I do not think they are not linked financially in the sense having an ownership on each other... but they are certainly linked financially when it comes to customer transactions as long as you use the NT7 or XT platforms; therefore, it is merely common sense they would work together to retain and attract a common customer base that increases both their revenue streams.
$0.2 RT extra to use Ninja on Velocity TT. Because of the static DOM. But what if you don't use the static DOM in Ninja ? Too bad, you still pay the $0.2 RT EXTRA .... pffffffff, that sucks !!!
Very Good...
After a technically annoying time with Zenfire and IB, Big Mike recommended Velocity (I have also moved over to the full CQG IC, something I have been wanting to do for 5 months), I have to say the opening process the dialogue with Dale Box and their entire operation from application to first order fill has been amazing.
7 years with IB makes you happy when someone answers an email within 1 week.
Mike, thanks for the great posts on your experinces with Velocity and the demos on X-Trader.
I now start the mammouth task of moving all my code to CQG
Adam
You have to enjoy it.
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I have had an experience with Velocity where a trade over the phone was executed incorrectly (to my disadvantage).
However, I have had problems with every shop/fcm/broker I've ever been with. I recommend Velocity as my first choice to anyone looking to open a futures account. Their technology is robust, emails get replied to within an hour or so, account management (downloadable account statements, wires in - and most importantly out) have all been handled quickly and professionally.
Although I do not have experience with these services, it does apear that Velocity will also assist customers lease seats at exchanges, provide server space, FIX and DMA for those that require it. All good stuff.
With IB, I always call the trade desk by phone, I always get to talk to someone, after the ncessary wait time (less then a week ) The person at the other end of the phone is generally nasty, and thinks they are doing you a favor by picking up the phone, but at least they generally answer in my experience.
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Was just checking out of curiosity: Velocity is @ 3.60/rt for level 1 commissions on ES if you have your own NT license.
But you should pick your broker on a number of factors, naturally, I was just curious to see how the price compared.
Mike
post 46 and forward...
I spoke to @Dale Box at Velocity, and he set me straight on a few things. So it seems I was wrong, you can't just select TT FIX and use it in NT. Even if you own a lifetime license of NT, you still have to pay NT royalties which they collect and then disperse to TT. So you are paying a premium on every trade for the privilege of using NT it seems.
So that brings us up from 3.60/rt on ES to 3.80/rt on ES. I am not sure about your Deep Discount guy, what or if/how the TT patent royalties enter that equation. Maybe the feed is Zen instead of TT.
With Deep Discount, including the TT royalties for Static SuperDOM, it comes out to 3.62 R/T. If you choose to disable Static SuperDOM and just use Chart Trader with Dynamic SuperDOM, it's 3.42 R/T. Pretty competitive, I gotta say.
Ugh, too bad I just can't get Dynamic SuperDOM. Really hard to trade with that.
I am also looking to switch to another broker and am looking at Mirus, Velocity, Amp, and Advantage. From reading all of the posts here as well as on some of the other forums, I am leaning toward Velocity at the moment with X-Trader free. I use Marketdelta with IQfeed for charting, and am just looking for a more reliable DOM as well as good rates on ES, currency futures and the grains. I'm doing around 400 r/ts a month right now and increasing that to around 1000 as soon as I get my DOM squared away. That's all just for background.
My actual questions are:
- Now that you've been with Velocity for a while, are you still happy with your decision.
- I am always a little suspicious when I see rates that are almost a full $1 cheaper than similar competitors. Is there anything to worry about here?
- I am still evaluating the X-trader vs Ninja/TT decisions and am curious on your opinion of how much of a difference that really makes live? I realize this question might be hard to address but I haven't had a chance to demo either yet but noticed the substantial difference in price.
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1) Yes, I am very happy.
2) I am not worried. Call up Dale Box or exchange some emails with him and you can be the judge of if you feel comfortable with Velocity or not.
3) I stopped using X_Trader and started using Sierra Chart for DOM, and in both cases MultiCharts for charting. X_Trader is great but quite complex. I was checking out SC in general, just to stay up to date with platforms, and I really liked it and ended up switching to it for my DOM. If you are asking about live vs sim feed, yes there are major differences - the TT sim feed is much slower than a live feed.
Thanks Mike. I appreciate the info. My third question up there was just what you thought of X-Trader vs Ninja as a front end through Velocity but it sounds like it's a mute point since you've moved to Sierra Charts. Thanks again for the quick reply. I've enjoyed reading through the forum material.
