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CFD Broker for DAX
Started:November 10th, 2016 (09:01 AM) by Zemlic Views / Replies:575 / 23
Last Reply:November 22nd, 2016 (03:59 AM) Attachments:0

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CFD Broker for DAX

Old November 10th, 2016, 09:01 AM   #1 (permalink)
Elite Member
Birmingham, UK
 
Futures Experience: None
Platform: NinjaTrader
Favorite Futures: Crude
 
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Thanks: 22 given, 7 received

CFD Broker for DAX

Hi Guys,

I need an advice if you don't mind.
Have been trading forex for a couple of months and would like to start futures in a few months but don't wana jump straight away on full lots, but rather try to build up an account.

Could you please recommend good broker for CFDs - DAX.
Had a look around and can't decide.

Thank you

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Old November 10th, 2016, 09:01 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Old November 10th, 2016, 09:09 AM   #3 (permalink)
Elite Member
Blacksburg, Virginia
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: TWS, Sierra Chart
Broker/Data: IB, SierraCharts data
Favorite Futures: mini FDAX, ES, GC
 
Posts: 743 since Oct 2014
Thanks: 8,979 given, 1,509 received



Zemlic View Post
Hi Guys,

I need an advice if you don't mind.
Have been trading forex for a couple of months and would like to start futures in a few months but don't wana jump straight away on full lots, but rather try to build up an account.

Could you please recommend good broker for CFDs - DAX.
Had a look around and can't decide.

Thank you

I can recommend Interactive Brokers. I used them for trading DAX CFD while I lived in Germany. Now I trade futures with them. I can not comment on pricing compared to other brokers but they seem to be conservative with margins so you know your money is relatively safe. They also have good security with double layer of pass code protection. Plus they offer a large selection of instruments from futures to forex. I hope this helps!

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Old November 10th, 2016, 09:20 AM   #4 (permalink)
Elite Member
Birmingham, UK
 
Futures Experience: None
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Favorite Futures: Crude
 
Posts: 26 since Aug 2015
Thanks: 22 given, 7 received


JohnS View Post
I can recommend Interactive Brokers. I used them for trading DAX CFD while I lived in Germany. Now I trade futures with them. I can not comment on pricing compared to other brokers but they seem to be conservative with margins so you know your money is relatively safe. They also have good security with double layer of pass code protection. Plus they offer a large selection of instruments from futures to forex. I hope this helps!

Thank you JohnS for your reply.

I have heard good things about IB and definetly planing to open futures account with them in the future as other traders that I'm in touch with are using them but for futures only. However they said that initial deposit has to be 10k , which I can not do at the moment.

I'm gona check it out again. Thank you very much.

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Old November 10th, 2016, 09:39 AM   #5 (permalink)
Elite Member
Blacksburg, Virginia
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: TWS, Sierra Chart
Broker/Data: IB, SierraCharts data
Favorite Futures: mini FDAX, ES, GC
 
Posts: 743 since Oct 2014
Thanks: 8,979 given, 1,509 received

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Zemlic View Post
Thank you JohnS for your reply.

I have heard good things about IB and definetly planing to open futures account with them in the future as other traders that I'm in touch with are using them but for futures only. However they said that initial deposit has to be 10k , which I can not do at the moment.

I'm gona check it out again. Thank you very much.

You are welcome and good luck! One comment, I loved trading the CFDs because they give you a lot of flexibility at 1euro/point, you can really learn to trade on a bigger time frame and fade moves compared to learning on the bigger futures....just my 2cents! Have you looked at ETFs? SHARES Core DAX ETF (IB symbol EXS1) seems to be liquid though I have not traded it.

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Old November 10th, 2016, 10:44 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Favorite Futures: Crude
 
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JohnS View Post
You are welcome and good luck! One comment, I loved trading the CFDs because they give you a lot of flexibility at 1euro/point, you can really learn to trade on a bigger time frame and fade moves compared to learning on the bigger futures....just my 2cents! Have you looked at ETFs? SHARES Core DAX ETF (IB symbol EXS1) seems to be liquid though I have not traded it.

Thank you.
No I haven't had a look, but will check it out. Thing with dax for me is I have a big respect for it and can't hold the position on it for long. :-) I do intra and swing for forex , but dax I am only scalping. Got over 1000 trades on demo/ market replay where on avarege I was holding position for 1minute and 2 seconds.
Wana give it a try live now, to see how it goes :-).
Usually I only go for 4-10 points, which I don't know how will it work with CFDs.

