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Any FDAX traders here?


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Any FDAX traders here?

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  #1 (permalink)
 Twiddle 
Sydney, Australia
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Ninjatrader
Broker: Mirus
Trading: FDAX
 
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Hi all,

I am yet to go live after close to a year of sim trading. I have gotten to know the FDAX index fairly well in that time and I would like to go live trading 1 - 2 contracts shortly.

There is just a couple of things I would like help with if you wouldn't mind.

I have no experience with liquidity and how taking a position may affect the price. Is the FDAX contract liquid enough to enter positions easily and without affecting the price? How many contracts do you start to face liquidity problems with it?

Also, from what I can gather FDAX requires one of the largest margins out of all of the index futures - why is this?

And finally, are there any other highly volatile high liquidity futures contracts to trade around the time the DAX is trading? I trade the European session and the contracts I would like to trade tend to be fairly slow/low volume at that time, CL for example. It seems as if they are not worth trading at that time.
I have looked at FESX but it just does not seem to move enough for my scalping style, same deal with the Euro bund.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

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  #3 (permalink)
 trendisyourfriend 
Market Wizard
Quebec
 
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If i were located in the Euro zone i would not bother trading the Futures market. I would trade the Forex market with its plethora of currencies. The best moves occur when i sleep. You could trade the beast (GBP/JPY) or the beauty (GBP/USD) and be done in a couple of hours.

I don't think you might have any problem trading the FDAX with just 1 or 2 contracts specially if you trade at peak times. Have not ever heard people complaining about slippage.

Compare the Forex market volatility to the Futures market volatility.

Start here:

English: https://www.mataf.net/en/tools/02-01-volatility
French: https://www.mataf.net/fr/tools/02-01-volatility

Have not found such a tool for the Futures market.

Maybe BigMike might develop such a comparison tool for his site. Forex VS Futures markets volatility.

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  #4 (permalink)
 RabC 
London
 
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I've traded Dax for just over a year. It's more than liquid,think you'd have to trade in size to move it.
Good luck with it.

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  #5 (permalink)
twoshepards
Chicago, Il
 
 
Posts: 21 since Jul 2010
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FDAX is highly tradable. I spread it vs. the CME Emini contract as well as FESX and FTSE on Liffe.

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  #6 (permalink)
 MetalTrade 
 
 
Posts: 1,081 since May 2010

if u stay below 10 contracts u will be fine

if you trade with 1000 contracts size i would trade spot forex

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  #7 (permalink)
 jtrade 
near Amsterdam
 
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twoshepards View Post
FDAX is highly tradable. I spread it vs. the CME Emini contract as well as FESX and FTSE on Liffe.

Presumably during the US morning session only, using the X-Trader spread module ?

May I please ask how you learned to spread intraday (if that's what you're doing) ?

Twiddle : I trade FDAX outright looking for setups on a 15 min chart, then using an R5 range bar chart for entry & trade management, 2 to 4 contracts. Usually plenty of liquidity during the European morning, but if you aspire to trade a 20 lot one day and trade for small targets on a fast chart, you will have to accept a tick or two slippage.

FDAX has a high margin (although only $2500 intraday with Mirus) because it's volatile and the general view is absolutely NOT to start trading with FDAX, FESX being considerd preferable. I don't necessarily agree : if you have traded sim for a while and are consistently profitable with 1 - 2 contracts and are sufficiently capitalised, go for it. If your live results are not comparable with sim, stop live trading immediately and revert to sim & address what most likely will be the psychological issues getting in the way (the most challenging part of trading imho).

I'm not aware of a comparable futures market during the European morning - perhaps 6E to a lesser extent - the only alternative is to trade cash forex as one poster has suggested....

... or maybe trade FGBL with several times the size on a very fast chart. That should keep you focussed... (actually, every time I read one of sharky's posts I seriously consider this option) .

Lastly, beware of following suggestions from people you don't know on trading forums .

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  #8 (permalink)
 FulcrumTrader 
Austin, TX & Las Vegas, NV
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Investor RT Pro, NT 7.0
Trading: ES, DAX, CL, 6E
 
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I LOVE the DAX! I play gap fills 01:00 a.m. to 02:00 am US central time, and then from 2:00 am going forward (as the EU cash session opens) I work only Momentum Trades using my Cumulative Delta based set ups. The DAX trading all year has been some of the best (even better than CL trading at times) with these great currency moves in the background. DAX Momentum Trade explained from the other day..... YouTube - Momentum Trading The DAX With Cumulative Delta

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  #9 (permalink)
 Ralph07 
London UK
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, TT
Broker: Mirus
Trading: CL, Dax, ES, Eurostoxx50
 
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Hello,

I am searching a good timeframe for a tick chart to trade the DAX... Anyone has an idea?

Thanks a lot.

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  #10 (permalink)
 Ryanb 
Netherlands
 
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21 tick worked for me, but you have to see what works for you...

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  #11 (permalink)
 vinceb 
Buffalo NY
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja, Tradestation
Broker: Glocapmarkets
Trading: FDAX,FOREX,GOLD,NQ,CL
 
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i use an 8 range bar for the dax. i absolutely love the results.

vinceb

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  #12 (permalink)
 FulcrumTrader 
Austin, TX & Las Vegas, NV
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Investor RT Pro, NT 7.0
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I use a 2.0 Renko bar (Inv RT Pro)......been using that for years for trading the DAX.

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  #13 (permalink)
 trendisyourfriend 
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FulcrumTrader View Post
I use a 2.0 Renko bar (Inv RT Pro)......been using that for years for trading the DAX.

You mean 2 points per bar ? What is your average stop loss on the DAX ?

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  #14 (permalink)
 MetalTrade 
 
 
Posts: 1,081 since May 2010

I use a stop loss of 12 now on the DAX, she's a hot babe, but she's a wild one...

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  #15 (permalink)
 trendisyourfriend 
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MetalTrade View Post
I use a stop loss of 12 now on the DAX, she's a hot babe, but she's a wild one...

