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Rithmic

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  #1 (permalink)
 Zoethecus 
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Anyone using NT/Rithmic and willing to share their experiences? Especially interested to hear from those who also use NT/Zen or NT/TT.

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  #3 (permalink)
 MXASJ 
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I think Zen is using Rithmic now...

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  #4 (permalink)
 Zoethecus 
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My understanding, which may be wrong, is Rithmic doesn't need Zen and can indeed replace Zen as a Ninja datafeed.

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  #5 (permalink)
 MXASJ 
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If you log in to Zen, you will find you are connected to the Rithmic plant.

If you can get your hands on the API documentation I'd love to see it. I don't have a cash account with any of their IBs or FCMs so its been hard for me to get anything other than the R|Trader manual.

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  #6 (permalink)
 Zoethecus 
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MXASJ View Post
If you log in to Zen, you will find you are connected to the Rithmic plant.

If you can get your hands on the API documentation I'd love to see it. I don't have a cash account with any of their IBs or FCMs so its been hard for me to get anything other than the R|Trader manual.

But if Rithmic can stand alone w/o Zen, why pay the Zen premium on commissions?

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  #7 (permalink)
 MXASJ 
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This is where I'm out of my depth... but I think Rithmic itself (like Zen itself) doesn't sell anything to you and I, they sell it to IBs and FCMs. If you had an account with NewEdge or Dorman you can get R|Trader, but you can't get it directly from Rithmic.

NT is coded to Zen, which (I believe) is using the Rithmic ticker plant. It also offers "Vision Financial Markets" as a connection option, but I don't know if that is the Rithmic API or not.

This is actually good stuff worth finding out. Would be very interested to learn if Vision offers stock trading via Ninja...

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  #8 (permalink)
 Zoethecus 
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Vision offers that and more.

Vision Financial Markets - Futures, Securities & Options | Brokerage, Clearing & Technology

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  #9 (permalink)
 Affliction 
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Zoethecus View Post
Anyone using NT/Rithmic and willing to share their experiences? Especially interested to hear from those who also use NT/Zen or NT/TT.


Zoethecus,

I am not a techy by any stretch of the imagination. Also, I am not giving Optumus Trading Group a thumbs up or a thumbs down - all I know is they work for me (I am only a client and NOTHING else) . And yes, I am running Rithmic only with NT 6.5.

Optumus Trading is an IB for Vision and the last time I checked you could get a free trial of NT (which you most likely don't need) and Rithmic data feed through them. It might help you in your quest to use the feed for a while. I do know that I, personally, am happy with the feed, but I do have limited knowledge of the other feeds.

Sorry, other than the above, I can't speak intelligently on any specfics, but I am willing to try if you ask.

I hope it helps!!

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  #10 (permalink)
 traderwerks   is a Vendor
 
 
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MXASJ View Post
If you log in to Zen, you will find you are connected to the Rithmic plant.

If you can get your hands on the API documentation I'd love to see it. I don't have a cash account with any of their IBs or FCMs so its been hard for me to get anything other than the R|Trader manual.

The API documentation is online. You don't have to have an account to see the API or demo Rithmic.

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  #11 (permalink)
 MXASJ 
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traderwerks View Post
The API documentation is online. You don't have to have an account to see the API or demo Rithmic.

Call me dim but while I can find R|Trader documentation online I can't seem to find the R|API documentation. Is there a URL ypu can point me to? Thanks!

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  #12 (permalink)
 Zoethecus 
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Okay, I've confirmed that Zen is a third party marketing name that has Rithmic under the hood; in other words, if you use Zen, you're on Rithmic.

And yes, you can get Rithmic with other brokers and possibley get a better rate on fees than what Zen broker charge.

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  #13 (permalink)
 mattz   is a Vendor
 
 
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Just a few clarifications about all this:
What I am about to say is from my general knowledge and understanding.
Zen is fully driven as a feed by Rithmic.

I know the guys at Rithmic well, and they are super nice guys that are catering most of his business to small hedge funds and institutional traders. Their solutions go way beyond just a feed, but API connectivity, hosting equipment on the exchange, etc. This has been the main driver of their business. Many years ago that have white-labeled the Zen feed for the retail traders. Today they no longer engage in white-labeling for anyone.

I clear through Vision and Rithmic is not mentioned on NinjaTrader as a feed (sadly), instead it says Vision Financial Markets. On MutiCharts it does mention for example that we use Rithmic. I guess every platform has it's own politics (which I will stay out of).

to the credit of the FCM and IBs that have brought forward Zen,although it's my competition, I take my hat off.
This was forward thinking and enabled the little trader to have good execution, speed and bring the best features out of NinjaTrader.

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 steve2222 
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mattz View Post
Just a few clarifications about all this:
What I am about to say is from my general knowledge and understanding.
Zen is fully driven as a feed by Rithmic.

I know the guys at Rithmic well, and they are super nice guys that are catering most of his business to small hedge funds and institutional traders. Their solutions go way beyond just a feed, but API connectivity, hosting equipment on the exchange, etc. This has been the main driver of their business. Many years ago that have white-labeled the Zen feed for the retail traders. Today they no longer engage in white-labeling for anyone.