Could I ask one more question?
On futures, 1 lot - 1 point is 25, one pip is 12.5.
On CFDs , if I go 0.1 lot - 1 point is 1 and pip is 0.50?
Am I correct here?

Thank you

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Old November 10th, 2016, 01:22 PM   #7 (permalink)
Elite Member
Blacksburg, Virginia
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: TWS, Sierra Chart
Broker/Data: IB, SierraCharts data
Favorite Futures: mini FDAX, ES, GC
 
Posts: 743 since Oct 2014
Thanks: 8,979 given, 1,509 received


Zemlic View Post
Thank you.
No I haven't had a look, but will check it out. Thing with dax for me is I have a big respect for it and can't hold the position on it for long. :-) I do intra and swing for forex , but dax I am only scalping. Got over 1000 trades on demo/ market replay where on avarege I was holding position for 1minute and 2 seconds.
Wana give it a try live now, to see how it goes :-).
Usually I only go for 4-10 points, which I don't know how will it work with CFDs.

Could I ask one more question?
On futures, 1 lot - 1 point is €25, one pip is €12.5.
On CFDs , if I go 0.1 lot - 1 point is 1€ and pip is €0.50?
Am I correct here?

Thank you

here are some of my thoughts if you don't mind my 2cents,
1 min or 2 seconds is not good. you are trading noise...you will make your broker rich and your account will be vaporized sooner or later! I made the mistake of starting out with the big DAX and scalping a few seconds at time and made my broker rich and my account poor!: SIM is not real life and making hundreds of real cash scalping trades and taking heat and pain of little loses invoke all the wrong mental reactions and can lead to a trauma. :stickman: so don't do that! Learn the right way IMO which is trading real cash on a large time frame using smallest instrument possible like a ETF or 1 contract CFD.

when I trade the DAX, I try to get the swing of the day or the morning for 30-100 points and hold for 30 mins to a few hours and always look for an overnight hold if possible!...its very doable with a 20-30 pt stop and more relaxing then getting in and out and paying the Broker commish! The favorite short timeframe move (IMHO) is the morning swing from +/-2SD VWAP targeting VWAP and/ or +/-1 & 2 SD. I try to trade 2-3 contracts and fade this morning move and scale out, unless its a trend morning and you get in the trend.


as for contract size:
  • unless you have 100k Euro account and experience the full DAX (12.5 Euro/tick; one tick is 0.5 points) is way too big.
  • The other option is the Mini-DAX, which trades with a tick size of 1 point, 1 point is 5 euros.
  • The CFD trades in 1 point increments and is based on the DAX index (read the IB website on how it is calculated). 1 tick is 1 point is 1 euros. I would not "scalp" the CFD for a few points as the commish will eat you up.


more food for thought and just my idea of course everyone must come up with their own method and charting that works for themselves.
  • Learn the market structure and look at the 30 min chart of the morning and day over the past year using the Daily, Monthly, yearly VWAP if you have them on your charting software, the relative Volume so you can see market participation, TICK IBIS so you can see buying/selling strength, and MACD for changing price momentum (my preference). You will begin to get an idea of the swings and the effect of changing volume on the price. The DAX is like any other finely crafted German product and is reliable!
  • There are loads of good resources in FIO in the money management section and in SPOOS thread for trading the swing. Read Tigertrader's many good threads on the subject.

The bottom line advice is: Start small size with ETF or CFD and large time frames and trade the swing of the day/month. The DAX will reward you big time because it can easily put on a 1000 point swing over the course of a few days (I have yet to catch one, but you can!) and build up a small account IF you are patient and learn the market first before your burn up your capital.

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Old November 11th, 2016, 06:13 AM   #8 (permalink)
Elite Member
Birmingham, UK
 
Futures Experience: None
Platform: NinjaTrader
Favorite Futures: Crude
 
Posts: 26 since Aug 2015
Thanks: 22 given, 7 received


JohnS View Post
here are some of my thoughts if you don't mind my 2cents,
1 min or 2 seconds is not good. you are trading noise...you will make your broker rich and your account will be vaporized sooner or later! I made the mistake of starting out with the big DAX and scalping a few seconds at time and made my broker rich and my account poor!: SIM is not real life and making hundreds of real cash scalping trades and taking heat and pain of little loses invoke all the wrong mental reactions and can lead to a trauma. :stickman: so don't do that! Learn the right way IMO which is trading real cash on a large time frame using smallest instrument possible like a ETF or 1 contract CFD.

