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"Free" platforms/datafeeds OEC, TA, TOS.


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"Free" platforms/datafeeds OEC, TA, TOS.

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  #1 (permalink)
upsolow
Riverside, CA
 
 
Posts: 21 since Feb 2015
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I want to daytrade/scalp ES or NQ at the market open (first half hour).

Should I go with Open E Cry (OEC) or TransactAT (TA)? Both are free but I noticed the demo for OEC is really laggy at open. Looking for feedback from "live" account holders and how OEC and TA react at the market open (6:30am-7:00am PST)? TA wasn't that bad and TOS was also laggy (I have a live account with TOS - will not use for futures).

Your feedback is greatly appreciated, my original post was too wordy. Thanks!

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  #3 (permalink)
 bourgeois pig 
asheville north carolina USA
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: ATC trader (OEC white label)
Broker: ATC
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upsolow View Post
I want to daytrade/scalp ES or NQ at the market open (first half hour).

Should I go with Open E Cry (OEC) or TransactAT (TA)? Both are free but I noticed the demo for OEC is really laggy at open. Looking for feedback from "live" account holders and how OEC and TA react at the market open (6:30am-7:00am PST)? TA wasn't that bad and TOS was also laggy (I have a live account with TOS - will not use for futures).

Your feedback is greatly appreciated, my original post was too wordy. Thanks!

I can't tell you who to "go with" but I can tell you my experiences with my platform (OEC WHITE LABEL thru ATC Brokers).
1. My charts lag my DOM during really fast moving markets. Spoke with my broker abou this and he said that is to be expected during hi volume times with most data feeds. My quest to find out the particulars, I called NINJA Brokerage and they told me that during fast moving markets that even their customers have experienced latency. Ninja asked what sort of connection I had and was I wi FI or line in. At the time I was WI FI but very close to the router. I checked my speed and found that is wa the same (LINE IN n WIFI). Never the less I plugged line in and have stayed that way in an attempt to minimize latency. As a note, I still get chart lag. The few times that I have noticed a considerable lag were during the micro crash 10/13/14, FED meetings, and the occaisional NFPR.

ATC told me that the DOM would be the "more accurate" to pay attention to during these instances of latency. Also as a note, I was told that the morecharts one had running, the moreof a chance for lag. Also I trade on a laptop with 4GB RAM and I can only assume that with low memory that the charts i have running the more signals have a chance to lag.

As far as the latency differences between platforms:
I noticed when simming NINJA, that their DOM seemed to be split seconds quicker than my OEC. I put the 2 DOMS next to each other and it seemed that the NINJA DOM would climb the rungs a bit quicker. Really hard to tell the difference though. I called NINJA again and the REP i spoke to said that the Data provider made all of the difference in the world.

Since then i have talked with OPTIMUS Futures ( who has a thread on this forum) Said that Data feed is everything and that his company offered RITHMIC and that the data was "unthrottled"or "unfiltered. SOoo apparently some feeds exclude data for a smoother display.... or something....Not sure still trying to figure it all out.

Then I talked to Peter Davies who has a thread on this forum and several webinars and a company,"JIGSAW" and he said that OEC data is fine and actually works harmoniosly with his JIGSAW TOOLS (which are basically enhanced DOM's which can be very beneficial to scalpers and traders looking for precise entry points. I figure if OEC is OK with an experienced order flow trader then it should be OK for me.

I recently won a IQ feed which I plan to inititate next week. My prize was a year of their basic service. I believe that a yearly cost a grand or more so I am assuming that it is superior to free feeds. I am about to find out. i wil be sure to posts about my observations and realizations with IQ data feed.

