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The cost of getting started scalping futures


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The cost of getting started scalping futures

  #21 (permalink)
TradingTom
Munich Germany
 
Posts: 32 since Jan 2017
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MichaelFlowTrader View Post
I don't think that you need all of those things to get started. You can typically find a broker who will basically give you a platform for free that will come with a DOM. You don't have to use Jigsaw, although it gives the most information of any DOM but you don't have to use it as you get started.

Almost everything I've heard so far says that Jigsaw is by far the best tool for orderflow scalping and that it does make a huge difference compared to a standard DOM without all the additional information.
That's why I'm not entirely sure if starting without Jigsaw does give me the correct picture of whether this is for me and how well it works (for me)...

I have however been in contact with the guys at Jigsaw and they told me there is now an early standalone platform called "RapidTraderPro" that comes with their Jigsaw package.
So from what I gather buying the Jigsaw license and a datafeed (might be possible with a free trial feed as well?!) should get me started to try things out for a while.

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  #22 (permalink)
TradingTom
Munich Germany
 
Posts: 32 since Jan 2017
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SMCJB View Post
The cynical would say that they make the FX trading easy to enter, so there's always a constant flow of new 'customers' to lose their money.

So why wouldn't they want to do the same with futures?!

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  #23 (permalink)
MichaelFlowTrader
Atlanta
 
Posts: 152 since Jan 2017
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TradingTom View Post
So why wouldn't they want to do the same with futures?!

Because Futures are exchange traded with more regulations. Most people who trade Futures want to trade products that aren't broken down into super tiny lot sizes so you can't get started with say $5 to $100 like you can in Forex. So Forex will always have more uneducated new traders coming to it because of how cheap it is to access.

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  #24 (permalink)
MichaelFlowTrader
Atlanta
 
Posts: 152 since Jan 2017
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TradingTom View Post
Almost everything I've heard so far says that Jigsaw is by far the best tool for orderflow scalping and that it does make a huge difference compared to a standard DOM without all the additional information.
That's why I'm not entirely sure if starting without Jigsaw does give me the correct picture of whether this is for me and how well it works (for me)...

I have however been in contact with the guys at Jigsaw and they told me there is now an early standalone platform called "RapidTraderPro" that comes with their Jigsaw package.
So from what I gather buying the Jigsaw license and a datafeed (might be possible with a free trial feed as well?!) should get me started to try things out for a while.

Yes, Jigsaw gives the most information but that doesn't mean you can't trade depth of market without. There are many pros who don't use Jigsaw who make money. My recommendation is based on you complaining about the cost of Futures because of your list of must haves. If you can get the standalone Jigsaw with free charting or cheap charting then you will save a ton of money.

.

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  #25 (permalink)
 peterb123 
Munich, Germany
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Jigsaw daytradr
Broker: IBKR, Tradovate
Trading: FGBX
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TradingTom View Post
I come from the Forex world and have only recently started to look into trading Futures.
I'd be interested in supplementing my Forex day trading with scalping Futures via DOM.

I am kind of shocked at what seems to be the cost of a setup to get started here compared to FX.
  • NinjaTrader Lifetime License: ~1000$
  • Jigsaw DOM Addon: ~400$
  • Jigsaw Live Trading ~50$ / month
  • Datafeed Kinetick: ~50$ / month
  • Comissions: ~4$ / RT / contract for ES

Am I missing something or is it really this expensive?
Cheers,
Tom

I have a similar plan, want to learn Orderflow using Jigsaw and have the same setup as you, Tom.
The one thing I did not understand yet is what advantage a Kinetick datafeed has over the Ninjabrokerage Continuum (CQG) one. At the moment, I have both, but couldn't I get rid of one of them?

Peter

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  #26 (permalink)
paulrobert
Arlington VA
 
Posts: 11 since Feb 2017
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Peter,

I'm pretty sure CQG is free if you're using NT Brokerage.