when I trade the DAX, I try to get the swing of the day or the morning for 30-100 points and hold for 30 mins to a few hours and always look for an overnight hold if possible!...its very doable with a 20-30 pt stop and more relaxing then getting in and out and paying the Broker commish! The favorite short timeframe move (IMHO) is the morning swing from +/-2SD VWAP targeting VWAP and/ or +/-1 & 2 SD. I try to trade 2-3 contracts and fade this morning move and scale out, unless its a trend morning and you get in the trend.


as for contract size:
  • unless you have 100k Euro account and experience the full DAX (12.5 Euro/tick; one tick is 0.5 points) is way too big.
  • The other option is the Mini-DAX, which trades with a tick size of 1 point, 1 point is 5 euros.
  • The CFD trades in 1 point increments and is based on the DAX index (read the IB website on how it is calculated). 1 tick is 1 point is 1 euros. I would not "scalp" the CFD for a few points as the commish will eat you up.


more food for thought and just my idea of course everyone must come up with their own method and charting that works for themselves.
  • Learn the market structure and look at the 30 min chart of the morning and day over the past year using the Daily, Monthly, yearly VWAP if you have them on your charting software, the relative Volume so you can see market participation, TICK IBIS so you can see buying/selling strength, and MACD for changing price momentum (my preference). You will begin to get an idea of the swings and the effect of changing volume on the price. The DAX is like any other finely crafted German product and is reliable!
  • There are loads of good resources in FIO in the money management section and in SPOOS thread for trading the swing. Read Tigertrader's many good threads on the subject.

The bottom line advice is: Start small size with ETF or CFD and large time frames and trade the swing of the day/month. The DAX will reward you big time because it can easily put on a 1000 point swing over the course of a few days (I have yet to catch one, but you can!) and build up a small account IF you are patient and learn the market first before your burn up your capital.

Hi John,

Thank you for your advice and opinion, I always appricieted that from experienced traders.
As you say, making broker rich and my account small is the one thing that I am a bit afraid of. Concept of this strategy can be used on higher time frames, tried 5 min, 1hour and daily and it showed positive result, albeit more robust back testing sample will be needed. This strategy is based only on price action and fibbo.

I have actually started with this about 9 months ago with similar back testing results as now, but left it for about 7 months. Now, as this election madness was around, stopped trading for about 2 weeks and revisited this idea. Results are in the same ball park as before, so I'm getting tempted. But will test the higher time frames and see if it can be applied on intraday, instead of scalping.

Further more, I started to integrate orderflow and vwap into this as well , plus delta and tape reading, to get stronger confluences.

Other than this idea with dax, I am very conservative. As you mentioned using 30 minutes charts, market profile, orderflow for volumes, price action, vwap and tape reader. Patiently waiting for my levels.

Going with 1-2% SL and scaling size of a position relative to my SL. If SL is out of 2% I just scale down the size of the position.Build up position size relative to my money and risk management.
Thanks for you advise, a lot of work to be done.:-)

I am now deciding for this CFDs brokers between Fxcm, Swiss , Dukascopy and oanda. Have you tried any of them?

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Old November 11th, 2016, 07:53 AM   #9 (permalink)
Elite member
Hertfordshire England
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT
Favorite Futures: DAX
 
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Posts: 88 since May 2011
Thanks: 86 given, 162 received

Looks like you are UK based which means you could try spread betting the dax CFD through FXCM. The advantage, apart from the tax benefit, is that you can also use ninjatrader.

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Old November 11th, 2016, 09:34 AM   #10 (permalink)
Elite Member
Birmingham, UK
 
Futures Experience: None
Platform: NinjaTrader
Favorite Futures: Crude
 
Posts: 26 since Aug 2015
Thanks: 22 given, 7 received



pvlee View Post
Looks like you are UK based which means you could try spread betting the dax CFD through FXCM. The advantage, apart from the tax benefit, is that you can also use ninjatrader.

Hi Pvlee,

Thank you for an answer. I have narrowed it down to oanda a fxcm now. The idea of using ninja is big plus. Do you mind me asking, do you trade with fxcm?

Also, I'm still confused from difference between trading futures and CFDs in pricing and quiet frankly feeling like an idiot.

Dax on futures move in points, where one point is worth 25 per 1 Lot, and half a point is worth 12.5.
On CFDs on a 1 lot how much is one point worth? Is it 10 and 1/2 point 5 or point is worth 20 and 1/2 point is worth 10.

What ever it is, you could clarifi please, 0.1 lot dax CFDs will be worth 1/10 of a full lot.

Sorry for being an idiot with this, I just can't get it.
Thank you

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