To sum it all up.
1. People are trying to sell us this stuff so of course we are going to hear things that make us want what they are offering. No disrespect to sales as in most cases they do know the intricate side of what they are selling.
2. As traders we have to know that our equipment is powerful enough to facilitate our setup (numerous charts) and that our internet connection is strong and sustained.
3. If you are gunslinging and want to scalp then you should consider paying for a feed that is tried and true. It seems like a little latency could really bite in to ones bottom line when looking for the precise entries needed to scalp effectivley.
4. Call Optimus, Ninja, Cannon, Stage 5, and ask them questions about the feeds. Also you can post questions on their threads on this forum. Peter at JIGSAW was very receptive and quick to reply by email when I was trying to diffuse my confusion.
5.I do feel your pain. Latency could relly screw up a market entry during volatile moments.

I woud be curious to hear what you discover while scouting feeds.

"Napoleans severest comment on his beaten enemies - that they "saw to many things at once""- Hart
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  #4 (permalink)
 tturner86 
Portland, Oregon
 
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upsolow View Post
I want to daytrade/scalp ES or NQ at the market open (first half hour).

Should I go with Open E Cry (OEC) or TransactAT (TA)? Both are free but I noticed the demo for OEC is really laggy at open. Looking for feedback from "live" account holders and how OEC and TA react at the market open (6:30am-7:00am PST)? TA wasn't that bad and TOS was also laggy (I have a live account with TOS - will not use for futures).

Your feedback is greatly appreciated, my original post was too wordy. Thanks!

I have tried TA and it was a joke, I would choose OEC.

Personally I use Ninja and OEC. If you want good data and a good platform, it will cost some money. But for me OEC is as good as it gets for a free platform.

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  #5 (permalink)
upsolow
Riverside, CA
 
 
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Thank you y'all. Very grateful for the valuable feedback.

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  #6 (permalink)
 bourgeois pig 
asheville north carolina USA
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: ATC trader (OEC white label)
Broker: ATC
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upsolow View Post
Thank you y'all. Very grateful for the valuable feedback.

I wish I could be of more help. I am trying to figure the feed out. Turner has experience and if says that OEC has the best free data i would value his assessment as well as Peter Davies aka Dionysus Toast. I f you are interested in scalping i would watch his webinars here or on BIG MIKE's You Tube channell and visit the JIGSAW website. Also for aspiring scalpers i would recommend John Grady webinars or his website NO BS DAYTRADING. Also FUTURE TRADER 71 has some good stuff.

When I first began this trading journey I envisioned myself as a scalper. I was actually quite good at it in SIM but got chopped up more often than not in real time. The emotions and slippage make a difference. Latley I have been trying to catch the bigger moves but find that you really have to give a trade room to work (deep stop) to catch the big ones. That being said every trade is different and adjustments have to be made. I recently turned off the tick stream (the tape) and it helped to relax me a bit. Watching the tape zoom by was exhilirating but distracting as well. One day I will try to revisit scalp mode. But for now i need to simplify things so as not to die by death by a thousand papercuts.

If you discover any new info regarding feeds I would like to hear and I'll let you know about IQ once i have it up and running.

"Napoleans severest comment on his beaten enemies - that they "saw to many things at once""- Hart
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  #7 (permalink)
upsolow
Riverside, CA
 
 
Posts: 21 since Feb 2015
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bourgeois pig View Post
I wish I could be of more help. I am trying to figure the feed out. Turner has experience and if says that OEC has the best free data i would value his assessment as well as Peter Davies aka Dionysus Toast. I f you are interested in scalping i would watch his webinars here or on BIG MIKE's You Tube channell and visit the JIGSAW website. Also for aspiring scalpers i would recommend John Grady webinars or his website NO BS DAYTRADING. Also FUTURE TRADER 71 has some good stuff.

When I first began this trading journey I envisioned myself as a scalper. I was actually quite good at it in SIM but got chopped up more often than not in real time. The emotions and slippage make a difference. Latley I have been trying to catch the bigger moves but find that you really have to give a trade room to work (deep stop) to catch the big ones. That being said every trade is different and adjustments have to be made. I recently turned off the tick stream (the tape) and it helped to relax me a bit. Watching the tape zoom by was exhilirating but distracting as well. One day I will try to revisit scalp mode. But for now i need to simplify things so as not to die by death by a thousand papercuts.