12 what ? points ot ticks ?

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  #16 (permalink)
 FulcrumTrader 
Austin, TX & Las Vegas, NV
 
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trendisyourfriend View Post
You mean 2 points per bar ? What is your average stop loss on the DAX ?

I trade 3:1 Momentum set ups with 7 - 10 point stops and 21 to 30 point initial targets.

Here is a 2.0 Renko of the DAX Images | ChartHub.com

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  #17 (permalink)
 Ralph07 
London UK
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, TT
Broker: Mirus
Trading: CL, Dax, ES, Eurostoxx50
 
Posts: 121 since Oct 2010
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OK thanks for your answers, I will test those timeframes...

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  #18 (permalink)
 xiaosi 
Brisbane, Queensland, Australia
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: JIGSAW/SIERRA CHART
Broker: MacQuarie Futures/AMP Clearing/CQG
Trading: HHI, HSI, FDAX
 
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Nice stop run just above the IB today...


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  #19 (permalink)
 xiaosi 
Brisbane, Queensland, Australia
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: JIGSAW/SIERRA CHART
Broker: MacQuarie Futures/AMP Clearing/CQG
Trading: HHI, HSI, FDAX
 
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don't see that many of these....

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  #20 (permalink)
mazdaq
London, United Kingdom
 
 
Posts: 11 since Oct 2012
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Been trading the DAX a lot recently, really enjoying it. I am only trading demo at the moment and only rarely suffer slippage of a tick. Will be interesting to see what it's like when going live but by the sounds of it should be ok just trading 2-3 lots.

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  #21 (permalink)
goiter33
london
 
 
Posts: 2 since Jan 2014
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fdax is wild west you need a big account and a lot of nerve..

in my opinion simulation is good for practice but has nothing to do with the real thing and its emotional swings

why dont you try the bund with bigger size?

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  #22 (permalink)
 Scalpguy 
Helsinki, Finland
 
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FulcrumTrader View Post
I trade 3:1 Momentum set ups with 7 - 10 point stops and 21 to 30 point initial targets.

Here is a 2.0 Renko of the DAX Images | ChartHub.com

I am trading from 5s OHLC bars and using 5 point initial stop losses. Depending of the type of the trading day scalping 2R or more.

FDAX if very efficient vehicle when traded "properly" (=trader knows well his/her system)

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  #23 (permalink)
 Bosch777 
Ireland
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader
Trading: CL GC FDAX
 
Posts: 120 since Jul 2012
Thanks: 89 given, 53 received

Hi Folks,

Im trying to find out what caused the spike in the FDAX chart this morning (23rd July 2014) which seems to have kicked off at 9am Frankfurt time (8am London). I cant see anything on Fx Factory or Daily Fx.

Would appreciate anyone's input here.

Thanks..

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  #24 (permalink)
Turveyd
Birmingham UK
 
 
Posts: 336 since May 2014
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DAX Trader here, via FXCM and Spot, 1 pip spread on FXCM just makes it too easy

Trades well from open to UK close, 1 minute charts for me, think I'm on 9 trades this week with only 1 loser, she's predictable at times, highly predictable, german efficency at it's best

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  #25 (permalink)
 Bosch777 
Ireland
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Trading: CL GC FDAX
 
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Turveyd View Post
DAX Trader here, via FXCM and Spot, 1 pip spread on FXCM just makes it too easy

Trades well from open to UK close, 1 minute charts for me, think I'm on 9 trades this week with only 1 loser, she's predictable at times, highly predictable, german efficency at it's best

Hi Turveyd,

do you have any idea why the FDAX had that big uplift this morning around 8am London time?

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  #26 (permalink)
Turveyd
Birmingham UK
 
 
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Bosch777 View Post
Hi Turveyd,

do you have any idea why the FDAX had that big uplift this morning around 8am London time?

Just UK Open I think, maybe that's when German markets open proper ?? if you check back you'll see a lot of similar spikes at 8am, I wouldn't hold over that time, looks like your SL will fare badly to me.

I don't start trading until 9am area.

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  #27 (permalink)
 Bosch777 
Ireland
 
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Turveyd View Post
Just UK Open I think, maybe that's when German markets open proper ?? if you check back you'll see a lot of similar spikes at 8am, I wouldn't hold over that time, looks like your SL will fare badly to me.

I don't start trading until 9am area.

Good point and thanks for that. I assume you mean you dont trade the fdax until after 9am London time?

I would be interested to learn of any other ways you might share as to how to avoid similar spikes during the fdax session?

Also do you think there are any other instruments that have similar characteristics/volatility/ability for reversion as the fdax?

Thanks..

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  #28 (permalink)
 Wikmar 
Madrid - Spain
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Own (more or less)
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Bosch777 View Post
Good point and thanks for that. I assume you mean you dont trade the fdax until after 9am London time?

I would be interested to learn of any other ways you might share as to how to avoid similar spikes during the fdax session?

Also do you think there are any other instruments that have similar characteristics/volatility/ability for reversion as the fdax?

Thanks..


I wouldn't say it has been a spike; about 0.5%, 50 points, relative not instant. About two months ago we had an instant 2% down, it really looked as spike.

I think it just has been a flip, in this case up. Why?. Perhaps it was clear for big players that certain big Markets wanted to go up and FDAX joined the movement.

(Always IMO)

By other way; "ability for reversion as the fdax". Are you sure?. IMO again, I would say just "some" ability for reversion.

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  #29 (permalink)
 Bosch777 
Ireland
 
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Trading: CL GC FDAX
 
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Wikmar View Post
I wouldn't say it has been a spike; about 0.5%, 50 points, relative not instant. About two months ago we had an instant 2% down, it really looked as spike.

I think it just has been a flip, in this case up. Why?. Perhaps it was clear for big players that certain big Markets wanted to go up and FDAX joined the movement.

(Always IMO)

By other way; "ability for reversion as the fdax". Are you sure?. IMO again, I would say just "some" ability for reversion.

