Is Support and Resistance Meaningless? - Currency Futures | futures io social day trading
futures io futures trading


Is Support and Resistance Meaningless?
Updated: Views / Replies:8,118 / 56
Created: by wallo101 Attachments:3

Welcome to futures io.

(If you already have an account, login at the top of the page)

futures io is the largest futures trading community on the planet, with over 90,000 members. At futures io, our goal has always been and always will be to create a friendly, positive, forward-thinking community where members can openly share and discuss everything the world of trading has to offer. The community is one of the friendliest you will find on any subject, with members going out of their way to help others. Some of the primary differences between futures io and other trading sites revolve around the standards of our community. Those standards include a code of conduct for our members, as well as extremely high standards that govern which partners we do business with, and which products or services we recommend to our members.

At futures io, our focus is on quality education. No hype, gimmicks, or secret sauce. The truth is: trading is hard. To succeed, you need to surround yourself with the right support system, educational content, and trading mentors Ė all of which you can find on futures io, utilizing our social trading environment.

With futures io, you can find honest trading reviews on brokers, trading rooms, indicator packages, trading strategies, and much more. Our trading review process is highly moderated to ensure that only genuine users are allowed, so you donít need to worry about fake reviews.

We are fundamentally different than most other trading sites:
  • We are here to help. Just let us know what you need.
  • We work extremely hard to keep things positive in our community.
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendors advertising in posts.
  • We firmly believe in and encourage sharing. The holy grail is within you, we can help you find it.
  • We expect our members to participate and become a part of the community. Help yourself by helping others.

You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community.  It's free and simple.

-- Big Mike, Site Administrator

Reply
 3  
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
 

Is Support and Resistance Meaningless?

  #1 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Kalamazoo, MI
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Favorite Futures: Don't have one
 
Posts: 17 since Jul 2015
Thanks: 63 given, 5 received

Is Support and Resistance Meaningless?

I've been watching charts the past week and notice the market does not respect support/resistance and will break through it more often then not. There's got to be a better way to trade and i'm not finding it. Order flow seems to make the most sense right now (i'm not saying it makes sense to me yet, just more sense then trading stuff like support and resistance), but i'm currently looking at charts.

Reply With Quote
 
  #2 (permalink)
Quick Summary
Quick Summary Post

Quick Summary is created and edited by users like you... Add FAQ's, Links and other Relevant Information by clicking the edit button in the lower right hand corner of this message.

 
  #3 (permalink)
Elite Member
Luxembourg, Luxembourg
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: TWS
Broker/Data: Interactive Brokers
Favorite Futures: Stocks
 
Posts: 491 since May 2012
Thanks: 1,641 given, 1,126 received


The market is currently pretty volatile, not as bad as 2007/2008 before the crash, but still pretty bad. In times like this, most trading methods won't work as well. If you try to apply a method without taking into account the current context of the market, you may be missing something. In my limited experience, when things get like this, it is better to step aside and wait for trading to become somewhat easier.

Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to grausch for this post:
 
  #4 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Sydney, Australia
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Favorite Futures: Currency Futures
 
Posts: 6 since May 2015
Thanks: 4 given, 6 received


wallo101 View Post
I've been watching charts the past week and notice the market does not respect support/resistance and will break through it more often then not. There's got to be a better way to trade and i'm not finding it. Order flow seems to make the most sense right now (i'm not saying it makes sense to me yet, just more sense then trading stuff like support and resistance), but i'm currently looking at charts.

Even if you are trading through order flow there's still support and resistance, e.g.

Huge sellers at 1000 - Resistance

Not much in between.

Huge buyers at 900 - Support.

Sometimes you can see the order flow volume correlate with the support/resistance on charts.
Other times you can see where the real volume of support/resistance and is hidden on the charts.

Everyday and every moment is different. That's just what I learnt and I'm applying to my trading.