If you discover any new info regarding feeds I would like to hear and I'll let you know about IQ once i have it up and running.

Thanks, I will definitely share my findings. So far, I'm really leaning toward an OEC provider and had narrowed down to Cannon Trading, Apex Futures, and Stage 5. I'm really liking and leaning most towards Stage 5 (though Apex is close second) due to the many support videos available. As for the speed/lag issues I spoke with someone at FuturesOnline/OEC that confirmed with me that the "demo" version could be slower when resources are needed server side to support volatile times - in essence my understanding is the resources (does this mean RAM or bandwidth? regardless) are more heavily supporting the live platform in those times (which may cripple the demo environment). Also, with the 2 of you's feedback on the live platform have rare issues I'm definitely sold on OEC (plus it's way prettier then TA). Just which white labeled version to go with is my question (leaning toward Stage 5). Thanks again for your wonderful insights my friends!

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  #8 (permalink)
 tturner86 
Portland, Oregon
 
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upsolow View Post
Thanks, I will definitely share my findings. So far, I'm really leaning toward an OEC provider and had narrowed down to Cannon Trading, Apex Futures, and Stage 5. I'm really liking and leaning most towards Stage 5 (though Apex is close second) due to the many support videos available. As for the speed/lag issues I spoke with someone at FuturesOnline/OEC that confirmed with me that the "demo" version could be slower when resources are needed server side to support volatile times - in essence my understanding is the resources (does this mean RAM or bandwidth? regardless) are more heavily supporting the live platform in those times (which may cripple the demo environment). Also, with the 2 of you's feedback on the live platform have rare issues I'm definitely sold on OEC (plus it's way prettier then TA). Just which white labeled version to go with is my question (leaning toward Stage 5). Thanks again for your wonderful insights my friends!

I personally recommend Cannon, as their support has been amazing. But Stage 5 is a close second, the only reason I did not go with them was I do not like who they have to clear through to use Ninja (Global Futures). But all of the guys at Stage 5 and Cannon get 2 thumbs up from me!

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  #9 (permalink)
 fourtiwinks 
Singapore
 
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tturner86 View Post
I have tried TA and it was a joke, I would choose OEC...

Hi @tturner86, care to elaborate why you felt TA was a joke?

I asked this as Sierra Chart works closely with them, very closely I think.

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  #10 (permalink)
upsolow
Riverside, CA
 
 
Posts: 21 since Feb 2015
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Awesome, love this feedback, thanks again.

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  #11 (permalink)
upsolow
Riverside, CA
 
 
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fourtiwinks View Post
Hi @tturner86, care to elaborate why you felt TA was a joke?

I know you were asking turner, but my response in all fairness, TA isn't bad, JMHO. My experience with the demo (I was told by Infinity Futures rep should be identical to live) was a really good feed. I really had to work with the free charts (SC) though to customize to my liking. OEC looks much more aesthetically appealing. For me, since OEC and TA seem to equal in feeds (from my understanding), I have to go with the better looking GUI - OEC.

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  #12 (permalink)
 tturner86 
Portland, Oregon
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Trading: GBU-39
 
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fourtiwinks View Post
Hi @tturner86, care to elaborate why you felt TA was a joke?

I asked this as Sierra Chart works closely with them, very closely I think.


upsolow View Post
I know you were asking turner, but my response in all fairness, TA isn't bad, JMHO. My experience with the demo (I was told by Infinity Futures rep should be identical to live) was a really good feed. I really had to work with the free charts (SC) though to customize to my liking. OEC looks much more aesthetically appealing. For me, since OEC and TA seem to equal in feeds (from my understanding), I have to go with the better looking GUI - OEC.

I was referring to the platform itself not the feed. It was bulky and clumsy and didn't have internal reports. This was my experience with the demo two years ago. It lacked a lot of what should be basic features.

One thing I do like about OEC is they have the iBroker app, this works on my iPad and makes managing trades easier. It also allows me to set price alerts that I can get at any time.

A lot of this is gonna be personal preference. Test em all out and see what you like.