Hello cleon, I still work on X-trader it's the best DOM out there and works so nice with the TT datafeed. If you do up to a 1000 trades a month you are cheaper off with a cheaper broker than Velocity and pay for the X-trader license ($675 monthly)
Just wanted to post that I have been quite happy with Velocity overall, and the only connection problems I have had are, I suspect, my own internet connectivity issues.
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I had an account with Velocity Futures. I had a question about an order and asked for the Time and Sales. I was told that I could not get that information. That was a red flag!! So I called the CME and they sent me the Time and Sales for the trade. Later that day, Velocity closed my account. Why would a broker close an account that was with them almost a year and had over $40K in it just because I asked for Time and Sales??? What are they hiding??? I never had a margin call, I don't hold overnight positions, and I risk less than 2% of my account. Be very very careful!
Your opinion may not have much weight, as you just signed up for your futures.io (formerly BMT) account, and you've only made this one defamatory post. Who did you speak with at Velocity?
could you please share more information because a lot of guys here are with velocity?
i myself have been trading with them for over a year and i think they are great.
the commissions are very low and the customer service department are really good.
wheneveer i needed them they were in handy.
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They wouldn't, would be the most logical answer.... which means there is more to your story than you are letting on, it would seem.
As far as I can remember, this is the first time anyone has ever said anything negative like this about Velocity. So if you had a bad experience with them, then just move on elsewhere and maybe take a closer look at whatever else you did during this "event" that may have caused them to close your account.
Glad to hear that no one else has voiced a concern like this about Velocity. I tried to get a further explanation from them but I was not given one. In almost 5 years of trading I have never seen anything like that before. I have accounts with other brokers and have never had that happen. I just wanted to get feedback and warn others.
my 2 cents, if you truly want to help others, ignore @Big Mike's advice and please show/document how the case took place if you are able to... what you are stating is somewhat serious.. and yes, an FCM does have the ability and right to close your account if they so desire.. people should read the fine print of what they sign when it comes to agreements.. but it is not something that is normally done, so for it to be done to you, as Mike says, something is amiss.. and please document if you can..
While not having the time to address every inaccuracy in these posts, I will simply say that Velocity Futures does not close accounts because a client asks us to investigate an exchange’s handling of an order. We do this kind of investigation all the time and are happy to do so.
However, Velocity has been forced on rare occasions to close the account of a client that is unreasonable, abusive or who makes baseless accusations against Velocity or its staff. This is especially true when a clear and accurate explanation of a questioned trade has already been provided by the exchange and relayed to the client by Velocity’s support desk and the client persists in the offensive conduct.
If you have any questions about our services at Velocity Futures please send me a private message.
Not sure they best way to handle this post, new to the site. I am quoting a post from the deepdiscount thread by @Dale Box, but regarding Velocity Futures (who it appears he represents).
So the prices listed on your website are 50 cents less than presented with CQGTrader after 740 r/ts?
we have asked a few times already, but here it goes again.. and thanks for responding in advance.
from CQG the fee they charge to FCM's for CQG Trader is $25 per month, plus transaction fees(0.50c RT) until it hits $395, and then the platform fees stop.
assuming a customer trades 2000 contracts per month, and that his/her all in cost RT is $4.02 as per your website for CQG Trader..
simple question...
once the customer hits 740 contracts, does your $4.02 cost drops by 0.50c to $3.52 RT per contract, or does it remain at $4.02 per contract?
that is the essence of the debate.. ther other times I have asked, or others have asked via.. it hasnt been answered.
question to @Dale Box... or any of the velocity guys that frequent here...
I was having an argument with a buddy of mine a little while ago when we were discussing accounts setups and why split across multiple FCM's... we were comparing FCM stability and all that... I shared that my backup account was with Velocity and he laughed and asked what I was doing with a non self-clearing broker.. I argued WTF he was talking about and he just said research it, which I did..
I came to find out that Velocity is not a clearing Firm with the CME, and I could not find evidence to being one with ICE (but then again I havent researched it in dept as it has only been 20 minutes)... which then brought me to researching who you cleared through if you were only NFA registered, and I came to find out it was Clear Chicago Group from what it appeared, which is the same as you given it was started by the same guy.. but I still could not find you as a clearing firm with FCM under that name @ the CME, even though you have their logo on the CCG site..
so my question is... who do you clear through? given that if you are not self clearing, that implies that you clear via someone else... curious to know.. I figure I save some time researching and just ask.