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to minskee for this post:
 
  #5 (permalink)
Market Wizard
Germany
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Other
Favorite Futures: ES, YM, 6E
 
Posts: 2,642 since Feb 2013
Thanks: 4,900 given, 6,435 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary


wallo101 View Post
I've been watching charts the past week and notice the market does not respect support/resistance and will break through it more often then not. There's got to be a better way to trade and i'm not finding it. Order flow seems to make the most sense right now (i'm not saying it makes sense to me yet, just more sense then trading stuff like support and resistance), but i'm currently looking at charts.

For those who have an edge, volatility equals opportunity - So: "If it rains mash, put out your spoon."

If you didn't find an edge yet, it's better to stand aside because chances are that you will be shark bait.
Only problem is that the QE milkmaid hausse is coming to an end sooner or later so that there will be
more volatility ahead presumably.

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to choke35 for this post:
 
  #6 (permalink)
Elite Member
australia
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Favorite Futures: -
 
Posts: 300 since Sep 2010
Thanks: 123 given, 137 received

support and resistance are psychological price levels which are perceived as levels where there would be larger number of buy or sell orders to disrupt the price movement; usually constructed by looking at previous pivots

can you be profitable consistently by blindly trading off these levels - no

can you make better trading decisions and improve your strategy by knowing these levels - yes

I do personally find support and resistance level works better in trading forex than stocks indices.

Reply With Quote
The following 3 users say Thank You to jonc for this post:
 
  #7 (permalink)
 Vendor: diversifyportfolio.com 
PTA, Gauteng
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: Self built + Sierra + TWS
Favorite Futures: Stocks and Options
 
DarkPoolTrading's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,036 since May 2012
Thanks: 1,244 given, 1,304 received


wallo101 View Post
I've been watching charts the past week and notice the market does not respect support/resistance and will break through it more often then not. There's got to be a better way to trade and i'm not finding it. Order flow seems to make the most sense right now (i'm not saying it makes sense to me yet, just more sense then trading stuff like support and resistance), but i'm currently looking at charts.

Watch this webinar if you haven't already:
https://futures.io/traders-hideout/35189-webinar-quantitative-discretionary-trader-art-science-w-adam-grimes.html

So much in markets is complete noise and randomness it's scary. We (people) love to apply meaning and patterns to things where none exist. Throw up a randomly generated price chart and every single person will find patterns and support/resistance all over the place. Are those levels legit? Of course not, they're random. But we see them none the less.

Diversification is the only free lunch
Reply With Quote
The following 7 users say Thank You to DarkPoolTrading for this post:
 
  #8 (permalink)
Elite Member
New York, New Jersey/USA
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Favorite Futures: Futures
 
Seahn's Avatar
 
Posts: 157 since Jan 2013
Thanks: 60 given, 250 received

In an uptrend all resistance will fail, in a downtrend all support will fail....

All uptrends end at resistance, all downtrends end at support....

Every support and resistance will eventually fail....

The key to using support and resistance is to correctly read the context of the market and to wait for confirming price action. Trying to trade support/resistance in a mechanical way is doomed to failure just like trading any indicator mechanically does not work.

The reason Adam Grimes is able to say that support/resistance lines are just random lines is because he is evaluating them from a simplistic statistical point of view with no regard for context. Viewing anything in the market in that way will in the long run look like everything is random.

All trading decisions are fundamentally based on support/resistance. People may insist that they do not use support/resistance but they are using it.

If the market is in a trend and a trader decides the move is over and fades the trend he has decided in his mind that the price has reached a support/resistance level.

If the market is in a range and the trader fades the range extremes he is fading support/resistance.

In the end all trading is about is buying at support and selling at resistance no matter what you choose to call it.


Last edited by Seahn; August 20th, 2015 at 12:07 PM.
Reply With Quote
The following 10 users say Thank You to Seahn for this post:
 
  #9 (permalink)
Elite Member
Leeds UK
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: FXTrade
Broker/Data: Interactive Brokers, CapitalSpreads, Oanda
Favorite Futures: GBP/USD
 
Tymbeline's Avatar
 
Posts: 401 since Apr 2015
Thanks: 894 given, 486 received


wallo101 View Post
I've been watching charts the past week and notice the market does not respect support/resistance and will break through it more often then not.