I clear through Vision and Rithmic is not mentioned on NinjaTrader as a feed (sadly), instead it says Vision Financial Markets. On MutiCharts it does mention for example that we use Rithmic. I guess every platform has it's own politics (which I will stay out of).

to the credit of the FCM and IBs that have brought forward Zen,although it's my competition, I take my hat off.
This was forward thinking and enabled the little trader to have good execution, speed and bring the best features out of NinjaTrader.

So Matt that means that when we are having problems with the data from ZenFire (eg there are messages on this site where traders are saying ZenFire freezes or does not feed data for X period of time) then we would have the same problems with your feed from Rithmic given you are saying ZenFire is just a retail white label of the Rithmic feed?

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steve2222 View Post
So Matt that means that when we are having problems with the data from ZenFire (eg there are messages on this site where traders are saying ZenFire freezes or does not feed data for X period of time) then we would have the same problems with your feed from Rithmic given you are saying ZenFire is just a retail white label of the Rithmic feed?

That I cant answer because it depends on the way this solution is structured.
The Integration of any two parties today could be just more than a name as it gets complex technologically.
Since most of you here use NinjaTrader, all I can say is that the support team at NT has been always been highly responsive to me when instances if technical difficulties occur, and this is applied to all the brokers they support.

I can ONLY speak of our experience with Rithmic, and so far it has been good.
There were a few instances when we had some feed issues, but truly they are very rare so far.

We use a number of feeds to drive certain platforms and there is no perfect world. All parties that I deal with as brokers, feed providers, platform vendors have been highly responsive in instances when feeds go down.

Always have a way to call your broker/support desk in instances when it goes down.
Relationship with a broker goes a long way in this "point and click" world.

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  #16 (permalink)
MilfHunter
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There is a video comparing Rithmic data feed on NinjaTrader vs Interactive Brokers on youtube.

Rithmic has had 64bit API for awhile. If you are using NinjaTrader 7 64 bit version, then you can run on 64 bit system if you are using Rithmic data feed (through Optimus Futures). Whether or not 64 bit is any better then 32 bit will depend on the memory consumption Ninjatrader uses while you are trading. If you are running multiple charts with lots of studies and using a high end CPU with 4Gb ram or more, then 64 bit will probably be better, more so if you are backtesting strategies.

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 Big Mike 
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One thing is that with NT7 beta 20 or 21 or 22 (don't recall specifically), they re-wrote the API to make it 64-bit compatible, based on the release notes. I am not sure what personal touches NT makes to the API instead of just taking it directly from Zen, but this could be both a good thing or a bad thing. It could be good if they were using an out dated API before and have now implemented it better, or it could be bad in that they may have introduced bugs or coding problems in the new 64-bit and untested API.

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  #18 (permalink)
 LukeGeniol 
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Big Mike View Post
One thing is that with NT7 beta 20 or 21 or 22 (don't recall specifically), they re-wrote the API to make it 64-bit compatible, based on the release notes. I am not sure what personal touches NT makes to the API instead of just taking it directly from Zen, but this could be both a good thing or a bad thing. It could be good if they were using an out dated API before and have now implemented it better, or it could be bad in that they may have introduced bugs or coding problems in the new 64-bit and untested API.

Mike

Zen works only on 32-bit, instead Rithmic works now on 64 too, I think they use different API. I'm trying Rithmic, and seem works well, the only bad is that the historical data come always from Zen thru NT servers.

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  #19 (permalink)
 LukeGeniol 
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A bad thing is that Rithmic does not provide Eurex and other European market data and treade service. Zen Fire instead provide the major European Futures. None of them provides ICE BRN that is a really interesting instruments, moves like CL with similar daily volume and $3.16 round turn with NT thru TT.

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 uexkuell 
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LukeGeniol View Post
None of them provides ICE BRN

Strange - my program receives BRN quotes through Zenfire successfully every day.

Perhaps a problem with the symbol?

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  #21 (permalink)
 LukeGeniol 
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uexkuell View Post
Strange - my program receives BRN quotes through Zenfire successfully every day.

Perhaps a problem with the symbol?

Oh, u are right with Zen only real time data, NT does not store historical data for BRN.

Take your Pips, go out and Live.
Luke.
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 traderwerks   is a Vendor
 
 
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LukeGeniol View Post
A bad thing is that Rithmic does not provide Eurex and other European market data and treade service. Zen Fire instead provide the major European Futures. None of them provides ICE BRN that is a really interesting instruments, moves like CL with similar daily volume and $3.16 round turn with NT thru TT.

I trade to Bobl with Rithmic on Eurex. Maybe it is your clearer.

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  #23 (permalink)
 Zoethecus 
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LukeGeniol View Post
Zen works only on 32-bit,

ZenFire is fully compatible with NT7b22 64bit.

Tools-->Account Connection-->ZenFire account-->Change--> Next--> check Enable 64-bit.

Please show your appreciation by clicking the "Thanks" button.

