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LIGHTSPEED - STAY AWAY


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LIGHTSPEED - STAY AWAY

  #1 (permalink)
TheDude
london
 
Posts: 165 since Jan 2012
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So I opened a small account with lightspeed for buy & hold with some spare cash.

I buy some stocks with the idea of just picking up the dividend - more of an investment over time. If I turn out to be a good stock picker, I'll add to the account (it turns out I'm not!)

I do however place some GTC stops in case they puke as I bought on margin.

Six months later I log to see where I am, only to find all my GTC's were cancelled by Lightspeed!!!


WTF!!!

They can give no explanation other than 'Sh!t happens' or words similar to that.

In my thinking this is utterly negligent of them as I could have ended up owing them money equivalent to the amount I originally posted with them.

Does anyone know if this would be a valid case with the SEC? I havent lost any money, but to my thinking, a broker has no right to adjust or cancel orders unless they will somehow affect the integrity of the firm or other clients accounts.

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  #3 (permalink)
 kevinkdog   is a Vendor
 
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TheDude View Post
So I opened a small account with lightspeed for buy & hold with some spare cash.

I buy some stocks with the idea of just picking up the dividend - more of an investment over time. If I turn out to be a good stock picker, I'll add to the account (it turns out I'm not!)

I do however place some GTC stops in case they puke as I bought on margin.

Six months later I log to see where I am, only to find all my GTC's were cancelled by Lightspeed!!!


WTF!!!

They can give no explanation other than 'Sh!t happens' or words similar to that.

In my thinking this is utterly negligent of them as I could have ended up owing them money equivalent to the amount I originally posted with them.

Does anyone know if this would be a valid case with the SEC? I havent lost any money, but to my thinking, a broker has no right to adjust or cancel orders unless they will somehow affect the integrity of the firm or other clients accounts.

I've heard of brokers automatically cancelling orders at month or quarter end, so maybe that is what happened. I've also gotten notices from other firms, stating "due to xxx, all GTC orders will be cancelled this Friday and must be re-entered."

In any event, you luckily lost no money, so I doubt the SEC or anyone else would care. If they did, they'd probably focus more on you - an investor buying on margin but not checking the account for 6 months - they might question your suitability to trade, more than they'd care about Lightspeed.

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  #4 (permalink)
TheDude
london
 
Posts: 165 since Jan 2012
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kevinkdog View Post
I've heard of brokers automatically cancelling orders at month or quarter end, so maybe that is what happened. I've also gotten notices from other firms, stating "due to xxx, all GTC orders will be cancelled this Friday and must be re-entered."

In any event, you luckily lost no money, so I doubt the SEC or anyone else would care. If they did, they'd probably focus more on you - an investor buying on margin but not checking the account for 6 months - they might question your suitability to trade, more than they'd care about Lightspeed.

Fair point; If they sent me a notice stating that orders needed re-entering, or could be cancelled, or similar. Needless to say, they never.

What if I had entered a GTC around 1 Std Dev, then the order is cancelled with no warning or notice, and the next day the stock (or other asset) plunged through the price, only to find say 12 hours later that I'm now deeply in the red? I dont think this is an unrealistic scenario.

The fact I never lost money is immaterial. I dont think the time period or distance from the NBBO is relevant either given the above scenario.

It's the issue of a broker cancelling orders with out any notice, or not having the infrastructure to be able to honour orders that is the real issue.

It could have caused a loss and therefore deterred an individual from putting up risk in the US equity markets. The job of the SEC is surely to ensure a fair and orderly market exists so that individuals and firms can have the confidence to put up risk. If they let fly-by-night cowboys like Lightspeed exist with such practices, are they doing their job? It is not the job of the SEC to dictate trading practices or behaviour so long as it doesnt interfere with a fair orderly market.

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  #5 (permalink)
 kevinkdog   is a Vendor
 
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TheDude View Post
Fair point; If they sent me a notice stating that orders needed re-entering, or could be cancelled, or similar. Needless to say, they never.

What if I had entered a GTC around 1 Std Dev, then the order is cancelled with no warning or notice, and the next day the stock (or other asset) plunged through the price, only to find say 12 hours later that I'm now deeply in the red? I dont think this is an unrealistic scenario.