Yes I agree "some" would be a better choice of words. Its just that the fdax has a pretty unique and volatile movement in it that typically goes very well with the reversion type strategy I usually run on it. Im currently trying to find a way to head off those events where the fdax just takes off in a fairly straight line and doesn't even look back over its shoulder. If I could get that fixed Id be fine. Not sure if volume/tick analysis will be of use but will probably have to give it a go at least even just to eliminate it. All my entries are counter trend type which work great the vast majority of the time, until they dont...!!!.

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  #30 (permalink)
Turveyd
Birmingham UK
 
 
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Bosch777 View Post
Good point and thanks for that. I assume you mean you dont trade the fdax until after 9am London time?

I would be interested to learn of any other ways you might share as to how to avoid similar spikes during the fdax session?

Also do you think there are any other instruments that have similar characteristics/volatility/ability for reversion as the fdax?

Thanks..

It's not that Spikey generally so after 9am GMT so wouldn't worry about it to much.

Remember, Spikes can go in your favour, so they kinda balance each other out.

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  #31 (permalink)
Turveyd
Birmingham UK
 
 
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Bosch777 View Post
Yes I agree "some" would be a better choice of words. Its just that the fdax has a pretty unique and volatile movement in it that typically goes very well with the reversion type strategy I usually run on it. Im currently trying to find a way to head off those events where the fdax just takes off in a fairly straight line and doesn't even look back over its shoulder. If I could get that fixed Id be fine. Not sure if volume/tick analysis will be of use but will probably have to give it a go at least even just to eliminate it. All my entries are counter trend type which work great the vast majority of the time, until they dont...!!!.

Some charts as to how I trade it, and I try to post most of my trades live in my Journal.

" look for Somewhere to post my thoughts "

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  #32 (permalink)
 Bosch777 
Ireland
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader
Trading: CL GC FDAX
 
Posts: 120 since Jul 2012
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Turveyd View Post
It's not that Spikey generally so after 9am GMT so wouldn't worry about it to much.

Remember, Spikes can go in your favour, so they kinda balance each other out.

Hi Turyeyd,

thanks for that.

Yes you are right in that these spikes can be in your favour, provided you are on the right side of them but then we are really back to coin flipping. I am trying to come up with a method whereby I can avoid them in my strategy. Yes I do have a setup that will be on the right side lets say 50% of the time but if Im wrong then I need to be out quick.

My first port of call is to avoid them where possible. This morning for instance is a morning where reversion/scalping algos should be turned off for the fdax given all the spiky news coming out of Europe.

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  #33 (permalink)
 GFIs1 
Legendary Market Wizard
Switzerland
 
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Bosch777 View Post
Hi Turyeyd,

thanks for that.

Yes you are right in that these spikes can be in your favour, provided you are on the right side of them but then we are really back to coin flipping. I am trying to come up with a method whereby I can avoid them in my strategy. Yes I do have a setup that will be on the right side lets say 50% of the time but if Im wrong then I need to be out quick.

My first port of call is to avoid them where possible. This morning for instance is a morning where reversion/scalping algos should be turned off for the fdax given all the spiky news coming out of Europe.

Hi
I am avoiding Tuesday and Thursday in my trading of the Dax. These are the least predictible days in a full week.
Then I am starting ONLY after 9:30 CET for every trade PLUS avoiding big news in the afternoon (mostly 14:30).

Just some input
GFIs1

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  #34 (permalink)
Turveyd
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Bosch777 View Post
Hi Turyeyd,

thanks for that.

Yes you are right in that these spikes can be in your favour, provided you are on the right side of them but then we are really back to coin flipping. I am trying to come up with a method whereby I can avoid them in my strategy. Yes I do have a setup that will be on the right side lets say 50% of the time but if Im wrong then I need to be out quick.

My first port of call is to avoid them where possible. This morning for instance is a morning where reversion/scalping algos should be turned off for the fdax given all the spiky news coming out of Europe.

Personally, I think you'll go nuts worrying about them too much, I've only had 1 spike which went 12pips beyond my 10pip SL recently and 1 spike go my way which made +34 so SL although sloppy and holding for the top manually to exit mean I'm up on spike slightly, so I ignore them.

Obviously I don't trade over news times, but news happens through out the day unexpectly.

Tuesdays and Thursdays are the best days to trade to my method, although I don't trade the start of a big move, I kinda trade the after chop with the direction, big fast moves scare me to much, too much of a gamble.

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  #35 (permalink)
 svuhmed 
Edinburgh, UK
 
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Scalpguy View Post
I am trading from 5s OHLC bars and using 5 point initial stop losses. Depending of the type of the trading day scalping 2R or more.

FDAX if very efficient vehicle when traded "properly" (=trader knows well his/her system)

@Scalpguy

Would love to see some screenshots and a little about your system .....

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  #36 (permalink)
 Bosch777 
Ireland
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Trading: CL GC FDAX
 
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Scalpguy View Post
I am trading from 5s OHLC bars and using 5 point initial stop losses. Depending of the type of the trading day scalping 2R or more.

FDAX if very efficient vehicle when traded "properly" (=trader knows well his/her system)

Any chance you might share a few screen shots with us to let us see your set up?

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  #37 (permalink)
 Bosch777 
Ireland
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader
Trading: CL GC FDAX
 
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Anyone here know of any other instrument that has FDAX like characteristics in terms of movement/volatility/price action?

Thanks..

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  #38 (permalink)
 xiaosi 
Brisbane, Queensland, Australia
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: JIGSAW/SIERRA CHART
Broker: MacQuarie Futures/AMP Clearing/CQG
Trading: HHI, HSI, FDAX
 
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Bosch777 View Post
Anyone here know of any other instrument that has FDAX like characteristics in terms of movement/volatility/price action?

Thanks..

GC, CL, HHI, HSI, HG, NQ, YM, TF....Similar in terms of thickness in the book as well...

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  #39 (permalink)
itradeit
Västerås Sweden
 
 
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DAX + CFD + a good spreadsheet = very nice combination!