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  #13 (permalink)
upsolow
Riverside, CA
 
 
Posts: 21 since Feb 2015
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fourtiwinks View Post
Hi @tturner86, care to elaborate why you felt TA was a joke?

I asked this as Sierra Chart works closely with them, very closely I think.

Again, I know you weren't asking me but my experience with Sierra Charts, learning how to get the same indicators/features/tools/drawings configured as compared to the free charting services working with the OEC platform was very difficult (more so time consuming) on the Sierra Charts (via TA). Via OEC most of it was a really simple navigation and minor tweaking but with SC it took me 3 times as long to find out how and then configure - though ultimately I did find everything I needed and got the SC charts configured how I wanted them.

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upsolow
Riverside, CA
 
 
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tturner86 View Post
I was referring to the platform itself not the feed. It was bulky and clumsy and didn't have internal reports. This was my experience with the demo two years ago. It lacked a lot of what should be basic features.

One thing I do like about OEC is they have the iBroker app, this works on my iPad and makes managing trades easier. It also allows me to set price alerts that I can get at any time.

A lot of this is gonna be personal preference. Test em all out and see what you like.

Oh, yes, I completely agree about being grateful to have the iBroker app. It serves as a good backup/fail safe plan if your desktop goes out as well.

I didn't see a mobile option for TA.

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 fourtiwinks 
Singapore
 
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Thanks very much for your response, tturner86!

@upsolow, glad that you find SC easier to use with OEC. I'm using TA with SC through Infinity Futures and I have no problem with either, after overcoming a steep learning curve at the beginning. But tturner86 is right in that TA's AT platform leaves much to be desired if you are an advanced trader.

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  #16 (permalink)
upsolow
Riverside, CA
 
 
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fourtiwinks View Post
Thanks very much for your response, tturner86!

@upsolow, glad that you find SC easier to use with OEC. I'm using TA with SC through Infinity Futures and I have no problem with either, after overcoming a steep learning curve at the beginning. But tturner86 is right in that TA's AT platform leaves much to be desired if you are an advanced trader.

Oh, duh, my misunderstanding, didn't realize OEC charts were a version of SC as well. Yes, though, matter of preferences for us all. Best wishes, happy trading!

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  #17 (permalink)
 KelvinKing 
Johor Bahru, Malaysia
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: NinjaTrader Brokerage, Continuum
Trading: FESX, FGBL
 
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upsolow View Post
I want to daytrade/scalp ES or NQ at the market open (first half hour).

Should I go with Open E Cry (OEC) or TransactAT (TA)? Both are free but I noticed the demo for OEC is really laggy at open. Looking for feedback from "live" account holders and how OEC and TA react at the market open (6:30am-7:00am PST)? TA wasn't that bad and TOS was also laggy (I have a live account with TOS - will not use for futures).

Your feedback is greatly appreciated, my original post was too wordy. Thanks!

Hi,

I think if you want to really scalp these markets, being able to read the DOM is really important.

Having said that, I wouldn't want to skimp on the quality of the L2 data....

Best advice is to with with a good quality data feed like the others have mentioned IQFeed or Kinetick.

Personally, I using Kinetick, which I feel is a reasonable price if you subscribe with their (NON-pro fees option). So basically I pay $55 for basic service + $20 for L2 + $15 for all the 4 futures exchanges (CME Globex, CBOT COMEX NYMEX), so total is $90. Which I think is very ok....

I think, you should approach your data feed the same way a salesman or property agent approach their mobile Phone plan... You can't do business from a public phone or from a friends house. You need a good, decent mobile plan to conduct all your meetings and business calls....

Of think about it this way, maybe on one of the weekend you see one less movie and eat at home to save the $90.

I just don't think a solid data provide is something you want to save on if you want to be scalping these markets.
If you swing trading, of course, is a different story. Just use Yahoo or whatever... doesn't matter.

Cheers!

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  #18 (permalink)
upsolow
Riverside, CA
 
 
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KelvinKing View Post
Hi,

I think if you want to really scalp these markets, being able to read the DOM is really important.

