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Hi! How do I get started?
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Hi! How do I get started?

  #21 (permalink)
Elite Member
London
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader
Favorite Futures: CL
 
Daytona's Avatar
 
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I find it's best to let your mind naturally wonder and let your curiosity take you to where it wants to go.


This is how I started. I looked at a very simple strategy involving MACD's and Moving Averages (Top Dog Trading). I applied this to a a few products (a few indices, commodities and fx) and a number of different charts (tick and fixed interval time charts with various fractals). I scrolled through the charts, identifying and marking entry and exit points. As chartists we are looking at a visual representation of accumulated human behaviour, and therefore I think one of the most important things is to be looking at something that is 'easy on the eye,' something that flows. Something that I find is easy on the eye will be different from something that you find easy on the eye, it has to be something that works with your unique mindset. For me, within a few weeks it quickly came apparent the answer was CL in various fractals (50 up to 2000), so I decided to purely focus on this. I continued for a few months just scrolling through masses of historical data, and no doubt within that time you will observe patterns, price structures and eventually formulate your own concepts about price. I was no longer using any indicators, however I have to credit the basic strategy I was initially using in helping me dive in.


And then you can start doing what, be in no doubt, is the very best thing about this job - putting your own ideas into action.

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  #22 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Chino Hills, CA
 
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Posts: 6 since Jul 2015
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Thanks guys! Adam Grimes is great

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  #23 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Chattanooga
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
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jaredmason View Post
Hi there!

I'm a complete newb to trading, but came across your forum a couple of times while investigating Emini Trading Academy and the Day Trading Academy. The comments on this site seemed really well reasoned and genuine, so I've come back to see what other gems you might have.

After poking around for a few hours I'm sorry to say I'm pretty lost on how to get started with trading.

The community here seems very skeptical of various youTube videos and training websites, but I can't figure out what the alternative is. What does futures.io (formerly BMT) recommend for an honest introduction to trading?

I guess what I'm after is a bit of a road map. I don't like to sign on for things before getting a full idea of the costs and risks. But as an outsider, I don't know who to trust and what training options actually do what they claim to do...

Can anyone recommend a course, or a series of videos, or books that can take me from zero to semi-functional trader? The more comprehensive the better, but preferably with fixed costs and clear progressive milestones.

Thanks for any and all feedback!

Be patient, follow your rules, and stay disciplined and always pick yourself up when you lose, because you will lose! Set yourself up for success with your risk reward.
hope this helps!

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  #24 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Nashville, TN/USA
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Amibroker
Favorite Futures: Stocks
 
Posts: 11 since Aug 2015
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jaredmason View Post
Hi there!

Can anyone recommend a course, or a series of videos, or books that can take me from zero to semi-functional trader? The more comprehensive the better, but preferably with fixed costs and clear progressive milestones.

Thanks for any and all feedback!

Jared, I'm a beginner at swing trading myself. I spent probably over a year just working with learning how to build models in amibroker, and familiarizing myself with issues of model building (esp. survivorship bias, curve fitting), and tried out a lot of not-so-good ideas until I landed on some things that worked. I read alot of academic papers on pricing anomalies, like momentum, value, volatility and incorporated those ideas to various degrees. I'm using amibroker to model, and found books by Howard Bandy very helpful, as well as books by Connors Research (I found the "High probability etf trading book" had useful ideas), and a book by Van Tharpe on mindset (I think it was "Trading your way to financial freedom" that was good). Also, check out the "Better System Trader" podcasts. Lots of good talks with pros, some legendary, there.

As a beginner, I'd say don't be in too big of a hurry until you struggle with it. There are lots of pitfalls. Keep your trading amounts small until you're comfortable with what you're doing because in live trading you'll uncover a lot of things you hadn't anticipated, and that will inform how you modify your models.

EDIT: and I would agree with comments to think seriously about what kind of trader you want to be - and "can" be - and build your systems/process around that. I didn't want to have to watch screens all day, so that helped determine how I needed to build my systems. I also am psychologically more in tune with certain types of trades, so that's what I focused on. It is said that a good system you can stick with is far better than a great system that you can't stick with.


Last edited by ScaredyCat; August 5th, 2015 at 07:38 PM.
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  #25 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Bratislava, Slovakia
 
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Posts: 13 since Jul 2015
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A few replies have been already added, but maybe it will help you how I started. Simple - reading. Not only books, but also articles on internet, discussions, forums, etc.. You will find out what interests you the most and then you can concentrate on that set up demo accounts, try what you want and after some time you will find out if it is something you want to dedicate your time, good luck

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  #26 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Ft. Lauderdale
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Favorite Futures: silver
 
Posts: 1 since Jul 2012
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adam h grimes free course

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  #27 (permalink)
Membership Temporarily Revoked
Surat+Gujarat/India
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: xyz
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Posts: 25 since Jul 2014
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There are various source where you can get knowledge first, next step is to find an appropriate broker and practice trading with Demo. I have started trading with my current broker since 3 years and have gained knowledge while practicing trading for 6 months and now I am trading happily.

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  #28 (permalink)
Elite Member
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Futures Experience: None
Platform: NT8,NT7,TWS,FOREX.COM app
Broker/Data: InteractiveBrokers, NinjaTrader Brokerage FOREX.COM, IQFeed
Favorite Futures: The one I'm creating in the present....ES, ZF, ZN, ZB, FX pairs
 
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DbPhoenix View Post
Of observation time? Before beginning to formulate preliminary hypotheses? Yes. It took much longer when I started in the 70s, but that was before computers and digital charts and replay. Nowadays, if one employs replay and is interested only in the first 90-120m, he can go through a week in an evening.

