Targeting stops in CL and GC - Commodities Futures Trading | futures io social day trading
futures io futures trading


Targeting stops in CL and GC
Updated: Views / Replies:1,206 / 7
Created: by exptrader Attachments:0

Welcome to futures io.

(If you already have an account, login at the top of the page)

futures io is the largest futures trading community on the planet, with over 90,000 members. At futures io, our goal has always been and always will be to create a friendly, positive, forward-thinking community where members can openly share and discuss everything the world of trading has to offer. The community is one of the friendliest you will find on any subject, with members going out of their way to help others. Some of the primary differences between futures io and other trading sites revolve around the standards of our community. Those standards include a code of conduct for our members, as well as extremely high standards that govern which partners we do business with, and which products or services we recommend to our members.

At futures io, our focus is on quality education. No hype, gimmicks, or secret sauce. The truth is: trading is hard. To succeed, you need to surround yourself with the right support system, educational content, and trading mentors Ė all of which you can find on futures io, utilizing our social trading environment.

With futures io, you can find honest trading reviews on brokers, trading rooms, indicator packages, trading strategies, and much more. Our trading review process is highly moderated to ensure that only genuine users are allowed, so you donít need to worry about fake reviews.

We are fundamentally different than most other trading sites:
  • We are here to help. Just let us know what you need.
  • We work extremely hard to keep things positive in our community.
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendors advertising in posts.
  • We firmly believe in and encourage sharing. The holy grail is within you, we can help you find it.
  • We expect our members to participate and become a part of the community. Help yourself by helping others.

You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community.  It's free and simple.

-- Big Mike, Site Administrator

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
 

Targeting stops in CL and GC

  #1 (permalink)
Elite Member
Washington, DC
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: thinkorswim
Favorite Futures: ES, CL, DX, ZB
 
Posts: 98 since Jan 2014
Thanks: 360 given, 105 received

Targeting stops in CL and GC

I've been trading CL and GC recently, and I can't believe how often they take out my stops to the tick. They take out my stop and that will be within 1 or 2 ticks of the top/bottom and they they go the other way without me.

For example, I bought CL earlier this morning and put in a stop at 74.03. Look at the chart and you'll see at 10:41 AM ET, they took it down to exactly 74.03 and now it's going up without me.

I'm only trading 1 or 2 contracts at a time. Since when do they care about small fry like me?

Reply With Quote
 
  #2 (permalink)
Quick Summary
Quick Summary Post

Quick Summary is created and edited by users like you... Add FAQ's, Links and other Relevant Information by clicking the edit button in the lower right hand corner of this message.

 
  #3 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Durham, NC
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Kinetick
Favorite Futures: ES, CL
 
Posts: 48 since Oct 2014
Thanks: 0 given, 20 received


That was part of the weekly inventory report response. Anything is fair game

Reply With Quote
 
  #4 (permalink)
Elite Member
Detroit, Michigan
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Ninja Trader
Favorite Futures: Futures
 
Posts: 295 since Nov 2011
Thanks: 302 given, 280 received

Also, if you notice it was exactly yesterday's low price of the day. These monuments as I call them (daily OHLC, yesterday OHLC, weekly OHLC) are good to have on your chart to keep track of since they are price magnets a lot of the time (but not all of the time).

Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to TrendTraderBH for this post:
 
  #5 (permalink)
grappling dummy
Hawaii at the beach
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Nt8, MotiveWave, TOS
Broker/Data: S5
Favorite Futures: ES, ZB fine alcohol and muscle cars
 
KahunaDog's Avatar
 
Posts: 476 since Apr 2013
Thanks: 945 given, 345 received


exptrader View Post
I've been trading CL and GC recently, and I can't believe how often they take out my stops to the tick. They take out my stop and that will be within 1 or 2 ticks of the top/bottom and they they go the other way without me.

For example, I bought CL earlier this morning and put in a stop at 74.03. Look at the chart and you'll see at 10:41 AM ET, they took it down to exactly 74.03 and now it's going up without me.

I'm only trading 1 or 2 contracts at a time. Since when do they care about small fry like me?

Depends where you're putting your stop.
Market makers likely doing a retail flush at the places most retail traders place there stops. As in they penetrate those levels used by price action traders.

Reply With Quote
 
  #6 (permalink)
Elite Member
Vancouver, Canada
 
Futures Experience: None
Platform: T4
Favorite Futures: Futs
 
Posts: 37 since May 2013
Thanks: 1 given, 30 received


exptrader View Post
Since when do they care about small fry like me?

Average retail traders are like mackerel. They migrate predictably, alone they don't offer much sustenance but if a predator finds a school it's chow time.

I can think of 2 ways 'sophisticated' traders can take advantage of stop clustering on a low time frame;

#1 is market makers widening their spreads enough that the cascading effect of the market orders allows them to improve their inventory.