This perspective, I think, perhaps rests partly on an assumption, or an expectation, that "previous support and/or resistance" means the same thing as "future support and/or resistance". They're two different things.

It's an observable reality that the proportion of the time that previous support and/or resistance turn into future support and/or resistance is less than 100%, of course. Sometimes, in some markets, as you rightly imply with the words "more often than not", it's less than 50%.

That doesn't, however, invalidate the concepts of "support and resistance" as being significant to identifying collectively profitable trading opportunities.

There's no such thing as certainty regarding the outcome of any individual trade or any specific, short-term price-movement. Fortunately we don't need that: we need only collective probability that (to take a crude and simplistic example) over the course of 100 trades, some number of them will, on average, win $x more money than the remainder of them lose.

Even if previous support and/or resistance influence future support and/or resistance as little as 15% or 20% of the time, it can still be extremely useful toward developing trading methods which predicate that kind of outcome.

For myself, I find support and resistance hugely significant to profitable trading.

Reply With Quote
The following 4 users say Thank You to Tymbeline for this post:
 
  #10 (permalink)
Elite Member
Luxembourg, Luxembourg
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: TWS
Broker/Data: Interactive Brokers
Favorite Futures: Stocks
 
Posts: 491 since May 2012
Thanks: 1,641 given, 1,126 received



wallo101 View Post
I've been watching charts the past week and notice the market does not respect support/resistance and will break through it more often then not. There's got to be a better way to trade and i'm not finding it. Order flow seems to make the most sense right now (i'm not saying it makes sense to me yet, just more sense then trading stuff like support and resistance), but i'm currently looking at charts.

wallo101,

What did you think of the market's action yesterday? Have you found any support that held? I think that anyone hoping that support would hold, got burnt a little yesterday.

If you are truly looking for something better, please refer to the last two points in tigertrader's post.

https://futures.io/index-futures-trading/13452-es-s-p-500-futures-contract-sp500-spoo-nalysis-1999.html#post513727

That gives you quite a bit of insight into his edge, namely when he is right he likes to have size on a trade, and he does not take profits merely because he has them. He likes to ride them for as much as he can get. Now, that is what I call a true edge.

If all you are right to do is find a way to increase your winning %, then you are only looking at one part of the puzzle and missing the big picture. Getting 50 ticks profit on 10 or 20 contracts, can pay for a lot of 10 tick losers on 1 or 2 contracts. Even with a 20% win percentage, you should still make very good money.

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to grausch for this post:

Reply



futures io > > > > Is Support and Resistance Meaningless?

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Upcoming Webinars and Events (4:30PM ET unless noted)

Jigsaw Trading: TBA

Elite only

FuturesTrader71: TBA

Elite only

NinjaTrader: TBA

Jan 18

RandBots: TBA

Jan 23

GFF Brokers & CME Group: Futures & Bitcoin

Elite only

Adam Grimes: TBA

Elite only

Ran Aroussi: TBA

Elite only
     

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
A different look at Support and Resistance Xav1029 The Elite Circle 18 September 1st, 2012 07:07 AM
Support, Resistance - How to Find It, and How to Use It ryanmnly The Elite Circle 57 May 31st, 2012 10:41 AM
Support and Resistance SpyderTrader NinjaTrader Programming 11 May 13th, 2012 05:24 PM
Support and Resistance tony2009 Traders Hideout 13 July 8th, 2011 07:12 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:56 PM.

Copyright © 2017 by futures io, s.a., Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama, +507 833-9432, info@futures.io
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice.
There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
no new posts
Page generated 2017-12-13 in 0.16 seconds with 20 queries on phoenix via your IP 54.90.92.204