Having said that, I wouldn't want to skimp on the quality of the L2 data....

Best advice is to with with a good quality data feed like the others have mentioned IQFeed or Kinetick.

Personally, I using Kinetick, which I feel is a reasonable price if you subscribe with their (NON-pro fees option). So basically I pay $55 for basic service + $20 for L2 + $15 for all the 4 futures exchanges (CME Globex, CBOT COMEX NYMEX), so total is $90. Which I think is very ok....

I think, you should approach your data feed the same way a salesman or property agent approach their mobile Phone plan... You can't do business from a public phone or from a friends house. You need a good, decent mobile plan to conduct all your meetings and business calls....

Of think about it this way, maybe on one of the weekend you see one less movie and eat at home to save the $90.

I just don't think a solid data provide is something you want to save on if you want to be scalping these markets.
If you swing trading, of course, is a different story. Just use Yahoo or whatever... doesn't matter.

Cheers!

Thanks I really appreciate your feed back. I agree, I guess my definition of scalping is a little off (or it is generally open for interpretation). I like "scalping," for 4-10 ticks, the open on occasion in the direction of the big bars but I will mostly "long-term scalp" (lol, just made that up) or daytrade with my sup/res lines I use looking for about 2-3 points (8-12 ticks for NQ). Thanks again for your insight.

Also, for what it is worth, I am really impressed with Stage 5. Great customer service and they extended my demo to 4 weeks which has really helped me in assess not only the software/platform but also my strategy - which I am grateful for. I really loved the responsiveness of the DOM - which was the most critical for me initial but also love the chart trading and have altered my strategy to incorporate limit orders at key sup/res lines. Anyhow, point being it's because of how much I am able to quickly comprehend and utilize the platform that I am happy with their service and my strategy evaluations. So, I'm most definitely will fund my Stage 5 demo to a full account. Their trade analyzer is great but I find that I their platform and service is good enough alone without my use of it (I don't really find myself using it but it is impressive). Thanks!

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  #19 (permalink)
 KelvinKing 
Johor Bahru, Malaysia
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: NinjaTrader Brokerage, Continuum
Trading: FESX, FGBL
 
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upsolow View Post
Thanks I really appreciate your feed back. I agree, I guess my definition of scalping is a little off (or it is generally open for interpretation). I like "scalping," for 4-10 ticks, the open on occasion in the direction of the big bars but I will mostly "long-term scalp" (lol, just made that up) or daytrade with my sup/res lines I use looking for about 2-3 points (8-12 ticks for NQ). Thanks again for your insight.

Also, for what it is worth, I am really impressed with Stage 5. Great customer service and they extended my demo to 4 weeks which has really helped me in assess not only the software/platform but also my strategy - which I am grateful for. I really loved the responsiveness of the DOM - which was the most critical for me initial but also love the chart trading and have altered my strategy to incorporate limit orders at key sup/res lines. Anyhow, point being it's because of how much I am able to quickly comprehend and utilize the platform that I am happy with their service and my strategy evaluations. So, I'm most definitely will fund my Stage 5 demo to a full account. Their trade analyzer is great but I find that I their platform and service is good enough alone without my use of it (I don't really find myself using it but it is impressive). Thanks!

Stage 5 has a pretty decent data feed. I talked to Anthony before and he said they were on Rythmic, which for the most part, should all you to see what you need to see on the DOM.

I've not used their actual platform itself, so I cannot comment on their DOM. But I would suggest that you compare it to the JigSaw DOM just to get an idea of what you might be missing.

One little issue that I have is that, while FT71 (the main trader at Stage 5) claims to be running somewhat of a prop firm, you'll not likely get a chance to see how the other traders are trading. Also, for some reason, I don't know why, but FT71 downplays the need to read the DOM, although he himself admits to using the DOM every time he enters a trade. He's a very strong advocate of volume profile, and that seems to be the way he's positioning himself. All he's Webinars and YouTube videos all talk about volume profile only. To me it feels a little weird, I don't follow him anymore for that reason.