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  #24 (permalink)
 LukeGeniol 
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LukeGeniol View Post
Zen works only on 32-bit, instead Rithmic works now on 64 too, I think they use different API. I'm trying Rithmic, and seem works well, the only bad is that the historical data come always from Zen thru NT servers.


LukeGeniol View Post
A bad thing is that Rithmic does not provide Eurex and other European market data and trade service. Zen Fire instead provide the major European Futures. None of them provides ICE BRN that is a really interesting instruments, moves like CL with similar daily volume and $3.16 round turn with NT thru TT.

At this point I think I said a bullshit in these 2 posts. Pardon!

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  #25 (permalink)
 LukeGeniol 
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Anyway thru Optmus demo i can't get Eurex Futures with Rithmic, maybe cos is demo?


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  #26 (permalink)
 MetalTrade 
 
 
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Vision who supplies the Rithmic datafeed offers now eurex since this week via the CQG trading platform. It's in beta now.

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LukeGeniol View Post
Anyway thru Optmus demo i can't get Eurex Futures with Rithmic, maybe cos is demo?

Maybe. I get them.


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Zoethecus View Post
ZenFire is fully compatible with NT7b22 64bit.

Tools-->Account Connection-->ZenFire account-->Change--> Next--> check Enable 64-bit.

Please show your appreciation by clicking the "Thanks" button.

I already knew this.

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I did a little bit more research and I want to address some topics discussed:
The first thing to understand about Rithmic that it has it's own connectivity, hosting, equipment and data center.
Some partners use may use only part of the Rithmic solution, for example they may use only their software.
It does not mean they use their data center, hosting, etc. As such, I believe that using terms such as "white-label" could be a bit misleading, because companies are fully capable of having their own data center and hosting and using a number of parties for the support of their infrastructure. Further, they can bring other exchanges through their data centers.

Optimus currently uses Rithmic for the entire support from hosting, connectivity and using the Rithmic data center.
We believe that by going with one party that proved itself reliable for institutional business and retail, we hope to get a stable environment for our traders who use Ninja,Multicharts, R-Trader and R/API that are all hooked via Rithmic.
Rithmic currently does not support Eurex through their data centers and such we don't offer it via Rithmic.

We are in discussions with another high-end solution provider for the Eurex, but I will only mention it when it's fully implementable. The idea is always to find a solution that is reasonable from a cost perspective so the commissions could stay low.

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 traderwerks   is a Vendor
 
 
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@ LukeGeniol I guess you will need a new broker / FCM in the meantime that handles Eurex.

Eurex is one of the largest exchanges in the world so it should not be that hard to find someone that supports them.

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  #31 (permalink)
 LukeGeniol 
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@ LukeGeniol I guess you will need a new broker / FCM in the meantime that handles Eurex.

Eurex is one of the largest exchanges in the world so it should not be that hard to find someone that supports them.

Thanks, I have more then one. Mine was only a trial of Rithmic feed.

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 MetalTrade 
 
 
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We are in discussions with another high-end solution provider for the Eurex, but I will only mention it when it's fully implementable. The idea is always to find a solution that is reasonable from a cost perspective so the commissions could stay low.

Apparently it is since this week. But you have to work with CQGLite with it. Maybe you need to call up your contact person at your company since I have other more updated information from your company.

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 FulcrumTrader 
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Just a heads up to the traders in this thread.....Vision Financial Markets is one of the few FCM's offering Kospi 200 so far in the US. I sure wished more FCM's would start to carry this instrument and the Hang Seng (with decent margins)!

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 ZTR 
 
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Just a heads up to the traders in this thread.....Vision Financial Markets is one of the few FCM's offering Kospi 200 so far in the US. I sure wished more FCM's would start to carry this instrument and the Hang Seng (with decent margins)!

I can't wait until Asia opens up a little more & once China floats its currency....

Then I am sure more FCM's would offer Asian instruments.

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Apparently it is since this week. But you have to work with CQGLite with it. Maybe you need to call up your contact person at your company since I have other more updated information from your company.

I appreciate the heads up, and I am aware who will be the provider and there is another component to it.
Before I release anything to this forum, I want to make sure thing are fully operational.

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  #36 (permalink)
 MXASJ 
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ZTR View Post
I can't wait until Asia opens up a little more & once China floats its currency....

Then I am sure more FCM's would offer Asian instruments.

There are quite a few people playing the latency arb game here within Asia, and a US-based trader would start with a 250ms network delay disadvantage. Just keep that in mind...

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One thing is that with NT7 beta 20 or 21 or 22 (don't recall specifically), they re-wrote the API to make it 64-bit compatible, based on the release notes. I am not sure what personal touches NT makes to the API instead of just taking it directly from Zen, but this could be both a good thing or a bad thing. It could be good if they were using an out dated API before and have now implemented it better, or it could be bad in that they may have introduced bugs or coding problems in the new 64-bit and untested API.

