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Daytrading the Emini S&P 500!
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Daytrading the Emini S&P 500!

  #31 (permalink)
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Look into Major Trend Reversals (also MTR Failures) they can be easier to spot and take time to develop which allow you to be prepared to take advantage of them.

Below is a futures.io (formerly BMT) webinar where Al Brooks talks about Trends, Reversals, and Ranges.



Below is another video where Al talks about the best price action setups:



Last edited by tturner86; February 19th, 2014 at 07:45 PM.
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  #32 (permalink)
The Bids are on the Left
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Silvester17 View Post
exactly!! how to use them is essential.

in order to put the market in context, some indicators can be extremely helpful. I wouldn't use them for triggering a trade, but I get a lot of useful information

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Silvester:

I have to agree with you, I can't count the number of times a OB/OS indicator or momentum indicator just to confirm something in a fast market has kept me from stepping on my male member. As long as it doesn't become analysis paralysis one two for those moments of doubt don't hurt.

Thanks,
Joe

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  #33 (permalink)
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SpearPointTrader View Post
I disagree at getting rid of indicators. I think you just have to know how to use them.

Sure, they have a lag, but a lag at the beginning of a move is inconsequential. As an example, the break out of a bollinger band squeeze may not show till after the move has started, HOWEVER, it still shows so near the beginning, and so far before the end, that you can capture a big chunk of the move anyway.

If your goal is to get every little bit of the price move, of course it won't work. However, if your goal is to catch a good sized slice from the middle of the move, it's works just fine. You'll miss the start, and you will miss the end, but everything in the middle is yours. This makes the lag irrelevant.

Keep in mind the context of this thread. The suggestions made were to a trader who has been trying unsuccessfully to turn a profit in this business for several years. Yet he is still asking questions like what is the best indicator, what are the best settings, what is the best stop size. With questions like that, it is very clear where the trader is on his journey (regardless of how long he's been trying).

So with the above context in mind,....my suggestion remains to get rid of the indicators and to learn to interpret market structure and context. Figure out what the market is actually trying to do. Forget about figuring out how to read indicators.

There may be a time and place to add them later down the road.

Diversification is the only free lunch
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  #34 (permalink)
The Bids are on the Left
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DarkPoolTrading View Post
Keep in mind the context of this thread. The suggestions made were to a trader who has been trying unsuccessfully to turn a profit in this business for several years. Yet he is still asking questions like what is the best indicator, what are the best settings, what is the best stop size. With questions like that, it is very clear where the trader is on his journey (regardless of how long he's been trying).

So with the above context in mind,....my suggestion remains to get rid of the indicators and to learn to interpret market structure and context. Figure out what the market is actually trying to do. Forget about figuring out how to read indicators.

There may be a time and place to add them later down the road.

I agree with your statement considering the progress. No one comes to this business with a feel for it. It is learned from and paid to the markets. Tuition. Get's intuition. There is no short cut. Computer's and all the greatness they have brought us, has killed learning technical fundamentals like keeping P and F charts by hand, or simple OHLC charts by hand from a quotron. From these rudamentary, mundane tasks...one used to learn how the market felt. If it felt toppy, it usually was... and one learned to rely on their gut from these tasks of hand charting.
Computers and their ability to calculate although they bring much to the business, have eroded the markets foundation for traders. IMHO--- trade well... Joe

In alcohol's defense, I've done some pretty dumb shit while completely sober too.
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  #35 (permalink)
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JFHughes View Post
I agree with your statement considering the progress. No one comes to this business with a feel for it. It is learned from and paid to the markets. Tuition. Get's intuition. There is no short cut. Computer's and all the greatness they have brought us, has killed learning technical fundamentals like keeping P and F charts by hand, or simple OHLC charts by hand from a quotron. From these rudamentary, mundane tasks...one used to learn how the market felt. If it felt toppy, it usually was... and one learned to rely on their gut from these tasks of hand charting.
Computers and their ability to calculate although they bring much to the business, have eroded the markets foundation for traders. IMHO--- trade well... Joe

Precisely. Most of us can think back to the first time we installed our shiny new trading platform and opened up our very first chart. Personally,...I probably looked at the chart for about 2 minutes at most before bringing up the list of indicators and thinking to myself: 'Wow! look at all these indicators,...I can't wait to start going through all of them and finding the best ones'. Honestly,...who didn't have a similar experience?

The problem with this is that so many people then just dive down the indicator rabbit hole, constantly looking for the best settings, the best combination, etc. The problem comes when a year down the line they're still doing the same thing and you ask them questions like: 'What is the current market state?', 'What is the market trying to go?', 'Does the market appear to be waiting for something or does it seem determined?', 'Where are the next most likely destinations?'.

All you're likely to get is a blank stare in return. But, oh boy, can they tell you about all the cool indicators they have on their charts,....but still aren't profitable CONSISTENTLY.

Learn to read the market with nothing but price and volume. Then consider adding indicators to aid in the solid foundation you've built.

Diversification is the only free lunch
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  #36 (permalink)
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DarkPoolTrading View Post
Precisely. Most of us can think back to the first time we installed our shiny new trading platform and opened up our very first chart. Personally,...I probably looked at the chart for about 2 minutes at most before bringing up the list of indicators and thinking to myself: 'Wow! look at all these indicators,...I can't wait to start going through all of them and finding the best ones'. Honestly,...who didn't have a similar experience?

The problem with this is that so many people then just dive down the indicator rabbit hole, constantly looking for the best settings, the best combination, etc. The problem comes when a year down the line they're still doing the same thing and you ask them questions like: 'What is the current market state?', 'What is the market trying to go?', 'Does the market appear to be waiting for something or does it seem determined?', 'Where are the next most likely destinations?'.

All you're likely to get is a blank stare in return. But, oh boy, can they tell you about all the cool indicators they have on their charts,....but still aren't profitable CONSISTENTLY.

Learn to read the market with nothing but price and volume. Then consider adding indicators to aid in the solid foundation you've built.

Indicators are like gauges in a car, they don't drive the car, but help you see if it is running correctly down the road.

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  #37 (permalink)
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SpearPointTrader View Post
I disagree at getting rid of indicators. I think you just have to know how to use them.

Sure, they have a lag, but a lag at the beginning of a move is inconsequential. As an example, the break out of a bollinger band squeeze may not show till after the move has started, HOWEVER, it still shows so near the beginning, and so far before the end, that you can capture a big chunk of the move anyway.

If your goal is to get every little bit of the price move, of course it won't work. However, if your goal is to catch a good sized slice from the middle of the move, it's works just fine. You'll miss the start, and you will miss the end, but everything in the middle is yours. This makes the lag irrelevant.

you don't need indicator to catch big move.

 
  #38 (permalink)
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I love this thread at the end it is a little bit off topic but still interesting. I traded FX with S/R, is it possible to trade the eminis this way? Keep up the good job! I really love your posts

 
  #39 (permalink)
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dm13dv1b View Post
... ... I traded FX with S/R, is it possible to trade the eminis this way? ... ...

Absolutely. Check out Mack's videos on YouTube as noted earlier. S/R is key to his (and my) profitable method.

Here is link to MACK again.

Richard
Hong Kong
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  #40 (permalink)
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What do they say. people learn in roughly this kind of order:

indicators
price action
order flow

As you go down you get closer to the the driver of the car, to use the analogy from an earlier post.

Come to think of it, I think that aptly describes why people lose money. Investing in that learning is not easy.

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