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itradeit
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On the topic of spikes and professionals - Another thing that is useful to know is that from 8-9 there is only futures trading. Actual shares in the cash market start to change hand at 09:00. At this point, bigger players start to act on the DAX stocks and things start to move more violently.

IMHO in order to trade the DAX successfully you need a setup + knowledge that allows you to read the order flow + supply & demand properly.

Only relying on TA can easily get you killed in the DAX.

I recommend to only use TA (MACD, RSI, etc) to try to see what the losers are likely thinking (in many cases it's the opposite of what you should be thinking) as they tend to rely on TA and the illusion of past price action predicting future price action instead of reading order flow and supply & demand.

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 subterfuge 
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Can you elaborate on how you read order flow and supply/demand, and how you use a spreadsheet as part of a method?

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itradeit
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subterfuge View Post
Can you elaborate on how you read order flow and supply/demand, and how you use a spreadsheet as part of a method?

Well, this is something that took me 4 months to get so I can't really teach this in a comment... You have to go through a process to learn this but maybe I can point you in the right direction. The most basic explanation of supply/demand is that the market is WEAK when it's rallying and STRONG when its crashing. The losers buy at the top because they think the market is strong, the news is good, everyone wants to buy... this is high demand, but it very quickly turns into no demand and tons of supply because the professionals who bought near the bottom needs all these losers in order to unload their massive positions - someone must buy! A clear sign of this is when the market blows straight up 90 degrees at the top... And once that happens, the market drops because there is nobody left to buy - hence no demand...

This is called distribution. At the bottom, when everyone has panic sold, accumulation begins. Once the professionals have accumulated pretty much all of the floating stock supply, there is no supply so the market will go up on the laws of supply and demand... and the whole thing starts again... every day, in every timeframe, at every moment.

There are various tools out there to gauge this so I can't tell you what to use but the information is in the Volume (how much, and is the volume bearish or bullish) and the spread of the bar (what happened on that volume). I trade Volume Spread Analysis, I don't give a pennys worth to trading fundamentals or TA (stochastics, MACD, etc, other ways of trying to predict future price from past price)... Not because they never work - but they merely distract me - every form of therapy works some of the time for some people! But the market often does the opposite of what TA tells you... just like the news... yet strangely enough tons of traders still rely on it!

I have one execution platform (I trade CFD's through CMC) and one analysis platform (TradeGuider). I learned most of this from the works of Tom Williams who was a syndicate trader in the early days. Read his book "Master the Markets" and your eyes will open. VSA is based on Richard Wyckoffs work from around 90 years ago. The same rules still work. Today 90% of traders lose 90% of their capital in 90 days because they don't understand they are up against professionals and you can't win if you don't become one and surf behind the smart money - if you're in front of them, they will simply eat you for lunch because they can easily predict how you think and react to them.

Here is a mainstream take on the whole thing. A story like this happens only once every blue moon, it is very rare that you see this in the mainstream media. The Richard Wyckoff Stock Trading Method - Business Insider

Another funky tool is BookMap that shows the orderflow in a very intriguing way. There are many tools that will show you the order flow, (pretty much any DOM will show you the order flow - as that IS the order flow)... I can see it change in the chart now without a single indicator (I only use 100 and 200 EMA anyway - nothing else, to me, all the TA is just distractions from what matters...)... but that takes practice.

Jason Alan Jankovsky wrote a good book called time compression trading too...

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itradeit
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About the spreadsheet... I realized that it helps a lot to get good at google spreadsheet. I use it mainly for risk managment (R multiples) and for compounding calculations and expectancy calculation, so I know I have a good system. I recommend to create your own spreadsheet - you will learn building a solid trading system that way.

The advantage is that at one point you will know that your SYSTEM works marvelous but you don't... then you have to fix your emotions... becasue I learned that's how the pro's really take your money... you can have the best system in the world but if they can still wrap you around their finger with shakeouts and if you still are a prey to your own subconscious mess with greed and fear of loss, you'll still drawdown...

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itradeit
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I'm short since 9744... target 80 points below current price 9700... if it breaks 9700 and we're down on US open... let's see where this goes... oh we just broke 9700... ok, nice.

EDIT: Some stopping volume and short profit taking now, but downtrend selling is still on...

EDIT: Exit @ 9706

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itradeit
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Shorting @ 9720...

EDIT: LOL! We'll I'm still in the game on this trade.

EDIT: Exited safely @9721

No more trade posting here, I have a journal for this purpose now.

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 TheTrini 
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Turveyd View Post
DAX Trader here, via FXCM and Spot, 1 pip spread on FXCM just makes it too easy

Trades well from open to UK close, 1 minute charts for me, think I'm on 9 trades this week with only 1 loser, she's predictable at times, highly predictable, german efficency at it's best

Does FXCM support trading the DAX. Is that what you meant ?
What is the instrument symbol. May like to try it.
Thanks.

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 Jason Rogers 
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TheTrini View Post
Does FXCM support trading the DAX. Is that what you meant ?
What is the instrument symbol. May like to try it.
Thanks.

Hi TheTrini,

The symbol for FXCM's DAX instrument is GER30. However, I notice that your forum profile mentions that you live in New York (like me). US regulations allow us FXCM to offer forex to American residents, but not CFDs like GER30. Non-US residents can trade CFDs for stock indices, metals and energy through FXCM's international entities in the UK, Japan, Hong Kong and Australia.

PS: Are you from Trinidad? I'm a huge fan of Brian Lara and was at the Kensington Oval to see his final World Cup match in Barbados.

If you have questions about our services at FXCM please send me a Private Message.
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 TheTrini 
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Jason Rogers View Post
Hi TheTrini,

The symbol for FXCM's DAX instrument is GER30. However, I notice that your forum profile mentions that you live in New York (like me). US regulations allow us FXCM to offer forex to American residents, but not CFDs like GER30. Non-US residents can trade CFDs for stock indices, metals and energy through FXCM's international entities in the UK, Japan, Hong Kong and Australia.