Mike

- NT 32-bit uses the Rithmic C++ API (true for both Zen-Fire and Vision)
- Rithmic made recently available a native .NET API (which allows us to natively support 64-bit)
- We integrated the Rithmic .NET API into one of our recent NT 7 versions thus providing 64-bit support for both Zen-Fire and Vision
- When running 32-bit, NT uses the C++ API, when running 64-bit it uses the new .NET API
- The .NET API is new to us thus its integration into NinjaTrader is labeled as beta

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- NT 32-bit uses the Rithmic C++ API (true for both Zen-Fire and Vision)
- Rithmic made recently available a native .NET API (which allows us to natively support 64-bit)
- We integrated the Rithmic .NET API into one of our recent NT 7 versions thus providing 64-bit support for both Zen-Fire and Vision
- When running 32-bit, NT uses the C++ API, when running 64-bit it uses the new .NET API
- The .NET API is new to us thus its integration into NinjaTrader is labeled as beta

Ray, if I made add: Vision is using the Rithmic solution exclusively.
Just wanted to make sure that there aren't 3 entities involved.

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  #39 (permalink)
 Gary 
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Hello all,

Does anyone know if I can I still get historical data from NinjaTrader servers using Rithmic?

Thanks,
Gary

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 LukeGeniol 
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Gary View Post
Hello all,

Does anyone know if I can I still get historical data from NinjaTrader servers using Rithmic?

Thanks,
Gary

Ja, u get the same historical data of Zen-Fire.

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Luke.
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 Warren B. 
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No thats not correct. ZenFire data are stored by ninja trader on their servers with wrong timestamps.
Rithmic has its own data center.

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 Gary 
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Warren B. View Post
No thats not correct. ZenFire data are stored by ninja trader on their servers with wrong timestamps.
Rithmic has its own data center.

Warren,

Do you mean that Rithmic stores historical on their own servers and Zen is stored on Ninja? In other words, yes to historical with Rithmic via their own servers?

Thanks for the clarification in advance,
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 Warren B. 
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Yes.

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 LukeGeniol 
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I'm trying Rithmic thru Optimus Futures, and I get the same Historical data of Zen-Fire thru NT, Infact if i switch to Zen-Fire, that could be done only if u first disconnect from Rithmic (otherway u get this
), I have the same orders done on Rithmic, and if u try to load a Rithmic unsopported instrument like FDAX u get anyway the historical data.
So i think the historical data come always from Zen-Fire thru NT server.
Maybe @ mattz or @ NinjaTrader could clarify this.

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Before I research this, I would like to give Ninja a chance to answer this because this is a highly technical question.
It would be nice of them to help one of their supporting brokers @ optimus ( I don't like these similes..but they do emphasize a point)

If they won't I will ask Rithmic directly

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  #46 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
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It's an interesting question. Does Rithmic provide backfill, or not? Might need to also qualify that for which platform(s).

A quick google search suggests "No", they do not, just like their OEM counterpart Zen Fire. NinjaTrader has their own hardware doing backfill for Zen Fire, and they give this away to Ninja customers. But a Zen Fire customer using MultiCharts can't use that server, obviously.

However, one post contradicts this, and that is here from the MultiCharts forum:
MultiCharts: Trading Software for Automated Trading and Backtesting • View topic - FYI: Rithmic (Zen-fire) provides historical data ...

This post suggests the backfill is in fact coming from Rithmic. It's almost worthless however, 1 day of ticks and 1 week of minute data (whereas Ninja+Zen provides about 1 year). But, it would suggest Rithmic does at least provide backfill in this very limited fashion. Perhaps @MultiCharts can confirm this again, that it is not a MultiCharts server providing this function but in fact Rithmic.

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LukeGeniol View Post
I'm trying Rithmic thru Optimus Futures, and I get the same Historical data of Zen-Fire thru NT

...

and if u try to load a Rithmic unsopported instrument like FDAX u get anyway the historical data.
So i think the historical data come always from Zen-Fire thru NT server.

Yeah based on this I think you are 100% right. NT is using their own historical db server for backfill for Rithmic.

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 aslan 
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The ZenFire API allows ticks to be replayed, but the doc does not talk about how much data you can request. I do not see any interface for requesting min bar data. This interface does not go thru Ninja, so I would think that Zen stores todays ticks on the server and replays them if requested.

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 LukeGeniol 
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@Big Mike u can read it also here Supported Data Feeds, Zen-Fire and Rithmic provide the same amount of historical data. The thing is not reallyclear , on all this issue, is the relationships between Zen-Fire and Rithmic.

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 Big Mike 
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Moderator Notice
Moderator Notice



Optimus Futures thread:


Rithmic thread:
(this one)

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 Big Mike 
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aslan View Post
The ZenFire API allows ticks to be replayed, but the doc does not talk about how much data you can request. I do not see any interface for requesting min bar data. This interface does not go thru Ninja, so I would think that Zen stores todays ticks on the server and replays them if requested.

Hmm. I am quite certain based on everything I know about Zen that they do not provide backfill at all. Now, it seems that Rithmic may provide extremely limited backfill, and some platforms (such as MultiCharts) I think will automatically use the Rithmic backfill even when using a "Zen" connection (the same API afterall).