As I saw sysot1t mention in another thread, you account management is much better than deep discount trading. I may not mind paying 10-20 cents a r/t for that... but 60-70 cents is another matter.
Can you confirm what he asked above, in simple terms; i.e a "yes" or "no".
I am curious why it matters who they clear through? If an FCM has a 'clearing' issue then it is between those they have the agreement with. Themselves and would do little with us. Any issues through the FCM and the Clearing House would be still brought up through the FCM and be documented as such.
I am curious why it matters, not as a challenge, but as my understanding as it seems it "SHOULD" not matter from what I have been exposed to.
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think of a non-clearing FCM as a middle man, no different than another introducing broker, but with slightly different regulation and requirements (well, not so slightly, but you get the point)..
you dont clarify what you mean by "issues", but to me the only (and main issue) is what happens in the case of the failure of the FCM.. which is why those with large accounts (in the millions) would normally split across two FCM's... in the event the FCM doesnt have enough resources to handle the bk of the clearing that held customer funds..
as such, I rather know who the other clearing FCM is and then make my decision based on complete information as to the financial stability of the FCM that I am doing business with...
I had to look through my links when I was educating myself a while back about FCMs, their function, operations, etc. to find this CFTC letter... but it explains it best..
anyhow, as I said... i am merely curious... if my account was bigger, I would have just gone ahead and moved it to another clearing fcm and not bother asking the question... my main account today is with crossland and as such there is no additional middle man as they are a clearing fcm with full cme membership... once my account approaches the size I care to have in it, i will just split it across crossland and mbfcc and close my velocity backup.. but I am quite far from that event.. so in the mean time, I am ok with things...
let's see if they answer in any event.. somehow i have a feeling that they wont.. but I would like to be wrong.
keep in mind that it can be "unlikely" due to the whole segreation, but then again.. one never knows.. risk is risk.. no matter what anyone says... funds are not insured.. merely separate from the operations accounts, but they are still comingled with customer classes...
please provide more details.. when I reached out to them I probe briefly and wasnt all that concerned, but I wouldnt mind knowing another point of view. I am going to create a separate thread to discuss MBF, that way we dont take away from this one.
I guess Velocity Futures is not interested on answering the question... as I said before, we have asked and not gotten an answer... cant get any simpler than this... even matt from Optimus has answered this question, but Velocity is yet to provide a clear reply...
so a rebate will be issued for any and all contracts that are traded above the required number for any CQG Trader users..
which would mean, for a customer trading 2000RT, once it surpases the 740RT cap, you will rebate 1260 x $0.50 = $630 back to his/her account.. or $0.50 for the platform fee per RT above 740RT...
not sure to whom you were addressing the response.. but to my question above, who is clearing for you then? because that I know of, you still need to deposit funds with them, right? but regardless of that... who are you using to clear... thanks in advance.
Your funds are deposited with us, not the other FCMs. We have relationships with several clearing FCMs, primarily New Edge and ABN Amro. Please feel free to contact us if you have further questions.
If you have any questions about our services at Velocity Futures please send me a private message.
I love your daily comparison's between traders. That is really nice and thanks for allowing others to show the leaderboard. I think that is inspirational and good for everyone to see where traders 'lie'. haha..
One thing that I think would be cool is to add sharpe ratio for the traders and allow them to pick up clients if they are CTA etc.. Might not be a bad idea as I have seen other forex brokers do that internationally.
Just an idea for your clients to grow if they leverage funds etc..
I was messing around with the site today and I noticed the following... credit is due where credit is deserved... I have to give it to Velocity for listening to their customers, even those that are critical of them (which is not because i dislike them since i am a customer still after all)...
we now can choose more advanced options with CQG, and also, we can get API data!!! which is awesome.. I have to check to see how far history will go back, but this is certainly awesome, and they are the first ones that are doing bundling of that kind..
so my hat off to @Dale Box, @bobk and the rest of the sales team for being creative..
now, why not get CQGIC bundled in like XTrader? that would be the next step of awesomeness... you can even ask for $25K min account, more than what you ask for XTrader (which is $10K)...
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If I recall correctly from the last CQG webinar on futures.io (formerly BMT), all CQG orders are server side. That means they are at the Exchange where possible, and otherwise at the gateway or CQG servers -- and never solely on the client.
