Hi -- yes, I trade Nikkei and HSI most evenings -- just finished for the day in fact. My approach and setup is not so different from yours actually.

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Looking for all Asian session traders, I know there are a few around here from comments. Hoping to start a thread for general discussion and ideas on products primarily active during the Asian session.

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To start it off, I have been a casual mini-nikkei trader for 3 years but recently have started looking at the HHI on HKFE for some added volatility. I work full time, my own business, so have my trading screens available all day.

All trading styles welcome to discuss, personally I have been a more structured day trader, often only one trade of the day, but this has more to do with the low volatility of the nikkei in recent times. Largest influences for me are general auction theory concepts, volume profile & market profile, basic price action. I do a lot of stats homework and look to apply my ideas in the direction of the historical probabilities.

Each day I develop a few higher timeframe hypothesis from daily bars & multi-day composite VP's, are we in balance, breaking away, etc.. then as the day opens I look for stats in favour of one of the hypothesis, initial balance stats, avg daily range, vpoc shifts, strong impulses. Then for entry I look for signs that allow for a structured risk placement.

Charts look like this most of the time:



Hope some more people can share their trading, I have lots of things I would love to discuss/learn regarding the HSI/HHI if some traders are active in that.

Josh I see you are trading the HSI and not the MHI.

What intraday margin are AMP applying to your HSI trades?

I see AMP quote $4,000 but that does not seem logical. The MHI is only $500 and the point value multiplier is 5x so I would have thought the HSI should be only $2,500.

The HHI vs MCH is more in-line but actually goes the other way. Margins of $2,000 and $500 respectively with a point value multiplier of 5x as well.

A $4,000 margin means you use up $8,000 of account balance just placing one contract trade with an OCO profit & stop targets. Due to an OCO order type using 2 lots of margin.

https://www.ampfutures.com/trading-info/margins/
https://www.ampfutures.com/trading-info/contract-specifications/

Actually the OCO order should not represent an additional margin requirement with an open position, as it represents an order to close. For example, a $500 margin on an open contract is required, and adding a bracket order to close does not add any margin. However, with no position on, there is a $1000 requirement for the bracket order since they are 2 orders to open. At least, that's what I'm showing here.

In order to trade anything these days, you really have to think like an algo, because trading is predominantly algo-driven today. Even the "real" money being invested is given to an algo to execute the order. Hell, even retail brokers offer built-in algo execution (see IB). I'd say it's especially true of a market like HSI. You simply cannot fade the order flow, and I'd wonder how anyone can actually trade it without looking at a ladder, footprint, or something else to really see what's driving it.

I listened to an audio of Marty Schwartz some time ago, and he talked about how in the pit days, there was a physical stack of sell orders, and that traders would run those orders (even if they weren't supposed to know about them :-o as they were client orders) for liquidity. Well, the same thing happens today obviously. Except that the algos don't know where the stops are -- they don't get tired, they don't feel sorry for you, they just follow the program, which is to probe, probe, probe, over, and over, and over, until they find the liquidity. It's the source of the one-directional moves we see in all markets, including markets like the HSI, which just now rallied 150 points off new lows with a 15-20 tick max pullback.

But there's an upside to this challenging market. If you can identify when the order flow has really turned, and I mean turned so that the algos are clearly and unmistakably activated in one direction (usually up these days), you don't have to worry about catching the turn too precisely. In fact, I got in after 80 points, and still caught 60. Just get in, preferably on a little retracement if you can manage. They are working for you now. Their behavior, which would make you literally want to slam your head into a wall, now gives you a relatively easy trade. No, it's not always easy, but the key IMO is to let the trade come to you, and look for what is unmistakably a bid-up algo, and go with it.

I find that using delta gives a nice visual to what I see happening in the ladder. In order for this bid-up to work, it really requires positive delta -- if delta's not too positive, it means that there aren't enough traders covering, and covering is what makes it work, ultimately.

I'm quite sure this is nothing new to you guys, but I wanted to express it, having seen it multiple times in multiple markets today, and particularly in the HSI.

Re: the HHI ... this action from last night scares me, and was not mirrored in the HSI.

That's right, if you have margin to dump ~250 at the market, you can cause a mini flash crash in the HHI!

In order to trade anything these days, you really have to think like an algo, because trading is predominantly algo-driven today. Even the "real" money being invested is given to an algo to execute the order. Hell, even retail brokers offer built-in algo execution (see IB). I'd say it's especially true of a market like HSI. You simply cannot fade the order flow, and I'd wonder how anyone can actually trade it without looking at a ladder, footprint, or something else to really see what's driving it.

I listened to an audio of Marty Schwartz some time ago, and he talked about how in the pit days, there was a physical stack of sell orders, and that traders would run those orders (even if they weren't supposed to know about them :-o as they were client orders) for liquidity. Well, the same thing happens today obviously. Except that the algos don't know where the stops are -- they don't get tired, they don't feel sorry for you, they just follow the program, which is to probe, probe, probe, over, and over, and over, until they find the liquidity. It's the source of the one-directional moves we see in all markets, including markets like the HSI, which just now rallied 150 points off new lows with a 15-20 tick max pullback.

But there's an upside to this challenging market. If you can identify when the order flow has really turned, and I mean turned so that the algos are clearly and unmistakably activated in one direction (usually up these days), you don't have to worry about catching the turn too precisely. In fact, I got in after 80 points, and still caught 60. Just get in, preferably on a little retracement if you can manage. They are working for you now. Their behavior, which would make you literally want to slam your head into a wall, now gives you a relatively easy trade. No, it's not always easy, but the key IMO is to let the trade come to you, and look for what is unmistakably a bid-up algo, and go with it.

I find that using delta gives a nice visual to what I see happening in the ladder. In order for this bid-up to work, it really requires positive delta -- if delta's not too positive, it means that there aren't enough traders covering, and covering is what makes it work, ultimately.

I'm quite sure this is nothing new to you guys, but I wanted to express it, having seen it multiple times in multiple markets today, and particularly in the HSI.

It's interesting because I had felt that way about the HSI. That action must be in the ETH of the HHI correct? usually in the RTH I find more liquidity per a level than the HSI, but I am by no means an expert on these products, only been eyeballing for a few months.

The scariest thing I had seen is local/industry related news events, someone over in that area gets that news WAY before we do, I'm not talking 2-3 secs...