NinjaTrader decided they needed backfill and they were heavy early on with Zen, so it was a good partnership for NT to create their own historical backfill server for their customers. It seems based on what Luke is saying that NT will route Rithmic connections to this backfill server as well (again, same API afterall).

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 Big Mike 
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LukeGeniol View Post
@Big Mike u can read it also here Supported Data Feeds, Zen-Fire and Rithmic provide the same amount of historical data. The thing is not reallyclear , on all this issue, is the relationships between Zen-Fire and Rithmic.

Interesting, this says 1 day of tick and 5 months of 'intra-day' which I would assume means minute data. But it is wording very oddly, confusing, and contradicts the post from the MultiCharts forum I linked too earlier.

Hopefully @MultiCharts can clarify a bit.

As for relationship, I think Rithmic is the manufacturer of the product, Zen Fire is simply a white label OEM. Rithmic also says on their home page "Powered by OMNE".

If you go to Omne's site:
Omnesys Technologies, Inc.

They list Rithmic as a customer.

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  #53 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
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On the whole OMNE note, another interesting thing I noticed some time ago is that when you first load MultiCharts, the titlebar actually says "Powered by OMNE". This is interesting, too. Does OMNE provide other trading related technologies, it would seem?



Again, hoping @MultiCharts can clarify.

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  #54 (permalink)
 sysot1t 
 
 
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OMNE is the Middleware MessageQue tech they are using for their ticker plant.. ... this should provide a better understanding of what the tech does..

https://www.omnesys.com/documents/The_OMNE-An_Overview_of_the_Omnesys_Meta_Network_Environment.pdf



Big Mike View Post
On the whole OMNE note, another interesting thing I noticed some time ago is that when you first load MultiCharts, the titlebar actually says "Powered by OMNE". This is interesting, too. Does OMNE provide other trading related technologies, it would seem?



Again, hoping @ MultiCharts can clarify.

Mike


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 Big Mike 
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sysot1t View Post
OMNE is the MQ tech they are using..

I was just coming to a similar conclusion after poking around on the website more.

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 sysot1t 
 
 
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Big Mike View Post
I was just coming to a similar conclusion after poking around on the website more.

Mike

yes, if I am not mistaken I think JPM still uses them... might have moved to something more along the lines of expressWay, I dont have contacts over there anymore since my buddies moved to CSFB... for those that might be wondering what MQ does or might be and why a ticker plant would use said infra.. go to IBM site and search their redbooks for WebSphere LLM ... you will find some decent info in there as IBM redbooks are very detailed..

Personally, I think OMNE is aged tech by now.. but still holds its ground... to deal with UHFT you require something much more robust... expressway is one of those products .... and at a conference back in September in NYC I got to see something new, sub-microsecond, novaspark... I didnt pay much attention to it as I care more about overall HPC and Cloud Computing than dealing with ULT..

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  #57 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
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I think the underlying core question here is the implementation of Zen Fire, vs Rithmic. Take Mirus for instance, their implementation of Zen Fire could be drastically different than how Rithmic implements the same data. We also know from recent other posts that there are different 'levels' of Zen Fire data, so it could mean a pretty big difference between brokers who implement Zen.

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 sysot1t 
 
 
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Big Mike View Post
I think the underlying core question here is the implementation of Zen Fire, vs Rithmic. Take Mirus for instance, their implementation of Zen Fire could be drastically different than how Rithmic implements the same data. We also know from recent other posts that there are different 'levels' of Zen Fire data, so it could mean a pretty big difference between brokers who implement Zen.

Mike

I would concur, it depends on the broker (more than likely), ZenFire vs. Rithmic is not the only one.. you can also look at TT .. ... depending on the broker setup on their DC you will get better response/performance, etc... the ticker plant owner will send you whatever data you subscribe your customers to... which might be good or not as good.. all depending... that is also why I am just willing to pay $1200/yr for DTNIQ and keep an account with Tradestation just for historical data... best to not have to worry about how clean my historical data is, etc...

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 FBJS 
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Just a heads up to the traders in this thread.....Vision Financial Markets is one of the few FCM's offering Kospi 200 so far in the US. I sure wished more FCM's would start to carry this instrument and the Hang Seng (with decent margins)!

I am assuming that Optimus then also allows trading of this instrument, since they clear through Vision and use their feed. I just signed up for a trial data feed connection to Optimus and would like to see if I can get the Kospi displayed, but I don't know the right symbol in NinjaTrader to use for this. Can someone help me out with that?

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I will ask tomorrow what platform it is on.
Not sure it is on NinjaTrader.

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 FBJS 
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mattz View Post
I will ask tomorrow what platform it is on.
Not sure it is on NinjaTrader.

Thanks, I will await your response...

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FBJS View Post
Thanks, I will await your response...

No Kospi on any platform at the moment.
From what I hear they have very heavy restrictions, regulations, costs etc so it was no making business sense.

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  #63 (permalink)
burton82
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Rithmic is also listed on the partner page, they also both have the same address if you go to the contact us section

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 skilo 
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Just wanted to add my comments on Rithmic and Optimus trading. So far I have had great experience with the rithmic connection and no issues of connection failures. Also my broker Matt from Optimus has bent over backwards getting me set up and moving my license over from Zen Fire to Rithmic. Been a great experience so far and a lot different hospitality then my previous two brokers.