Velocity or can confirm, or perhaps CQG's @yshterk.
native orders are with the exchange, synths are with CQG... that is my understanding as well.. but CQG is co-located, so it might as well be on the exchange..
that is exactly what I was thinking... which is why I am rushing to test it.. ...I am opening another account to see what it is like... will let you know what I find out as I make the time to play with it.. on details were really on the website, the other option is to get an explanation from the reps on the forum...
FYI: CQG Trader API != CQG API. I'm not sure precisely how they differ, but they are not the same. This may or may not impact those MATLAB plans, depending on what is left out in the CQG Trader API when compared to the CQG API.
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Hey all, I only traded w/ NT LIVE for a short while (3 months) over 1.5 years ago, so most of my exp. is with TradeStation and ATC Trader (Open E Cry platform).
So... Just to be clear.
If I have my typical entry and I enter say 1 contract LONG, then my stop and TP will continue onward even if I get disconnected OR shut down my computer?
Just checkin as that is new to me, so sorry if that is a dumb question.
your profile shows AMP/CQG... which is only via NT7... so why not enter an order and let us know how it goes? other than that, with CQGT/IC that is what it means..
Yes, that is what I am switching over to. Haven't finished setting up the account. Still testing the datafeed etc.. I figured you guys would know more quickly. Thanks.
just put a limit or sell/buy stop far away from the current market on ES ... close NT7... then restart and see if they are still there... that will show you..
I dont use NT7, so I cant answer it.... but I did mentioned already that CQGT/IC do..
It is a bit too late but as a final confirmation - yes, OCO, Trailings and DomTriggerred orders are all server side with CQG. And, as was mentiond before, CQG servers are all colocated next to the appropriate exchanges.
The same goes to the Spreading and Aggregation functions, they all are server side. But Spreader and Aggregation only available with CQG Integrated Client.
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CQGT API will provide access to real time data and trading functionality. There is no historical data available via this API, just like there are no charts in CQGTrader.
CQG IC API provides access to real time, trading and historical. You have access to as much history as your CQG IC has access to (so, in largest case it will be over 11 years of tick data and 50+ years of daily bars). You also have access to CQG studies, conditions and Trading Systems.
We also had built an adapter from CQG IC API into MatLab, so if Matlab is your final destination you already have code you can use to get real time and historical data flowing into Matlab and some samples to accept trading signals from there.
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so from what you are saying, CQGT API wont tie into MatLab... or are you saying the adapter today for MatLab exists only on CQGIC and it would require mods?
CQGTrader API and CQG IC API use exactly the same data model, so if you develop software for one it will work for another as long as it uses functionality supported. That means that as long as you limit your usage of MatLab to real time data import into Matlab and trade signals out of Matlab our samples will work fine.
Usually people pay high price for Matlab because they want to have a way to play with historical data and monitor correlations and statistical models, that is why CQG is positioning Integrated Client as more acceptable product here. But CQGTrader should work as well.
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@yshterk I am about to open another futures account. I have wondered about this from day 1. Maybe my question is better answered by reading the brokers financial statement. My question is: what do you brokers do with our excess money that is in our accounts? I am sure that the use of our money is considered in the commissions and fees. I guess their is no fiduciary relationship between the broker and the customer. But what to you do with it? Where is it really located? Does our money circle the globe at night strengthening the reserves on paper for these zombie banks? Or what? Thanks Tiberius
Great questions, bad person to ask Since CQG is not a broker but rather technology provider we know nothing about brokers and their fees, where they keep accounts and what they do with excess capital. You maybe better off to address this question to your broker, I am sure they will be happy to share the details with you!
Sorry I cant be any more helpful.
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Thank you @bobk for your answer. I probably would get my answer from account docs. My funds at Velocity are segregated from Velocity and are in a financial institution so to have a high level of trust with the customer. So my additional question is: what is the financial institution doing with these funds? I believe the financial institution should leave the funds as cash and use them as part of their required reserves while sweeping funds to and fro with Velocity. But since financial institutions no longer have any credibility nor the federal regulators; it is difficult to accept that a financial institution leaves funds idle. If the funds are used to beef up reserves, that gives them opportunity to be reckless with the freed funds. I guess the bottom line is to bite the bullet and make sure you have the best broker you can find.
I'm not really sure what to tell you, if you have lost all faith in the system. The finical institutions to which you are referring are the banks and the banking system itself. They are going to do what they have been doing forever, use your money to make money. As far as your FCM, I'll just reiterate that Velocity is one of the only FCM's today that does not engage in any business other than the processing of trades for Futures and Commodity Customers. We have no proprietary trading, no customer trading authorization, no exposure to mortgage backed securities, and no exposure to European debt.