#2 is a predatory trader attempting momentum ignition by aggressively trading enough size forcing market makers to widen and causing the same cascading effect into pre placed bids/offers by the predator.

An alternative to drastically wider stops is to wait for one of these stop runs before entering and/or hedge.

Reply With Quote
 
  #7 (permalink)
Market Wizard
Las Vegas, NV
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: Abacus, Slide Rule, HP-65, Metastock, TOS, NT
Favorite Futures: Futures
 
aligator's Avatar
 
Posts: 3,424 since Aug 2010
Thanks: 1,053 given, 5,822 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary


exptrader View Post
I've been trading CL and GC recently, and I can't believe how often they take out my stops to the tick. They take out my stop and that will be within 1 or 2 ticks of the top/bottom and they they go the other way without me.

For example, I bought CL earlier this morning and put in a stop at 74.03. Look at the chart and you'll see at 10:41 AM ET, they took it down to exactly 74.03 and now it's going up without me.

I'm only trading 1 or 2 contracts at a time. Since when do they care about small fry like me?

@exptrader,

That is no surprise. Just place horizontal lines at 00, 20, 40, 60, and 80 levels on CL and watch how many times the same levels within 2-3 ticks would act as s/r and your stops will be taken out. The good news is that you can use these levels for targets, they will fill majority of the times.

Gold on the other hand is a different animal, the moves are much dependent on who buys or sells a big chunk of gold somewhere in the world, not an easy one to trade by retail traders.

Cheers!

p.s. 52 percent of gold gets used for jewelry, 18 percent constitute official holdings (as in central banks of nations), 16 percent take the form of investments, 12 percent find industrial uses, leaving 2 percent unaccounted for. So, you can guess a little daily imbalances creates big ripples.
http://www.numbersleuth.org/worlds-gold/


Last edited by aligator; December 11th, 2014 at 05:12 PM.
Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to aligator for this post:
 
  #8 (permalink)
Elite Member
Florida
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader 8
Favorite Futures: YM, ES, NQ, CL, ZB
 
trendwaves's Avatar
 
Posts: 742 since Dec 2012
Thanks: 2,822 given, 2,433 received


aligator View Post

That is no surprise. Just place horizontal lines at 00, 20, 40, 60, and 80 levels on CL and watch how many times the same levels within 2-3 ticks would act as s/r and your stops will be taken out. The good news is that you can use these levels for targets, they will fill majority of the times.

Someone pointed this out to me a few years ago, it is such a strange phenomenon in CL I have never been able to explain.

If you want to lean on a level, you can wait for the stops to be swept out (price to reach 2 or 3 ticks through the level), then look for the other side to take control of the market (I use order flow to see this). The cool thing is you can often see orders stacking ahead of the sweep. So if you have some technical trade setup near the 80 level for example, watch order flow for confirmation the level is in play, if so, then your trade has a higher chance of being successful.

In CL, my rule of thumb is I always want order flow (block size on the reconstructed tape) going with my trade not against it. Also, I prefer to see orders being pulled (and not being stacked) in front of where I want price to go (between current price and my profit target). Orders stacking at or near my profit target is a good sign for me, it's telling me the market agree's with my thesis (the market is looking at that level). Conversely, if you see orders being stacked on your stop, then your stop order is very likely going to be taken by the market. When this happens to me (orders stacking on my stop), I either move the stop order out of the way or close the trade.

Be Patient and Trade Smart
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to trendwaves for this post:

Reply



futures io > > > > Targeting stops in CL and GC

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Upcoming Webinars and Events (4:30PM ET unless noted)

Jigsaw Trading: TBA

Elite only

FuturesTrader71: TBA

Elite only

NinjaTrader: TBA

Jan 18

RandBots: TBA

Jan 23

GFF Brokers & CME Group: Futures & Bitcoin

Elite only

Adam Grimes: TBA

Elite only

Ran Aroussi: TBA

Elite only
     

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How many contracts can you trade before affecting market in CL and GC markets? acdrew0 Commodities Futures Trading 58 December 14th, 2017 09:57 PM
CL & GC Day trading use Indicators, Price action and Fibonacci cmmichaels Trading Journals 30 September 16th, 2013 09:32 PM
What is the Harmonic Rotation for CL and Gold GC ? OpalDragon The Elite Circle 2 March 12th, 2013 12:09 AM
GC and CL, no trading today? iPlayGames Traders Hideout 5 April 6th, 2012 09:03 AM
CL and GC daily charts joe11 Traders Hideout 6 January 15th, 2012 07:07 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:47 PM.

Copyright © 2017 by futures io, s.a., Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama, +507 833-9432, info@futures.io
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice.
There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
no new posts
Page generated 2017-12-16 in 0.15 seconds with 19 queries on phoenix via your IP 54.160.245.121