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 Big Mike 
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skilo View Post
Just wanted to add my comments on Rithmic and Optimus trading. So far I have had great experience with the rithmic connection and no issues of connection failures. Also my broker Matt from Optimus has bent over backwards getting me set up and moving my license over from Zen Fire to Rithmic. Been a great experience so far and a lot different hospitality then my previous two brokers.

Always nice to hear a success story

You may wish to post this in the Optimus thread as well.



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Wtuinvest
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Does the Rithmic Datafeed cost anything and how much history data is avaivable ?

Im trying to backtest some of my strategies but cannot find sufficient and high qualitity ( not the IB junk ) history data.

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 MetalTrade 
 
 
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Quoting 
Does the Rithmic Datafeed cost anything and how much history data is avaivable ?

Im trying to backtest some of my strategies but cannot find sufficient and high qualitity ( not the IB junk ) history data.

It's included in the higher trading cost. So it's not 'free', you pay it per trade you make.

Just make sure you know that there is a difference between a historical end of day data feed and a historical tick by tick data feed. In fact, it's a HUGE difference.

If data is critical to you, I strongly advise to use DTN/IQFeed, it's just the best for retail users like we are out there. I rather pay my $80 or $120 dtn/iqfeed fees (use the CME Waiver!) and save 1000's of $$ with cheaper trade fees.

Since your from Europe, notice that Rithmic DOES not carry DAX or other EUREX instruments!!!!!!!!!

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  #68 (permalink)
 redratsal 
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Wtuinvest View Post
Does the Rithmic Datafeed cost anything and how much history data is avaivable ?

Im trying to backtest some of my strategies but cannot find sufficient and high qualitity ( not the IB junk ) history data.


With Kinetick(DTN IQ feed) Kinetick - Streaming real time quotes and historical market data you pay around 60 Euro/month (including Eurex), you get 4 months historical tick data and 2 years minutes data

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Wtuinvest View Post
Does the Rithmic Datafeed cost anything and how much history data is avaivable ?

Im trying to backtest some of my strategies but cannot find sufficient and high qualitity ( not the IB junk ) history data.

I see you use Ninja, so you could test tick by tick data on NinjaTrader with Rithmic before you go live.
Some popular instruments provide up to 2 years worth of tick data.
Make sure the chart is set to tick data.
Right click on the chart--Data Series and change the parameters on "days to load".
Keep in mind, tick data takes a long time to load since it is unfiltered.

If you decide to go with an external service, I also recommend Kinetick, might as well be serviced by the same company for all.

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 MetalTrade 
 
 
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mattz View Post
If you decide to go with an external service, I also recommend Kinetick, might as well be serviced by the same company for all.

I tested Kinetick and DTN/IQFeed, there is no difference in speed, they are the same, there is no advantage in using kinetick.

Kinetick is slightly cheaper BUT you can only use it on ninjatrader WITH a live-enabled paid ninjatrader license.

If you go for DTN/IQFeed, at least you can call them on the telephone, they operate their servers and you can use all your other charting programs on their datafeed.

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MetalTrade View Post
I tested Kinetick and DTN/IQFeed, there is no difference in speed, they are the same, there is no advantage in using kinetick.

Kinetick is slightly cheaper BUT you can only use it on ninjatrader WITH a live-enabled paid ninjatrader license.

Incorrect. You can use any NinjaTrader version free or paid with Kinetick. There are several advantage in using Kinetick (over IQFeed) for NinjaTrader.

- Free EOD data
- More effiecient since the NinjaTrader Kinetick adapter connects directly to the IQFeed servers vs NinjaTrader IQFeed adapter which uses the IQFeed API (additional layer of code)
- As you pointed out, less expensive
- Kinetick supports all NinjaTrader supported brokers for the CME Waiver program where IQFeed does not

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  #72 (permalink)
 omaha786 
San Diego, California
 
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NinjaTrader View Post
Incorrect. You can use any NinjaTrader version free or paid with Kinetick. There are several advantage in using Kinetick (over IQFeed) for NinjaTrader.

- Free EOD data
- More effiecient since the NinjaTrader Kinetick adapter connects directly to the IQFeed servers vs NinjaTrader IQFeed adapter which uses the IQFeed API (additional layer of code)
- As you pointed out, less expensive
- Kinetick supports all NinjaTrader supported brokers for the CME Waiver program where IQFeed does not

Is it true the CME waiver program works only for the paid NinjaTrader?

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  #73 (permalink)
 LukeGeniol 
Italy (IT)
 
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omaha786 View Post
Is it true the CME waiver program works only for the paid NinjaTrader?

The CME waiver is available for who have an account with a broker that has subscribed to it and that use a software that support IQfeed and allow live trading, is your broker that has to enable you it with DTN.

Take your Pips, go out and Live.
Luke.
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 GoldStandard 
arizona
 
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omaha786 View Post
Is it true the CME waiver program works only for the paid NinjaTrader?

