maybe it would prevent people from creating 50 spam posts just to download something, but still allow people who are serious about trading - but for whatever reason aren't Elite members - to still download. But the problem is, 50 posts is far, far more than what most people have (unfortunately), so such a requirement is likely to just piss off a lot of people.

The desire to change is not about increasing Elite sign ups. In fact, lately I have been wondering if futures.io (formerly BMT) is getting "too big" as we've started to attract some of the trolls from other sites and sometimes some of the posts are getting unfriendly lately. I am fighting this very hard as I am sure you are as well. We all want futures.io (formerly BMT) to remain a unique place, a place where everyone is truly here to help, and not start arguments, call each other names, or other troll like behavior. So this might mean making futures.io (formerly BMT) a more exclusive place where only serious traders are welcome.

Now obviously, just because someone pays for Elite membership does not automatically mean they are a serious trader. But they are probably far less likely to be a trouble maker while paying for the privilege to be here.

So a move of making all downloads Elite only might stunt our growth in terms of new user sign ups to the site, but that is fine with me if it means that what growth we have is of a higher quality and caliber user. I don't want to make the requirement solely based on post count, because there are far, far too many people who do not post much but are still working very hard to improve their trading. These people have signed up for Elite status to help support the site, and I think that entitles them to receive the downloads without a minimum post requirement.

Anyway, so there it is. Some of my many thoughts on the matter. Please share yours. I'm hoping to get a good mix of replies from both Elite Members and non-Elite Members.

Mike

I started as a commun member, and after paying to convert myself in a Elite member my commitment with the forum changed
Took some time to post things, as I came from TradeStation Easy language coding, and the forum helped me A LOT to learn to code for Ninja Trader

I suggest that downloads should come from Elite Members

 
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  #193 (permalink)
 HighDesertTrader 
Albuquerque, New Mexico/USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader-Continuum(Mirus)
Trading: emini Currency and Index Futures
 
Posts: 104 since Jan 2011
Thanks: 291 given, 108 received


Big Mike View Post
All,

I am contemplating a major / drastic change to the behavior of all downloads on the site. The change would be to make all downloads Elite Only. I mean all downloads, in posts, threads, downloads section, everywhere globally. The only exclusion would be images (screen shots), but all other file types would be available only to Elite Members.

...
Mike



I am wholeheartedly in favor of giving the rewards of the futures.io (formerly BMT) Forum to those who have earned it.

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  #194 (permalink)
 Babool 
Detroit, MI
 
Experience: Master
Platform: Sierra Chart
Trading: NQ, CL, ES, GC
 
Posts: 95 since Jul 2011
Thanks: 17 given, 124 received


Tiberius View Post
IMHO, I say open the threads to all; in the spirit of learning. You need an Elite membership to download indicators. If you want to play, you have to pay.

I agree with the above. Downloads should be limited to elite members.

Regards,
John

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  #195 (permalink)
 jondrus 
Columbia
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader,ToS,MATLAB
Trading: ES,CL,NEU
 
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Posts: 22 since Apr 2011
Thanks: 7 given, 12 received

My opinion is to make all of the downloads elite. I feel having people pay for elite membership causes them to not only take advantage of it, but have enough respect to become part of it.

I love futures.io (formerly BMT) and I would like to see the quality of posts remain the same (or even go up). I think making people pay for downloads would attract those who are more serious about trading and hopefully slow down the growing amount of useless/garbage posts by filtering out those who aren't so serious. I think it may also help turn away the naysayers and those who would otherwise bring less than a decent attitude towards others on the forums.

Although this probably won’t solve the problem completely, but is there a solution that works 100%? As we well know, you’d have to keep searching for the Holy Grail.

<sarcasm> As far as the post count goes…maybe you could do a walk forward optimization and find a number between one and 50 that only allows those in who you really want? </sarcasm>

I do not believe a post count would help, no matter what the count is.

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  #196 (permalink)
 dkelly 
Orange
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Multicharts
 
Posts: 13 since Mar 2010
Thanks: 1 given, 1 received

You have my vote. I originally became an Elite member so I could download the GOMI ladder. I
had a different perspective of the site after that.

 
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  #197 (permalink)
 bluemele 
Honolulu, Hawaii
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: ATC/TT, AMP/Zen-Fire, AMP/CQG
Trading: TF
 
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Posts: 2,547 since Jun 2010
Thanks: 3,803 given, 2,836 received

@Big Mike,

I think that is a good idea. Thanks for the effort.


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  #198 (permalink)
 hockeystar 
Calgary
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: TF, 6E
 
Posts: 182 since Jan 2011
Thanks: 552 given, 166 received

I agree with the majority as well Mike-- make it elite.

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  #199 (permalink)
 hiwaymn1 
charleston,wv
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: ninjatrader
Trading: oil,es,tf
 
Posts: 7 since Apr 2011
Thanks: 95 given, 2 received

I do believe that it should be for Elites only. There is alot of work and time goes into creating a workable download, I have tried an just giveup so thank's to the ones that are able to do this and keep it away from those who will not put in the time .

 
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  #200 (permalink)
 minsalaco 
new york, ny
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: eur/usd
 
Posts: 5 since Jan 2011
Thanks: 0 given, 7 received

Agree. I became an Elite member almost immediately after realizing the value offered on this website. I have benefited from the downloads here and my programming skill set, by way of download and subsequent modification and incorporation of various code ideas into my strats, has improved greatly. Significantly, and because I am a firm believer of giving value in return for value received, as I have separately promised Big Mik, I intend to post at least of one of my finalized strats for others to benefit from, as a way to contribute to the futures.io (formerly BMT) community. But I would be more inclined to post more finalized code if I felt that the pool of users here were ones that were also contributing (at a minimum, through the Elite membership fee) and eventually through sharing. (Note that futures.io (formerly BMT) is more than a blog like forexfactory.com; the webinars, downloads are a great resource and to maintain this site for all our benefit, for serious users, the Elite membership fee is a bargain at 10 times the price). As an aside, I'm more inclined to freely and liberally post finalized code for users that do contribute.

For anyone that understands the value in the downloads of this site, there should be no legitimate and/or reasonable opposition to the proposal by Big Mike.


Closed Thread

futures io Trading Community Feedback and Announcements > Elite only for ALL downloads?


Last Updated on September 10, 2011


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