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Left Ninjatrader looking for a new platform...


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Left Ninjatrader looking for a new platform...

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  #11 (permalink)
Denver
 
 
Posts: 21 since Apr 2020
Thanks: 3 given, 15 received


NoWick View Post
I just completed my account application with Optimus, driven to a large degree by the platform. Like you, I was a bit puzzled and put off by the 1990s look/feel of some of the platforms on offer. I felt like I was almost using DOS. Anyway, I found Optimus Flow to be just what I wanted -- really snazzy looking and uncluttered, with great visuals and super intuitive. Worth a look.

Which clearing house are you going to be using?

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  #12 (permalink)
Los Angeles
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NT8, Python, and TOS
Trading: NQ, ES & CL
 
Posts: 25 since Oct 2010
Thanks: 24 given, 28 received


FabriceM View Post
A few weeks ago I tried and then bought the NT multi license. What started as something great ended up with "a few things happening" that made me not trust NT as a trading platform at all.

Before trading with NT , I used TOS. So obviously I am back with TOS, still have an account with IB, but hate their platform for trading and I dislike TS and TOS as well.

I am looking for advice/recommendations on a new trading platform. I consider myself a chartist, so a platform with great charting tools and very responsive is what I am looking for. I like platforms that are very uncluttered, I don't like platforms that are visually busy with stuff I don't need like TOS is, or platforms that look like they were designed in the 80's like IB's. I like straightforward, efficient and responsive.

I really like tradingview I am wondering if any of you use it for trading, and what brokers would you recommend with it? Hasx anybody experience with AMP global or Tradovate?

I am also looking for other recommendations beside Tradingview.

Thank you.

Take a look at multicharts.net. It has a free trial.

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  #13 (permalink)
Lübeck, Germany
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader, MT4
Broker: FXCM, Interactive Brokers, Oanda
Trading: Forex
 
JGSmith's Avatar
 
Posts: 148 since Aug 2013
Thanks: 61 given, 55 received


Use TradingView for your charting and then excite your trades in whichever broker you want


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"Most people overestimate what they can do in 1 year and underestimate what they can do in 10 years."
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  #14 (permalink)
Melbourne, Australia
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Ninja Trader
Broker: Ninjatrader Brokerage
Trading: Many
 
Posts: 117 since May 2012
Thanks: 110 given, 70 received

FabriceM,
If you don't mind me asking, what were the "things" that made you come to distrust NT8, broadly speaking.
Thank you.

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  #15 (permalink)
Denver
 
 
Posts: 21 since Apr 2020
Thanks: 3 given, 15 received


sienna View Post
FabriceM,
If you don't mind me asking, what were the "things" that made you come to distrust NT8, broadly speaking.
Thank you.

Unfortunately it's a long list. The first problem was the assumption I made that using IB as my broker and NT as my trading platform would work seamlessly. That was not the case, IB doesn't work well with NT. Slow data, lagging orders (where you don't know if the order was received or not) and other technical issues. The answer from NT has always been, it's IB's fault, their API isn't good. My question to them was always, if that's the case then why advertised IB as a compatible provider if it doesn't really work great. After some back and forth with NT customer support, I agreed to switch to Kinetick Data plan. Right away, NT became "alive" it was fast and responsive, like it was during the trial period with Continuum. However other problems arises, Kinetick data just stopped while I was in the middle of a CL trade. (this was 2 days after getting Kinetick. Then next morning, while checking my profit and loss on ninja trader' Trade Performance, it shows a US$432,696,162.50 Loss on a 6J trade. Even though I knew it had to be a mistake, my heart sunk, especially with what happen with the CL going negative a week or so earlier and trader who were, on paper at least, hundreds of millions in debt... This wasn't a good day. I also check my positions at the end of everyday, and I suspect some of my positions were not showing up and were left open without me realizing right away, on at least 2 occasion I discovered open position I didn't realize I had, not a good thing.... Ninja Trader answer was always the same, which was an issue with IB and that the trade performance wasn't necessarily accurate, and that I should check my trades and positions directly on my IB account and not rely on what Ninja Trade showed me. My position was and still is that if IB is advertised as a recommended broker, my assumption is that everything I do and see on Ninja Trader is a mirror image of what is happening in my IB account. Anyways after a lot of back and forth, Ninja Trader Support agreed to refund me my license. At the end, when I trade I need to trust the platform I trade on, I need to trust my ordered are placed when I enter them, that all my positions are showing up, that my profit and loss are accurate and that my data are reliable. I feel it's a fair expectation. If I have to double check everything on IB every time I do something, then it isn't something that works for me.