I think scalping the DOM is something that is so specialized, that it's not enough to just have a good data feed and stare at the DOM all day. Maybe, eventually you'll get it.... but to me I'd rather cut short my learning process and learn from someone who has been doing it successfully. Stage 5 will not offer you this opportunity to learn in my opinion. So on top of Stage5, you're going to need to find someone else to learn tape reading from.

Best of luck in ur search.

Cheers!

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  #20 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
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You've made some mistakes about FT71. I've hosted countless webinars and therefore present for every word of them on futures.io (formerly BMT). Any mention of prop firms has been discussing his past, before he became FT71 and before the brokerage.

As for DOM etc you've misunderstood him.

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  #21 (permalink)
 TickedOff 
Sydney, NSW, Australia
 
Experience: Intermediate
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OEC for sure because of their superior DOM, its very much like the one from xtrader. I am experimenting with pure orderflow scalping using the jigsaw add-on for ninjatrader, I dont think I'd be able to have any success at all without being able to see the prints. As for learning to tape read from someone else, just look at the videos on orderflow on the jigsaw channel on youtube by Peter Davies, its important to get a solid understanding of the fundamentals but apart form that noone can "teach you" and it absolutely is about just sitting there, watching the DOM and getting screen time.

Understanding yourself is just as important as understanding markets.
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OEC + Sierra - starts at about $27 a month for platform & data - plus it's a REALLY popular platform right now.

OEC Charts aren't bad for the basics but for more, Sierra seems to have it all. Obviously the more you get the more it costs.

OEC did some stuff a while ago with their data that means matching trades against the bid/offer is done well.

So whilst OEC + Sierra isn't free - it's pretty close.

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  #23 (permalink)
 KelvinKing 
Johor Bahru, Malaysia
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: NinjaTrader Brokerage, Continuum
Trading: FESX, FGBL
 
Posts: 87 since Apr 2013
Thanks: 21 given, 145 received


Big Mike View Post
You've made some mistakes about FT71. I've hosted countless webinars and therefore present for every word of them on futures.io (formerly BMT). Any mention of prop firms has been discussing his past, before he became FT71 and before the brokerage.

As for DOM etc you've misunderstood him.

Sent from my phone

I definitely recall in some of his videos he mentions that DOM reading is becoming less important as it was in the past, and also the reliability in DOM reading.

Perhaps he's talking from his own perspective of trading volume profile where he can afford to pay up 1 or 2 tics and have wider stops and scale into positions, and not from a purely scalping perspective.

Cheers!

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  #24 (permalink)
 KelvinKing 
Johor Bahru, Malaysia
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: NinjaTrader Brokerage, Continuum
Trading: FESX, FGBL
 
Posts: 87 since Apr 2013
Thanks: 21 given, 145 received


KelvinKing View Post
I definitely recall in some of his videos he mentions that DOM reading is becoming less important as it was in the past, and also the reliability in DOM reading.

Perhaps he's talking from his own perspective of trading volume profile where he can afford to pay up 1 or 2 tics and have wider stops and scale into positions, and not from a purely scalping perspective.

Cheers!

And actually, when you ask yourself, what does FT71 really mean when he says his famous one liner "How is the market getting there, and how good of a job is it doing?". He always says it... but he never really explains it. Because he can't, not without a DOM.

From day 1, I have absolutely no clue how to see this and what it means. Because I was looking at only the price charts.

Now I know what he means, he's looking at the DOM the whole time.

So e.g. if the market is moving up 10 price levels. What he's looking for is how they buyers are hitting the offers and is there is any back ticking and how aggressive the back ticking is into the bid. Also, what he's looking for is are the buyers sweeping the offers or do they need to use a machine gun to hammer each offer at the price level. If they are sweeping the offers, likely price is moving higher, if they need to use a machine gun to hammer each price level, meaning there a lot of size sitting on each offer, the likely the buyers are going to run out of ammo real soon.

Cheers!

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