Yes, it only works with the paid version of ninjatrader (also works with the 'free' broker-supplied version where you pay for it per trade such as Mirus provides). The reason given is that in order to provide the waiver, the CME wants to make sure you're using a software that has been approved as being able to place live orders. Unfortunately other dealer-bundled platforms like R-trader and X-trader do not seem to be on the CMEs list of approved software yet.

It might be worth it to open up a separate account with a broker like Mirus who offers the 'free' ninjatrader, just so you can get the fee waiver. You don't necessarily have to do all your trading through this account.

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 LukeGeniol 
Italy (IT)
 
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@GoldStandard, I think that with X-Trader or others that use proprietary data and don't support IQFeed will be not allowed, anyway is your broker that has to declare to DTN that you are trading with a platform that support IQfeed.

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 Big Mike 
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GoldStandard View Post
Yes, it only works with the paid version of ninjatrader (also works with the 'free' broker-supplied version where you pay for it per trade such as Mirus provides). The reason given is that in order to provide the waiver, the CME wants to make sure you're using a software that has been approved as being able to place live orders.

This is correct.

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 evancds 
PA
 
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Is anyone getting back fill of DX on ICE? I get this message in Sierra Charts:

Starting real-time intraday chart updates for DX FMU0011!-NYBOT | 2011-06-14 15:32:46
Downloading intraday chart data for DX FMU0011!-NYBOT to the file DX FMU0011!-NYBOT.scid | 2011-06-14 15:38:05
Using server: 68.70.160.193 port 10049 | 2011-06-14 15:38:05
Currently no data in file to display. Will start download and updates. C:\SierraChart711Rith\Data\DX FMU0011!-NYBOT.scid | 2011-06-14 15:38:06
Requesting up to 60 days of intraday data. | 2011-06-14 15:38:06
Using compression. | 2011-06-14 15:38:06
Server does not have data for the symbol DX FMU0011!-NYBOT | 2011-06-14 15:38:06
Received 0 records and wrote 0 records for DX FMU0011!-NYBOT | 2011-06-14 15:38:06
Intraday download COMPLETE for DX FMU0011!-NYBOT | 2011-06-14 15:38:06

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SgtJ
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evancds View Post
Is anyone getting back fill of DX on ICE? I get this message in Sierra Charts:

Starting real-time intraday chart updates for DX FMU0011!-NYBOT | 2011-06-14 15:32:46
Downloading intraday chart data for DX FMU0011!-NYBOT to the file DX FMU0011!-NYBOT.scid | 2011-06-14 15:38:05
Using server: 68.70.160.193 port 10049 | 2011-06-14 15:38:05
Currently no data in file to display. Will start download and updates. C:\SierraChart711Rith\Data\DX FMU0011!-NYBOT.scid | 2011-06-14 15:38:06
Requesting up to 60 days of intraday data. | 2011-06-14 15:38:06
Using compression. | 2011-06-14 15:38:06
Server does not have data for the symbol DX FMU0011!-NYBOT | 2011-06-14 15:38:06
Received 0 records and wrote 0 records for DX FMU0011!-NYBOT | 2011-06-14 15:38:06
Intraday download COMPLETE for DX FMU0011!-NYBOT | 2011-06-14 15:38:06


Make sure you have 2 spaces after the DX

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 evancds 
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Hey Sgt,

I'm getting live data, so i think the symbol is correct. I'm just not getting the historical data. Are you getting historical data from rithmic in sierra charts for DX?

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 rani 
Prague, Czech Republic
 
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evancds View Post
Hey Sgt,

I'm getting live data, so i think the symbol is correct. I'm just not getting the historical data. Are you getting historical data from rithmic in sierra charts for DX?

You get live data from Rithmic and historical from Sierra. I am afraid Sierra's historical feed does not support DX yet. Ask Sierra support.

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 evancds 
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evancds View Post
Hey Sgt,

I'm getting live data, so i think the symbol is correct. I'm just not getting the historical data. Are you getting historical data from rithmic in sierra charts for DX?


Per Sierra Charts, it seems tick data is unavailable, but historical minute data is provided. Since all my other charts are historical intraday tick, I installed another copy of Sierra, set it to historical minute, then copied the data file to the other Sierra charts data path. Cumbersome, but it's working.

Rani, I think historical daily is from SC, but historical intraday is rithmic data stored on SC servers AFAIK

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 isarhodes 
Kiotari,Athens
 
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Posts: 22 since Aug 2009

Hi gang,

Now that Zenfire stoped supporting ninja 6.5 , which is the next best option ?
Paid or free ?

I heard kinetick, does this work with 6.5 ?

Thanks in advance,

Isa

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 Big Mike 
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isarhodes View Post
I heard kinetick, does this work with 6.5 ?

No, but IQfeed does - which is the big brother version of Kinetick. Why not just upgrade to NT 7? Next you are going to tell me you are still running Windows XP

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 isarhodes 
Kiotari,Athens
 
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Hi there Boss,

Well you got me also there, i was using on 3 of my machines xp but recently went to 7 (...