PS: Are you from Trinidad? I'm a huge fan of Brian Lara and was at the Kensington Oval to see his final World Cup match in Barbados.

Jason, thanks for the info. Will look into it. Good to know

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Dr82
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Hello,

I have question about stop loss order (stop market order) and trading FDAX - 10 contracts.
My question is it possible that I have only 2 tick slippage if my stop loss target is hit during the day session (9 to 17.30).
I have plan to trade FDAX futures 10 contracts via CQGIC trading platform.
Thank you

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itradeit
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Dr82 View Post
Hello,

I have question about stop loss order (stop market order) and trading FDAX - 10 contracts.
My question is it possible that I have only 2 tick slippage if my stop loss target is hit during the day session (9 to 17.30).
I have plan to trade FDAX futures 10 contracts via CQGIC trading platform.
Thank you

EDIT: I read your question a bit wrong, here is a correction...

You should try this out in sim mode, but one point in the dax is 4 ticks I think, and the dax is very volatile! When it drops really fast, it can drop 10 points in a second... If some professional syndicate or market maker robots makes a rapid whipsaw move for stop hunting purposes, it can go 20 points up and down in half a second, and there will be a little slippage. These moves are rare how ever... but the slippage can then be a few points, usually not more than 5 at worst... normally you get filled immediately, I trade CFD's on DAX and I'm always executed within milliseconds in 97% of the cases or so.

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 tomtom 
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Dr82 View Post
Hello,

I have question about stop loss order (stop market order) and trading FDAX - 10 contracts.
My question is it possible that I have only 2 tick slippage if my stop loss target is hit during the day session (9 to 17.30).
I have plan to trade FDAX futures 10 contracts via CQGIC trading platform.
Thank you

Is it possible? Absolutely ! Is it likely ? ....depends
What I would recommand u is start playing around in sim mode. This will give u a feel for slippage ( dont think u know antyhing too valuable from this for real money trading, but better then starting with real cash)

Next step watch the book, level 2 data.
This should give u an idea how "light" the book often is... bid/ask will only be very few contracts (like 1-5 )
So in any given sitation if there is 3 contracts on the bid/ask and only 3 on the next level ..u can imagine what a 10 contract stop order will do...

Slippage will obvsl also depend on a lot of factors. Is the stop order at a significant point ( above / below daily highs / lows, round market like 9800 /9700 ).. This areas will cause higher slippage than a stop in the middle of a intraday range...
News will make the book way lighter so that again will lead to way higher slippage...

( In the FDAX 1 Tick = 0.5 points... i think most of the CFD broker offer the Dax in 0.1 point ticks... never came across 1 tick = 0.25 points ( doesnt mean its not possible )
My experince in generall is that the slippage in the FDAX is in generall way smaller in the max number ( how high could slippage become ) .. but u will get 1 tick slippage even for 1 contract ALOT of the time, where a CFD broker might just give u your price...
Just my two cent....

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 chr1s 
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Hi,

I am a junior and cannot say I trade DAX but I will say that I try to trade DAX through CFD (or spread betting UK) and just wanted to post how it looks for me


tomtom View Post
Slippage will obvsl also depend on a lot of factors. Is the stop order at a significant point ( above / below daily highs / lows, round market like 9800 /9700 ).. This areas will cause higher slippage than a stop in the middle of a intraday range...
News will make the book way lighter so that again will lead to way higher slippage...

1-2 points is a standard for me, if the price is moving really fast (breakouts etc) it can be up to even 5pts which is terrible


tomtom View Post
( In the FDAX 1 Tick = 0.5 points... i think most of the CFD broker offer the Dax in 0.1 point ticks... never came across 1 tick = 0.25 points ( doesnt mean its not possible )

Mine is 0.2-0.3 (SB) and 0.25 (CFD) point

Thanks

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 Wikmar 
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chr1s View Post
Hi,

I am a junior and cannot say I trade DAX but I will say that I try to trade DAX through CFD (or spread betting UK) and just wanted to post how it looks for me

1-2 points is a standard for me, if the price is moving really fast (breakouts etc) it can be up to even 5pts which is terrible

Thanks


Looks good, but need to Know how you drive it. You'll tell us.

Trading Eurex FDAX probably you could get an average slippage lower than 1 point in a large time period.

Good luck!

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 chr1s 
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Wikmar View Post
Looks good, but need to Know how you drive it. You'll tell us.

If I understood you correctly you'd like me to tell you how I (stressing this word) try to trade it?
I am a beginner and don't know what I'm doing most of the time heh but what I currently use is:
  • price action on 5mins (with 15 mins, 1h overview) + 20ema
  • support, resistance (going from daily, 4h, 1h, 15mins, 5 mins)
  • chart patterns (5, 15 mins)
  • correlation with FTSE (eg breakouts confirmation, similar structure)
  • 1 min rainbow chart (for exact entries and exits) - will probably drop it as it gives false hope
I use MetaTrader which is not the best platform for DAX.
Do you use similar approach?


Wikmar View Post
Trading Eurex FDAX probably you could get an average slippage lower than 1 point in a large time period.

The slippage will probably be the same just my my orders will be larger. As to the slippage I experienced a huge one today after London open more than 10 points on buy stop order - basically reversing my 1:2 RR to 2:1 RR (closed with +1.5pt)

cheers
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 Wikmar 
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chr1s View Post
If I understood you correctly you'd like me to tell you how I (stressing this word) try to trade it?
I am a beginner and don't know what I'm doing most of the time heh but what I currently use is:
  • price action on 5mins (with 15 mins, 1h overview) + 20ema
  • support, resistance (going from daily, 4h, 1h, 15mins, 5 mins)
  • chart patterns (5, 15 mins)
  • correlation with FTSE (eg breakouts confirmation, similar structure)
  • 1 min rainbow chart (for exact entries and exits) - will probably drop it as it gives false hope
I use MetaTrader which is not the best platform for DAX.
Do you use similar approach?