The fact I never lost money is immaterial. I dont think the time period or distance from the NBBO is relevant either given the above scenario.

It's the issue of a broker cancelling orders with out any notice, or not having the infrastructure to be able to honour orders that is the real issue.

It could have caused a loss and therefore deterred an individual from putting up risk in the US equity markets. The job of the SEC is surely to ensure a fair and orderly market exists so that individuals and firms can have the confidence to put up risk. If they let fly-by-night cowboys like Lightspeed exist with such practices, are they doing their job? It is not the job of the SEC to dictate trading practices or behaviour so long as it doesnt interfere with a fair orderly market.

Sounds like you should file complaint with SEC. I hope it works out for you. Please keep futures.io (formerly BMT) informed about it. I'd be shocked if they do anything at all, but to your point - this is something they should protect people about.

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  #6 (permalink)
 
Bermudan Option's Avatar
 Bermudan Option 
Chicago, Illinois
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Experience: Beginner
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Talking to the SEC is barking up the wrong tree:


Quoting 
Good-Til-Cancelled Order A Good-Til-Cancelled (GTC) order is an order to buy or sell a stock that lasts until the order is completed or cancelled. Brokerage firms typically limit the length of time an investor can leave a GTC order open. This time frame may vary from broker to broker. Investors should contact their brokerage firms to determine what time limit would apply to GTC orders.


To understand where and how an order you place with your broker is executed, you should read Trade Execution: What Every Investor Should Know. For more information on the different types of orders you can place when you buy or sell a stock, please read our investor bulletin “Trading Basics”.

Good-Til-Cancelled Order

That is straight from the horse's mouth. I say if you don't like it, change brokerages. Also, check your GTC once a month or so as well.

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  #7 (permalink)
TheDude
london
 
Posts: 165 since Jan 2012
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Bermudan Option View Post
Talking to the SEC is barking up the wrong tree:


Good-Til-Cancelled Order

That is straight from the horse's mouth. I say if you don't like it, change brokerages. Also, check your GTC once a month or so as well.


Thanks. Thats helpful. Looks like I have little recourse after all.

Looks like I'll just have to stew in my frustration!

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  #8 (permalink)
TheDude
london
 
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OK - UPDATE:

1 week ago I entered 10 GTC orders to replace the ones that Lightspeed cancelled.

I log in a week later, and I only have 8 working. The other 2 have gone.

Remember I am not trading these positions but they are investments. Therefore, I dont want to be logging in all the time, looking at their price as this could tempt a trading mindset. I simply have the GTC stops in case they lose 50% as I bought on margin.

Clearly Lightspeed is a clown outfit. Their online platform is an utter joke anyway. I used to have a Datek account some 13 years ago (remember them?? Great broker). That platform was free and blew this poxy crap out the water! THIRTEEN YEARS AGO!!!!!

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  #9 (permalink)
 
PositiveDeviant's Avatar
 PositiveDeviant 
United Kingdom
 
Experience: Intermediate
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I was thinking of switching to lightspeed for futures trading. It seems like their business is more geared to short term trading rather than catering for investors. Still unless then have a specific policy on the duration of GTC orders then it seems odd they would arbitrarily cancel a client's orders.

I see from their website that they won;

Barron's Best Broker for Frequent Traders 2013 and Stockbrokers.com No.1 Active Trading 2013

Sorry to hear you had difficulties.


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  #10 (permalink)
TheDude
london
 
Posts: 165 since Jan 2012
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I was pretty upset! This has NEVER happened with any futures broker - ok this is stocks, and as someone else pointed out, regulation does suggest the onus is on me to check.

Lightspeed have recently upgraded their free online platform. It's ok, but lacks big time in some areas. It's slow, the charts dont work at all, and generally clumsy. No idea what their premier platforms are like as I've just got some stocks Im holding as an investment rather than trading. GTC's do seem more reliable to date however.

I wouldnt use their free platform for day trading if thats what you're thinking, and I definitely wouldnt use this broker for futures. You need to be on the ball with solid platforms for futures because of the leverage.

Try Advantage, Deep Discount Trading, AMP or someone for futures if I were you.

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Last Updated on November 18, 2013


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