I can't rewrite all my work on ninja 7 although i will eventualy do, but for now i need a datafeed with historical data as well
to use with 6.5, still will use 7 to trade .

So Dtn iqfeed works just out of the box ? , i mean i subscribe and download data on demand etc... and get real time quotes and all ? to use with the 6.5 ?

Again thanks so much man,

Sincerely and respectfuly,

Isarhodes

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 liquidcci 
Austin, TX
 
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isarhodes View Post
Hi gang,

Now that Zenfire stoped supporting ninja 6.5 , which is the next best option ?
Paid or free ?

I heard kinetick, does this work with 6.5 ?

Thanks in advance,

Isa

kinetick is not a trading engine so no trades can be placed through it like zenfire. I am not sure if rithmic works with 6.5 or not but I have seen no announcements saying it does not. I use rithmic with NT7 and I assume would have seen some type of announcement. They have effectively killed 6.5 with this and NT no longer updating it.

I would suggest everyone do what you have to do to switch to 7. I did a few months ago after fighting doing it for a while. It was a pain because I had to recode my strategies but I am glad I did it because NT7 is better.

"The day I became a winning trader was the day it became boring. Daily losses no longer bother me and daily wins no longer excited me. Took years of pain and busting a few accounts before finally got my mind right. I survived the darkness within and now just chillax and let my black box do the work."
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 Big Mike 
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IQfeed works with NT 6.5 or 7, plus just about every other platform out there. Kinetick requires NT 7, and doesn't work with anything else.

Kinetick is just a re-branded IQfeed made exclusively for NinjaTrader.

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Alan78
Milano
 
 
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On Rithmic web page I see that rithmic has connection to Eurex, is it possible to trade
eurex futures via Ninjatrader/Rithmic or R|trader trading platform?
thank you

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 jinhar 
mumbai maharashtra/india
 
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Alan78 View Post
On Rithmic web page I see that rithmic has connection to Eurex, is it possible to trade
eurex futures via Ninjatrader/Rithmic or R|trader trading platform?
thank you

R-trader via zen fire yes .. ninjatrader/Rithmic you will need to ask with crossland or dorman because as far as i know Vision and optimus don't have eurex hope that helps..

Best Regards
Jinhar

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  #90 (permalink)
 mattz   is a Vendor
 
 
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We do not offer Eurex via Rithmic, but we do have it via CQG Trader.

Trading futures and options involves substantial risk of loss and is not suitable for all investors. Past performance is not necessarily indicative of future results. You may lose more than your initial investment. All posts are opinions and do not claim to be facts. Please conduct your own due diligence. Use only Risk capital when trading Futures.
1 800 771 6748 local 561 367 8686 email support@OptimusFutures.com
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trader0077
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Just signed up with a Rithmic Data Feed and I can confirm that it is True Bid Ask like DTN IQ Feed.

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  #92 (permalink)
Alan78
Milano
 
 
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I`m little confused, I can not find any broker for trading Eurex futures via Ninjatrader/Rithmic.
On Rithmic web page I see Rithmic has direct market access to Eurex exchanges.
thank you

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Alan78 View Post
I`m little confused, I can not find any broker for trading Eurex futures via Ninjatrader/Rithmic.
On Rithmic web page I see Rithmic has direct market access to Eurex exchanges.
thank you

Try Mirus Futures or Amp Futures.

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Alan78
Milano
 
 
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I need NinjaTrader/Rithmic not Zen-fire

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 Big Mike 
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Alan78 View Post
I need NinjaTrader/Rithmic not Zen-fire

Based on my understand and what others have said on futures.io (formerly BMT), you can do it through Crossland:

Where Speed And Service Matter | Crossland LLC Website

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 raduku 
sofia
 
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From few weeks ago , Rithmic provide a charting package for 25$/month + few cents/car . I saw some brokers offer it ( Mirus,Olympus,Optimus and maybe others ) .
Anyway , i don't saw much publicity around it .
Try it anyone ? Maybe some impressions ?

Thanks

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  #97 (permalink)
Fern
Stockholm, Sweden
 
 
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I have been using the Rithmic Pro since November, and absolutely love the platform! The data feed is unmatched.
And the platform itself, it is pleading you to place a trade. Making you feel invincible, so definitely not for the trigger happy traders. Too bad there is not much of/from/about the Rithmic on the futures.io (formerly BMT). Perhaps this will change soon

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  #98 (permalink)
Fern
Stockholm, Sweden
 
 
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the only videos that i could find on the Utube about the Rithmic Pro




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MooneyNYG
New York, NY USA
 
 
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I have been using rithmic for long time. i used esignal charting traded my futures on r-trader direct. super fast and never crashed. now that they have added charting, i can chart and trade with rithmic

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MooneyNYG
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Fern View Post
I have been using the Rithmic Pro since November, and absolutely love the platform! The data feed is unmatched.
And the platform itself, it is pleading you to place a trade. Making you feel invincible, so definitely not for the trigger happy traders. Too bad there is not much of/from/about the Rithmic on the futures.io (formerly BMT). Perhaps this will change soon

I agree. you trading stocks with rithmic too?

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