...

cheers
Chris


Well, no, on how you drive it I meant for the future results. But it's good information what you've telled for if someone advices about something. For example; correlation with FTSE; as your general setup or approach, could be fine, it always depends on the trader when discretional trading, but I suggest at least also, perhaps rather than, look the correlation with SP500 and DOW.

My discretional approach, indicators speaking, is a bit of EMA, Heiken-Ashi, a bit of CCI, bit of MACD, and bit of RSI volume weighted.

Also I work with automated systems but not in this moment.

Cheers

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 chr1s 
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Wikmar View Post
I suggest at least also, perhaps rather than, look the correlation with SP500 and DOW.

Thanks, will investigate it more then (I know more indices follow SP500 and DOW).


Wikmar View Post
My discretional approach, indicators speaking, is a bit of EMA, Heiken-Ashi, a bit of CCI, bit of MACD, and bit of RSI volume weighted.

Is it heavily based on indicators?
I wrote some EAs (some are profitable on demo) but I'm not confident in them and there is a lot said everywhere that they cannot work (which I actually don't agree to the fullest).

May I ask if you're consistently profitable? I struggle with that and I've failed with indicators (or maybe that was just me, if I was more disciplined with them).

Thanks

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 Wikmar 
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chr1s View Post
Is it heavily based on indicators?

65% based on indicators, 35% based on my my assessment of the circumstances and confident about what indicators are timely saying. Someone very good said a copule of days ago, that discretional trader has to know when indicators are telling him good information or noise.


chr1s View Post
I wrote some EAs (some are profitable on demo) but I'm not confident in them and there is a lot said everywhere that they cannot work (which I actually don't agree to the fullest).

You know for a definitive conclusion; appropriate tests considering commissions and slippages.


chr1s View Post
May I ask if you're consistently profitable? I struggle with that and I've failed with indicators (or maybe that was just me, if I was more disciplined with them).

Thanks

I would like to share some results curves with you now, but I don´t have them here. Honestly I would say yes (for now). But I need more time being that to think I can live from trading.

Not at all, cheers.

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  #58 (permalink)
 chr1s 
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Wikmar View Post
65% based on indicators, 35% based on my my assessment of the circumstances and confident about what indicators are timely saying. Someone very good said a copule of days ago, that discretional trader has to know when indicators are telling him good information or noise.

Amen to that and the more knowledge one has the more useful some indicators become.


Wikmar View Post
You know for a definitive conclusion; appropriate tests considering commissions and slippages.

I have spread to fill first and boy there is a difference between DEMO and REAL (even with stop hunting).


Wikmar View Post
I would like to share some results curves with you now, but I don´t have them here. Honestly I would say yes (for now). But I need more time being that to think I can live from trading.

Congratulations, I'm yet to achieve real consistency (somewhat consistent for some time) but I know some of my trades well are a bit lucky and scalps which does not say much. I hope you're going to achieve decent consistency and confidence which will give you the choice of doing it full time

Thanks
Chris

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  #59 (permalink)
 Wikmar 
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chr1s View Post
Congratulations, ... I hope you're going to achieve decent consistency and confidence which will give you the choice of doing it full time

Thanks
Chris

Thank you very much for your wishes (now you have your first futures.io (formerly BMT)F-Thanks, from me ). I appreciate the message with deep feeling.

As I see you are new here, I think it's a good advice, a good present, to introduce you some people here under my appreciation, to follow them very close.

Putting myself at risk by forgetting someone or not make a correct assessment at this moment, as this is improvised, or because someone won't feel well (I deeply hope no); here are many extraordinary people with very useful and / or a lot of work delivered in the community (Gomi, devdas, bob7123, bobwest, JDNeeman, Silvester17, PandaWarrior, kbit, etc, etc), and let me tell you under my appreciation, three very special people I suggest to follow very close (read all you can from them); TheWizard, josh, and Fat Tails. You'll find several pearls in their posts, with useful applications and deeply good guys.

There is a feature in futures.io (formerly BMT)F, probably you know; the mentions (if I had put a @ starting their nicks, they would receive notification pointing to this post), but I don't want to call them just to see what I said, so I didn't use it.

Of course, also the boss holds its own, you'll see, starting because he reads ALL the posts we send to the forum. I can't imagine how he survive managing the forum, his trading, and his live.

Well @chr1s, we'll be in contact here. All the best for your trader career.

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  #60 (permalink)
 chr1s 
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Thank you for your advise and introduction @Wikmar
Hope your trading journey will be very successful and maybe one day I will meet you in the land of full time consistency

All the best and points/pips
Chris

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 Bosch777 
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I would be interested to hear peoples comments regarding some of the "other" DAX instruments (various types of CFD's and the like) on offer with some of the brokers with variable ticks per point.

My main question is: How closely does the price action on these other DAX instruments mirror/match the main futures FDAX?

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 ratfink 
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Bosch777 View Post
I would be interested to hear peoples comments regarding some of the "other" DAX instruments (various types of CFD's and the like) on offer with some of the brokers with variable ticks per point.

My main question is: How closely does the price action on these other DAX instruments mirror/match the main futures FDAX?

Near enough identical on IG and Finspreads/City Index. Futures and cash indexes. You see some spread variance shifts and slight swing timing subtleties but nothing to complain about these days in my experience, much better than years ago.

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sharpshoota
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Bosch777 View Post
I would be interested to hear peoples comments regarding some of the "other" DAX instruments (various types of CFD's and the like) on offer with some of the brokers with variable ticks per point.

My main question is: How closely does the price action on these other DAX instruments mirror/match the main futures FDAX?

I'm pretty satisfied with Fxcm's Ger30 CFD. Only 1 pip spread during London session , 2 pips after London close until NY close. It provides me the volatility needed for intraday trades.

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 Bosch777 
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sharpshoota View Post
I'm pretty satisfied with Fxcm's Ger30 CFD. Only 1 pip spread during London session , 2 pips after London close until NY close. It provides me the volatility needed for intraday trades.


Thanks for that.
Can you tell me what margin and Pnl per tick is available on this with fxcm?
Decent liquidity too?

