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ZB ZN (NOB)
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Created: by JTrain Attachments:0

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ZB ZN (NOB)

  #11 (permalink)
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sam028 View Post
A newbie question: as ZB and ZN have a similar value (120 X $1000 now), why using another ratio than 1:1 ?

If you look at the average daily range of ZF, ZN, and ZB, you'll notice that ZB is roughly twice as big as ZN which is about 50% larger than ZF. The reason is that actual Treasury securities of varying maturities are deliverable against these contracts, and the amount of price change of a shorter term instrument to achieve a given yield change is smaller than that of a longer term instrument. Historically the ratio for the NOB (10 Year Notes over Bonds) spread has ranged from about 2:1 to 5:3, the latter being more common. The Fite (Five Years over Ten Years) has ranged from about 5:3 to 3:2.

If you are long the NOB 1:1, you are short the market. Although recently ZB has really done it's own thing relative to the rest of the curve.

"You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows..."
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  #12 (permalink)
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JTrain View Post
Yes always 1/1, I dont put it on as normal spread, I will leg in each side, and can scale in and out durning the day......

J-Train

Hm. Given that you've been doing this a long time, of course you know you're in a directional trade. I'm curious why you incur the extra expense of trading these as a spread?

"You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows..."
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  #13 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Gulf Shores, Al. USA
 
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its the KIS (keep it simple)



jstnbrg View Post
If you look at the average daily range of ZF, ZN, and ZB, you'll notice that ZB is roughly twice as big as ZN which is about 50% larger than ZF. The reason is that actual Treasury securities of varying maturities are deliverable against these contracts, and the amount of price change of a shorter term instrument to achieve a given yield change is smaller than that of a longer term instrument. Historically the ratio for the NOB (10 Year Notes over Bonds) spread has ranged from about 2:1 to 5:3, the latter being more common. The Fite (Five Years over Ten Years) has ranged from about 5:3 to 3:2.

If you are long the NOB 1:1, you are short the market. Although recently ZB has really done it's own thing relative to the rest of the curve.

didnt mean to be so long about getting back to you....I was trying to put on trade....will show you how I do it...
1/1....I am only playing the spread of 5yr, 10yr, 30yr...
this morning was directional long ZN this morning....and holding fell like more upside to this move....I just added short ZB untill put back is over.....most would say this type of trade is tuffer that playing the yeild....Im have a hard time posting trade and watching trade.......Thanks

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  #14 (permalink)
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JTrain View Post
didnt mean to be so long about getting back to you....I was trying to put on trade....will show you how I do it...
1/1....I am only playing the spread of 5yr, 10yr, 30yr...
this morning was directional long ZN this morning....and holding fell like more upside to this move....I just added short ZB untill put back is over.....most would say this type of trade is tuffer that playing the yeild....Im have a hard time posting trade and watching trade.......Thanks

I'll talk to you when you're free. Make money!

"You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows..."
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  #15 (permalink)
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coming off short ZB


jstnbrg View Post
I'll talk to you when you're free. Make money!


to show complet trade, closing the short ZB, still holding long ZN....looking for exit around close

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  #16 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Gulf Shores, Al. USA
 
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ZN / ZB looking for direction

ZN need break below 120.280 for some direction today.....looking to downside




JTrain View Post
long 30yr short 10yr ....with 0 spread 5/32 stop

stoped out long 30yr, holding short 10yr

Back long 30 (nob in place)


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  #17 (permalink)
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Santa Rosa CA USA
 
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To jstnbrg:

If you can help me trade the curve as a retail trader let me know.

bookum

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  #18 (permalink)
Just a boy
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bookum View Post
To jstnbrg:

If you can help me trade the curve as a retail trader let me know.

bookum

@bookum

To be sure a message is directed at the member it is best to put a @ in front of their name - this will alert the member.

Eg @jstnbrg

Called a 'shout out'

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  #19 (permalink)
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Thanks Steve!

To @jstnbrg:

If you can help me trade the curve as a retail trader let me know. PM would be great

bookum

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  #20 (permalink)
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bookum View Post
Thanks Steve!

To @jstnbrg:

If you can help me trade the curve as a retail trader let me know. PM would be great

bookum

I've been out of this game a long time, so I doubt I can be of assistance. Why the curve rather than outright instruments?

"You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows..."
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