If you have any questions about our services at Velocity Futures please send me a private message.
Late to the party here. I recently discovered that IB no longer sweeps cash from futures contracts sales into an SPIC insured cash 'area'; it is left as 'commodities', therefore leaving it uninsured. Supposedly, they are working on an alternative sweep but the way it was implemented -- unannounced and not officially addressed -- makes me 'nervous.'
With Velocity, does the cash swept from futures contracts sales go solely into FDIC insured bank(s)? Or?
I just noticed they added a maintenance fee on their website. They should at least send an email. If they go bankrupt like MF, they could just change their withdrawal fee to everything in your account if they wanted to.
Does this seem strange or do all brokers do this?
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You receive daily electronic statements which send you to your login. I had a month of seeing that I would be charged the maintenance fee before it was ever applicable.
I think you might be reading a bit too much into it.
After 3 Years of dealing with MT4 Broker bucketshops and Interactive brokers horrible execution i will be moving to Velocityfutures and my client accounts there starting april/may. This thread has been tremendously helpful in making my decision to switch to Velocity and i just wanted to state my appreciation.
Will write a detailed experience with velocity once i have performed the switch.
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I had a nasty experience with Velocity, which at the time of writing is still unresolved. I placed a buy limit at 1336.25 on Sep ES this morning. When the order was placed I got an error in the Trade Service Log:
I then tried to cancel the order and got this message:
I tried again and again on my platform. I call Velocity at 9am UK time and they did not answer for 5 minutes. I then got a voicemail message, some beeping and the call disconnected. On my platform I had conflicting information as to what my position is. See screenshot:
I called Velocity a further three times and got the same experience. At this time my bid level is being traded in the market and I don't want to be filled so I just have to sit here and panic. I then send an email to operations. I phone them again. No answer. I email operations again. No response. Online chat is not working either. It seems there simply is NO-ONE there! Unbelievable.
I am still sat here wondering if I've been filled at 1336.25 with the market having gone six handles against me and my broker cannot help me.
If anyone knows of a good, reasonably priced broker with good service that offers Sierra Chart please let me know. This level of service from Velocity is totally unacceptable. I know I am in the European morning, but they offer Eurex products and Globex is open anyway, so they should support it and I'm getting ZERO support.
I think I may know what the issue is. Notice in the top left the symbol name is ESU2. This is because I was connected to the SC Historical Intraday service at the weekend because TT feed was down at the weekend. Fair enough. I configured my Chart Settings like this:
I'm wondering if the ESU2 is causing the order server to reject my message even though I have ES-201209-CME configured as well. I may never know because Velocity are not contactable. I disconnected from TT removed the ESU2 symbol and then connected again and it says I have no open orders. My portal says no open orders either but I don't know if I can trust any of it.
I have now seen a setup on the ES that I want to take but I don't trust the platform or my broker to place the order. This is an opportunity cost that I am not happy about. Very upset and frustrated.
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sorry to hear about that keymoo, but for a business level reject I would intuitively expect no order being placed at all...but then not an expert on the setup, contact them to verify further.
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I am 99% confident an order wasn't placed but I wanted to contact them to be sure. The more worrying problem is the complete lack of support during the European morning. This is now my major concern. I still cannot contact them 2 hours later... I am lost for words, frankly.
Yes they were my first choice, however their data is filtered (and slow to backfill) and the commissions are higher. Look how many candles are on their 2000 tick chart compared to TT:
Infinity (TransAct feed)
Velocity (TT feed)
I use tick charts so an unfiltered data feed is important to me. I have been speaking with Patrick extensively about this and he is looking into it, but no solution as yet...
For example on 14th June 2012, Sep ES had 197 candles with TransAct feed, but with the TT feed there were 254 candles, so that's (254-196)*2000 = 118,000 less ticks. A pretty substantial number (22% less). I had no idea finding a decent broker that meets my requirements would be so difficult.
BTW, it is now 4 hours since my difficulty in finding out whether my order was placed or not and I still have not received a response from Velocity. Has anyone else experienced this level of "service"?
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If backfill is important, then just get IQFeed. You can get special discounts thru futures.io (formerly BMT) Elite Member program and CME exchange fee waiver, its a no brainer.
) The person at the other end of the phone is generally nasty, and thinks they are doing you a favor by picking up the phone, but at least they generally answer in my experience.