The biggest negative, the one thing that was a little bit disappointing but understandable was their refusal to acknowledged their misleading marketing practices as well as pointing fingers as IB being the problem, rather than at least consider that their app and their code might be a little buggy. I thing my US$432,696,162.50 virtual loss shows the code has room for improvement.

I want to end on a positive note. Ninja Trader Customer service was responsive and courteous, always. And even though it took a while to get them to refund me, ultimately they did. Also, please keep in mind that my issues may not exist if using their own brokerage. Ninja trader Brokerage isn't a good fit for my need because I trade futures and equities, and use equities as leverage for my futures margin. The day they become a full broker, I may try them again. Hopefully by that time their app may be more reliable, it is a very good design, a very good product, just not with IB, I am sorry it didn't work out and I wish them well.

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  #16 (permalink)
Langley
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: IB
Trading: Futures
 
Posts: 225 since Mar 2020
Thanks: 244 given, 188 received


FabriceM View Post
Unfortunately it's a long list. The first problem was the assumption I made that using IB as my broker and NT as my trading platform would work seamlessly. That was not the case, IB doesn't work well with NT. Slow data, lagging orders (where you don't know if the order was received or not) and other technical issues. The answer from NT has always been, it's IB's fault, their API isn't good. My question to them was always, if that's the case then why advertised IB as a compatible provider if it doesn't really work great. After some back and forth with NT customer support, I agreed to switch to Kinetick Data plan. Right away, NT became "alive" it was fast and responsive, like it was during the trial period with Continuum. However other problems arises, Kinetick data just stopped while I was in the middle of a CL trade. (this was 2 days after getting Kinetick. Then next morning, while checking my profit and loss on ninja trader' Trade Performance, it shows a US$432,696,162.50 Loss on a 6J trade. Even though I knew it had to be a mistake, my heart sunk, especially with what happen with the CL going negative a week or so earlier and trader who were, on paper at least, hundreds of millions in debt... This wasn't a good day. I also check my positions at the end of everyday, and I suspect some of my positions were not showing up and were left open without me realizing right away, on at least 2 occasion I discovered open position I didn't realize I had, not a good thing.... Ninja Trader answer was always the same, which was an issue with IB and that the trade performance wasn't necessarily accurate, and that I should check my trades and positions directly on my IB account and not rely on what Ninja Trade showed me. My position was and still is that if IB is advertised as a recommended broker, my assumption is that everything I do and see on Ninja Trader is a mirror image of what is happening in my IB account. Anyways after a lot of back and forth, Ninja Trader Support agreed to refund me my license. At the end, when I trade I need to trust the platform I trade on, I need to trust my ordered are placed when I enter them, that all my positions are showing up, that my profit and loss are accurate and that my data are reliable. I feel it's a fair expectation. If I have to double check everything on IB every time I do something, then it isn't something that works for me.

The biggest negative, the one thing that was a little bit disappointing but understandable was their refusal to acknowledged their misleading marketing practices as well as pointing fingers as IB being the problem, rather than at least consider that their app and their code might be a little buggy. I thing my US$432,696,162.50 virtual loss shows the code has room for improvement.