-Paul


Sent from my iPhone using futures.io

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  #27 (permalink)
 
citikot's Avatar
 citikot 
Tbilisi, Georgia
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NT7, NT8, SB-Pro
Broker: NinjaTrader Brokerage+CQG, TopStepTrader + Rithmic
Trading: ES, 6B, 6J, 6A, 6E, NQ
Posts: 71 since Feb 2015
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Raider View Post
Curren futures trader, left the forex market and have been fairing better x 10. Don't trade forex. [/url]

Don't agree. I went from forex to futures and then went back ))) You don't like cats? You simply can not cook them Forex is way much more cost effective than futures and way less risky if You know what you are doing and trading with top tier respectable regulated brokerage.

Bite small, run fast!
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  #28 (permalink)
 Rupkali 
Hampshire, UK
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Tradovate/Jigsaw
Trading: ES
Posts: 10 since Apr 2015
Thanks Given: 7
Thanks Received: 15

Hi

Like Trading Tom I should like to make the move from trading Spot Forex to Futures but am very surprised by the fees.

I enquired about the fees that would be associated with using the stand alone or web based Rapid Trader Pro from Jigsaw. Perhaps I have unwittingly made some of the below costs more expensive by not suggesting the Jigsaw 'plug in' version.

In addition to the $400 for Jigsaw (which is fine) I have been quoted the following:

IQFeed Core Service: $78 per month
Real-Time US Futures Fee: $20 per month
CME Exchange Fee: $91 per month
Market Depth Level II Service: $20 per month

Although if I go through particular brokers then the $91 comes down to $5 a month. Perhaps I have been quoted fees for a professional trader - I am not, I trade for a second income.

I am a positional day trader and therefore I'd like to have access tools that would help that: market profile, cumulative delta, the GOMi indicator & DOM.

I did wonder whether or not I could access these kinds of Futures information yet still trade from my spot Forex trading platform. Assuming that 6E Eurodollar moves as Eurusd Forex. That maybe a very dumb idea and please let me know if it is and why.

So very keen to become a Futures trader but the costs I have been quoted so far are a hurdle.

Not sure if it is relevant but I am based in UK. Thanks for any help and advice.

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  #29 (permalink)
 
xplorer's Avatar
 xplorer 
London UK
Site Moderator
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: CQG
Broker: S5
Trading: Futures
Frequency: Never
Duration: Never
Posts: 5,925 since Sep 2015
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Rupkali View Post
Hi

Like Trading Tom I should like to make the move from trading Spot Forex to Futures but am very surprised by the fees.

I enquired about the fees that would be associated with using the stand alone or web based Rapid Trader Pro from Jigsaw. Perhaps I have unwittingly made some of the below costs more expensive by not suggesting the Jigsaw 'plug in' version.

In addition to the $400 for Jigsaw (which is fine) I have been quoted the following:

IQFeed Core Service: $78 per month
Real-Time US Futures Fee: $20 per month
CME Exchange Fee: $91 per month
Market Depth Level II Service: $20 per month

Although if I go through particular brokers then the $91 comes down to $5 a month. Perhaps I have been quoted fees for a professional trader - I am not, I trade for a second income.

I am a positional day trader and therefore I'd like to have access tools that would help that: market profile, cumulative delta, the GOMi indicator & DOM.

I did wonder whether or not I could access these kinds of Futures information yet still trade from my spot Forex trading platform. Assuming that 6E Eurodollar moves as Eurusd Forex. That maybe a very dumb idea and please let me know if it is and why.

So very keen to become a Futures trader but the costs I have been quoted so far are a hurdle.

Not sure if it is relevant but I am based in UK. Thanks for any help and advice.

Again, no idea why people keep getting quotes on all this stuff. As far as I am concerned, my only fixed/recurring cost is 15 USD for CME exchange real-time feed (that includes Level 2 type access to all the CME exchanges) and I think 32 USD for access to Eurex exchange (that includes Level 2 type access).

If you don't trade European products and only trade CME stuff then IMO you should not pay more than 15 USD/month to get all the data you need.

This of course is for non-professionals.

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  #30 (permalink)
 Rupkali 
Hampshire, UK
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Tradovate/Jigsaw
Trading: ES
Posts: 10 since Apr 2015
Thanks Given: 7
Thanks Received: 15


Thanks for your reply xplorer. Apologies but new to this.

May I ask what your set up is then in terms of futures platform, charting & tools, and feed whereby you use where you pay $15 a month?

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Last Updated on March 20, 2017


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