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 DrE6 
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Ralph07 View Post
Hello,

I am searching a good timeframe for a tick chart to trade the DAX... Anyone has an idea?

Thanks a lot.



I also use a 21 tick chart for the FDAX and it works well for me to optimize my trade entries (not only for scalping)

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sharpshoota
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Bosch777 View Post
Thanks for that.
Can you tell me what margin and Pnl per tick is available on this with fxcm?
Decent liquidity too?

I think it's the usual 200:1 gearing at fxcm-uk . Pnl pr tick....not sure, guess it depends on how many lots you put on.
I've never used anything more than 5 lots yet. :-)
Try their demo first, then you'll probably find out a lot of these things.

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 Bosch777 
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This morning there are very positive unemployment results from Germany but the FDAX heads for the floor..anyone got any idea why this is happening??

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 chr1s 
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DrE6 View Post
I also use a 21 tick chart for the FDAX and it works well for me to optimize my trade entries (not only for scalping)

Hi DrE6,

Do you have a journal on futures.io (formerly BMT) by any chance?

Thanks
Chris

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 GFIs1 
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Bosch777 View Post
This morning there are very positive unemployment results from Germany but the FDAX heads for the floor..anyone got any idea why this is happening??

Deflation fears are on the discussion right now...
Rising interest rates sooner than expected too.

Bad numbers on Lufthansa and Linde (both moren than minus 5% today)
put the Dax on the downtrip.

My personal thoughts: This IS NOT the end here...
Watch carefully tomorrow (the last of month)

GFIs1

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 Bosch777 
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GFIs1 View Post
Deflation fears are on the discussion right now...
Rising interest rates sooner than expected too.

Bad numbers on Lufthansa and Linde (both moren than minus 5% today)
put the Dax on the downtrip.

My personal thoughts: This IS NOT the end here...
Watch carefully tomorrow (the last of month)

GFIs1

Thanks for that GF

Apart from the usual economic calendars, is there any other live news commentary or site that is good to get a heads up for the fdax? I am running quite a decent strategy provided I keep away from all the morning EU news and stuff that causes heavy parabolic type moves.

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 GFIs1 
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Thanks for that GF

Apart from the usual economic calendars, is there any other live news commentary or site that is good to get a heads up for the fdax? I am running quite a decent strategy provided I keep away from all the morning EU news and stuff that causes heavy parabolic type moves.

If you can read the german texts:
Börsenkurse - n-tv.de
gives some news every morning and today quite accurate.

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 Bosch777 
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GFIs1 View Post
If you can read the german texts:
Börsenkurse - n-tv.de
gives some news every morning and today quite accurate.

GFIs1

Thanks GF but unfortunately for me I dont have a word of German.

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 GFIs1 
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Bosch777 View Post
Thanks GF but unfortunately for me I dont have a word of German.

You may try google translator: https://translate.google.ch/

or for the best translation - reverso:

Reverso | Übersetzung, online Übersetzer, Wörterbuch, Konjugation

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 Bosch777 
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GFIs1 View Post
You may try google translator: https://translate.google.ch/

or for the best translation - reverso:

Reverso | Übersetzung, online Übersetzer, Wörterbuch, Konjugation

GFIs1

Thanks for that GF. On a separate issue, do you or anyone else out there know of any really good co-location service near the Eurex?

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 GFIs1 
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Bosch777 View Post
Thanks for that GF. On a separate issue, do you or anyone else out there know of any really good co-location service near the Eurex?

Ask @sam028 - he is the expert here..
GFIs1

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 sam028 
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GFIs1 View Post
Ask @sam028 - he is the expert here..
GFIs1

He already did, he's one of my beloved customers .
And to clarify, "near Eurex" doesn't make too much sense: it's important to be near your market gateways (CQG, Interactive Brokers, ...). If you are an IB client, then you should be near there European gateways in Switzerland. If you use CQG, you should be their servers in Europe, so in London.
The end user is never (not 100% true but won't go in too much details) is never directly connected to the exchange.

I'm planning to get some servers in for SpeedyTradingServers in Europe (London), hopefully in Q1 2015.

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 Koepisch 
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sam028 View Post
...
I'm planning to get some servers in for SpeedyTradingServers in Europe (London), hopefully in Q1 2015.

Great news, looking forward to it. Perfect match to CQG + Eurex. I've found CNS but couldn't make a decision til now. I hope you find an approbiate solution soon.

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 DrE6 
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chr1s View Post
Hi DrE6,

Do you have a journal on futures.io (formerly BMT) by any chance?

Thanks
Chris


Hi Chris,

no I don't have.

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 crossover 
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Bosch777 View Post
Thanks for that GF

Apart from the usual economic calendars, is there any other live news commentary or site that is good to get a heads up for the fdax? I am running quite a decent strategy provided I keep away from all the morning EU news and stuff that causes heavy parabolic type moves.


This is not "live" but every day i receive a newsletter, offered by Eurex, in my mailbox about European Market Outlook. There are , most of the times TA charts from the Bund and Eurostoxx

https://www.eurexchange.com/blob/exchange-en/3150-1135838/1135838/2/data/European_Market_Outlook_20141104.pdf

you can also receive this newsletter if you subscribe.

also intersting: Eurex - Eurex Exchange


just my 2c

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 Bosch777 
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Hey crossover,

thanks for that. I will take a look.

Basically what I would really like to get is something that has the economic calendar listings like the forex factory but also gives good daily heads up on upcoming items that may move the needle with the FDAX/DAX specifically such as earnings from the DAX companies and times of such releases etc..

Would appreciate any and all from anyone on this..

cheers to all..

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 Bosch777 
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daxtrader54 View Post
so basically something like this: Financial Diary - calendar of economic and company events
but for the dax instead?

Hi daxtrader,
sorry only getting back to you now. Yes that exactly what I mean. Something that will give me a good heads up on whats likely to move the needle on the FDAX. For example, something that will give an advance warning on Dax companies earnings reports and the like.
Any more ideas??