I want to end on a positive note. Ninja Trader Customer service was responsive and courteous, always. And even though it took a while to get them to refund me, ultimately they did. Also, please keep in mind that my issues may not exist if using their own brokerage. Ninja trader Brokerage isn't a good fit for my need because I trade futures and equities, and use equities as leverage for my futures margin. The day they become a full broker, I may try them again. Hopefully by that time their app may be more reliable, it is a very good design, a very good product, just not with IB, I am sorry it didn't work out and I wish them well.

Good to hear different perspectives as anything can, and will, go wrong in this business!

I use IB now. I've used Tradestation in the past. Loved it! Tradingview is incredible as well.

It took MONTHS to get my screens the way I like in IB but you know what... I hope I never have to switch now! It's just what I've been looking for for years. One less thing to distract from actual trading now as well.

Good luck!

Sent using the futures.io mobile app

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  #17 (permalink)
Lübeck, Germany
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader, MT4
Broker: FXCM, Interactive Brokers, Oanda
Trading: Forex
 
JGSmith's Avatar
 
Posts: 148 since Aug 2013
Thanks: 61 given, 55 received

Thanks for writing about your experience. I used NT with IB years ago and had some problems. I just assumed it was because IB was not such a good FX broker (which they weren’t). Eventually I stopped trading FX there altogether.

I haven’t used NT regularly for a few years. I want to use it, but for FX the options are just so limited and I’ve never been able to get my strategy to work on any other market except FX. So I guess I’ll just enjoy having a multi-broker license that will never be used.


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"Most people overestimate what they can do in 1 year and underestimate what they can do in 10 years."
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  #18 (permalink)
Los Angeles
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NT8, Python, and TOS
Trading: NQ, ES & CL
 
Posts: 25 since Oct 2010
Thanks: 24 given, 28 received

I am currently using NT8.

But, I think that multicharts.net is much better than NT8 in many ways including the following:
  • many more supported brokers
  • more data feeds
  • market scanner
  • better backtesting
  • better walk-forward
  • portfolio trader!!!!
  • Did I mention it has a portfolio trader?

However, there is currently one deal killer for me wrt mc.net. Currently, there is no ability to programmatically cancel an order. If that changes, I will switch over in about two seconds. I am not aware of any other deal killers for me wrt to their framework. Maybe I am missing something, but, imho MC.Net is everything that NT8 isn't and a cherry on top. I would love to hear feedback from anyone regarding mc.net issues/problems.

It blows my mind that NT doesn't have portfolio trading and a true market scanner. IMHO, if they don't update their platform to incorporate those features, they are running the risk of going to way of blackberry. There are just too many options wrt algo trading as well as many open source and free frameworks. They really need to up their game to stay in the game.

Screenshot of MC.net's portfolio trader:


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  #19 (permalink)
Melbourne, Australia
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Ninja Trader
Broker: Ninjatrader Brokerage
Trading: Many
 
Posts: 117 since May 2012
Thanks: 110 given, 70 received

FabriceM,

Thank you for your generous reply. A trading friend of mine who is in the IT industry, abandoned NT8 for Sierra charts, a year ago and is very happy with the switch. I remain with NT8 and Dorman, for the moment, as I have some indies, which I may not be able to replicate in Sierra (an assumption on my part) without costly third party coding, plus a steep learning curve.

However, Sierra may be worth investigating and some brokers offer a good deal on monthly platform fees. I believe Optimus (here on FIO) may be worth checking on this.

S

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  #20 (permalink)
Toronto Canada
 
 
Posts: 14 since May 2020
Thanks: 11 given, 6 received



FabriceM View Post
Which clearing house are you going to be using?

I ended up deciding on Ironbeam.

I plan on using the free version of Optimus Flow for the foreseeable future, but depending on what kind of progress I make in my trading, I may be tempted down the road to upgrade to the version with additional bells and whistles because I'm intrigued in particular by the "Power Trades" feature, which they describe towards the bottom of the page here:

https://optimusfutures.com/OptimusFlow.php

For my style of trading that may come in handy, or at least that's how it's coming across. But for now I am more than satisfied with the free version.

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