Wow wow wow this is a very VERY dangerous comment......... Replay is nothing like the real market it may serve as a way back test something at sped up setting. I feel its has about a 5% usefulness. One can gain an understanding of their platform and how to place orders.

But the idea of obtaining "weeks" of insight in the workings of the market in one evening is complete and absolute nonsense/absurd/ridiculous/crazy/reckless/incorrect/implanting of wishful thinking for selfish reasons/immature/misleading/folly/hogwash/madness/a joke and exactly the wrong thing to be told when starting out in this business.
Ron

It is an axiomatic fact that while you meditate you are speaking with your own spirit. In that state of mind you put certain questions to your spirit and the spirit answers: the light breaks forth and the reality is revealed.
The steed of this Valley is pain; and if there be no pain this journey will never end.
Buy Low And Sell High (read left to right or right to left....lol)
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  #29 (permalink)
Elite Member
SF Bay Area + CA/US
 
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Platform: Tradestation, Ninja
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hi there @jaredmason ...not so active...just came across this.

what will and is helping me is what i pen. it might be different for others.

there is a good chance that a good course/book will only give a blueprint. however the blueprint needs to be well understood by the trader himself...and in the heat of the moment determine when a stop needs to be put if blueprint not working that day.

at the heart of the market is balance/imbalance...liquidity. if one can understand this...one can do well. market internals is also a good reference if trading the us markets...but understanding when internals not conforming is key. it all boils down to Order Flow & liquidity in my 2cs.

i am using OF to determine if am correct or wrong.

having a good mentor who trades and is successful is also key.

cheers n good luck
s


Last edited by paps; September 2nd, 2015 at 05:05 PM. Reason: reply to OP
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  #30 (permalink)
Elite Member
Chicago, IL
 
Futures Experience: None
Platform: NT8,NT7,TWS,FOREX.COM app
Broker/Data: InteractiveBrokers, NinjaTrader Brokerage FOREX.COM, IQFeed
Favorite Futures: The one I'm creating in the present....ES, ZF, ZN, ZB, FX pairs
 
Blash's Avatar
 
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Screen time...............



jaredmason View Post
Hey, wow - thanks all for the great comments so far!

A couple of points I'm hearing is 'download Ninja Trader' and 'everything you need is available for free'...

I installed NT and set up the demo feed. Now I'm staring at some blank pages, so any more specific advice on the basic act of setting up a chart, or making a trade would be most helpful.

In terms of all the free stuff out there, could anyone be more specific? I've already spent 20hrs digging into trading over the past 3 days and would say 80% of that time was a total write-off. I've consumed numerous videos and articles that I've since found out are rubbish, so if I just keep on googling according to my own limited understanding I'm pretty sure I'm destined to waste even more time.

One course I had been considering is Al Brooks Price Action video series. I know it costs, but basically, if its good value and will allow me to spend less time searching and more time learning quality information, then I consider that an effective use of my resources.

Otherwise, are there any particular websites or YouTube channels or whatever else that have good starting points for beginners? Particularly any kind of series, or structured outline to get me started in the right direction... then once I have a framework I will be better informed to start researching and filling in my own gaps.

Thoughts?

Please forgive me if I'm about to repeat what was already said for I have not yet read all the posts in this thread.

There is absolutely zero substitute for screen time ....ZERO... no course or book can give you screen time viewing the market ES CL whichever one. You will have to become accustom to how the market does what it does in real time. And you have to try to understand what it is you are seeing on the chart and invision the people behind those trades to some small degree. A lot of trades, in ES for example, will just be arbitrage from the options pits at the CBOE etc and most of those trades those people won't even be looking at a chart as they make it. Another huge bunch will be your Goldman Sachs of the world, traders with mind blowing resources in every possible regard, money, equipment, skill, insight, speed of orders execution you name it. As well as retail traders doing their thing (mostly handing over their cash to the pros).

O feel the most elementary and rudimentary market information is this, which I learned far to late but at least I learned it, Market orders ONLY pair with Limit orders PERIOD. There is no other way for a trade to happen. Pull up a time and sales and watch it for a day a year. What you are seeing is Market orders filled against Limit orders and they are broken up to get those fills. Meaning if Goldman Sachs goes Market on a 400 lot in ES, for example, this will be filled with any available Limit orders with CME's matching engine and will take some number of milliseconds.
A stop order once hit will go Market with the next available Limit order(s). These Limit orders are traders waiting in line for there trade to happen at a certain price. Market orders are by far for the vast majority of them the aggression in the market. Limit order can be aggressive but it more rare and a diff subject. The next available Limit order most of the time is right at the price the Market order was placed, in ES at least. BUT there are times when the next available Limit order is far away and you lose much more then you had planned.

Its easy to keep talking and talking about this and all it's nuances but I will stop now. Because I have whatever understanding I do does not mean I have this game all figured out.

Ron

It is an axiomatic fact that while you meditate you are speaking with your own spirit. In that state of mind you put certain questions to your spirit and the spirit answers: the light breaks forth and the reality is revealed.
The steed of this Valley is pain; and if there be no pain this journey will never end.
Buy Low And Sell High (read left to right or right to left....lol)
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