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sharpshoota
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Any good websites with FDAX charts including volume? I know finviz.com have volume for some of them, like CL , SPX....but not for DAX.
trading the Ger30 cfd would probably be easier if i knew the traded volume on the fdax 5 or 15 minute chart.

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endian675
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Bosch777 View Post
Hey crossover,

thanks for that. I will take a look.

Basically what I would really like to get is something that has the economic calendar listings like the forex factory but also gives good daily heads up on upcoming items that may move the needle with the FDAX/DAX specifically such as earnings from the DAX companies and times of such releases etc..

Would appreciate any and all from anyone on this..

cheers to all..

If you sign up with one of the squawk services then you will get a daily economics sheet sent to you. How much German data that might have in it I can't be sure, but you can always ask them to help you out. Also, the last time I looked in to it the guys who do Alpha Flash had a German company announcements automated data feed, but you can expect to pay serious $$$ for that every month.

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 Bosch777 
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sharpshoota View Post
Any good websites with FDAX charts including volume? I know finviz.com have volume for some of them, like CL , SPX....but not for DAX.
trading the Ger30 cfd would probably be easier if i knew the traded volume on the fdax 5 or 15 minute chart.

Hi
to get a full on proper FDAX live chart the easiest way would be to take a trial with one of the ninja trader brokers. Although since you are on fxcm I think they should be able to hook you up with the relevant feed and they are also operating with NT. Most of these feed are free too if you have a funded account with them.

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 Bosch777 
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Hi to everyone,
anyone got any idea why the fdax has gone thru a 500 tick reach for the skies today and in a fairly determined fashion?
Regards..

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 Big Mike 
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Bosch777 View Post
Hi to everyone,
anyone got any idea why the fdax has gone thru a 500 tick reach for the skies today and in a fairly determined fashion?
Regards..

SNB.

Mike

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 steve2222 
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Big Mike View Post
SNB.

Mike

SNB - Swiss National Bank?

But that was today, the post you were replying to was dated 6 days ago?

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 Big Mike 
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steve2222 View Post
SNB - Swiss National Bank?

But that was today, the post you were replying to was dated 6 days ago?

You are correct. I didn't realize the date I've been catching up on old posts.

Mike

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 Bosch777 
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This FDAX is gone nuts lately.

The world needs to calm down a bit......all this volatility is wrecking everything..!

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ferdy
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Just how many FDAX traders are on this forum? Seems like very few trade FDAX or the ones who successfully do, dont have the time to waste on forums!!!

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 Lawrencejude 
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What is the Tick value for FDAX, I believe it is 12.50.

i am currently demo trading ninjatrader and there brokerage. I am not able to get FTSE (z) data for some reason.

please help @NinjaTrader

and what is the tick value for FTSE 100 (z)

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 crossover 
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Yes, 1 tick on the dax is 12.5 Euro.

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 Lawrencejude 
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crossover View Post
Yes, 1 tick on the dax is 12.5 Euro.

@crossover
Do u trade DAX and if yes, right now i can only see 5 - 6 contacts each side. is there a reason the volume is so low or am i doing something wrong.?

one more question i have is.

Product code Product Initial margin (€) Maint. margin Intraday margin ($)
FDAX Dax Futures 22313 0 2500

do i need to have 22313 in my account to open a position here?
I know how to trade. this pat is where my head stops working, any help appreciated.

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 crossover 
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Lawrencejude View Post
@crossover
Do u trade DAX and if yes, right now i can only see 5 - 6 contacts each side. is there a reason the volume is so low or am i doing something wrong.?



Sometimes i trade the dax but it seems that volume is poor. on my dome i have as bid an ask in the first row 2 or 3 contracts. on a depth of 5 rows between 12 an 20 contracts. There is also a spread of 2 tics between bid and ask.
At this speed the dax can go up or down very fast. so your risk trading the dax is very high.

As long there is no more volume i dont trade it any more.

Recently i restarted trading 6e and others instaed of the dax

i wish you succes in trading and be carefull because markets i away with you euro's or dollars before you even realize

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 Lawrencejude 
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@crossover

Do i also need 23000 capital to open position if i chose to trade ?.

just asking the concept of initial margin

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 Lawrencejude 
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@crossover

sorry to bug you with Questions.

I Am in Australia and I can trade London Time.
So for your experience what are the most liquid contracts I can trade

So far I am looking at
FTSE
FESX
Euro
GBP
FDAX

I like the action on FDAX but too little volume. what else do u trade or look and what do u recommend

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Lawrencejude View Post
What is the Tick value for FDAX, I believe it is 12.50.

i am currently demo trading ninjatrader and there brokerage. I am not able to get FTSE (z) data for some reason.

please help @NinjaTrader

and what is the tick value for FTSE 100 (z)

Hi Lawrencejude,

We are glad to help, you can reach out support team here NinjaTrader Software Support: Connection Guides, Training Videos, Online Forum, they are best qualified to help.

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  #98 (permalink)
 Bosch777 
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Well depending on what you want to do with it, the fdax can be a great instrument to trade. However trying to do so manually could be a real struggle. Again, it all depends on what you want from it..

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 US Bond Trader 
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Bosch777 View Post
Well depending on what you want to do with it, the fdax can be a great instrument to trade. However trying to do so manually could be a real struggle. Again, it all depends on what you want from it..

So true. It can be a great instrument to trade, but it can also kill you pretty quick. Definitely not a contract for the faint of heart. Like you said it all depends on what you want from it.

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 crossover 
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Lawrencejude View Post
@crossover

Do i also need 23000 capital to open position if i chose to trade ?.

just asking the concept of initial margin


@ lawrencejude

Sorry for the late responce, i had to go working

Concerning your capital i would suggest asking how mutch your broker is asking for margin.

It really depends on the broker what the margin is

personally i would not trade under a capital of 15.000,00$ , even for 1 contract.

Liquid markets are cl, tf and others. But even es is tradeble. However its volume , since beginning 2015 is far less then

the 1,8 million it had before.

a good trading system and trading management is needed for all trading.

Succes with it .

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