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Intro and Poll on Switching Products
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View Poll Results: Have you ever switched products?
Yes 6 100.00%
No 0 0%
Voters: 6. You may not vote on this poll

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Intro and Poll on Switching Products

  #1 (permalink)
Elite Member
London, United Kingdom
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: N/A
Broker/Data: Bloomberg
Favorite Futures: Energies
 
CobblersAwls's Avatar
 
Posts: 284 since Jul 2014
Thanks: 970 given, 363 received

Intro and Poll on Switching Products

Hello,

I have around 2.5 years of market experience and around 7 months of live trading experience on my own personal account. I joined up to futures.io (formerly BMT) as it is the best site for trading I have come across and there is some good discussion on the threads here. I am hoping to learn a lot here and also give a lot back.

I trade spot FX and metals and after about 2 years finally created a system that works for me and is profitable. I trade using price action, focusing on key levels to fade/breakout (depending on said PA).

Although profitable, I found myself missing some key things - volume and visibility. This pushed me to want to learn to trade futures and read the order book/DOM. I have started researching a lot and will probably focus on FESX on the early EU seesion then move over to the ES for the start of the US session. I may change my mind though after testing a range of products to see which suits me the most.


Question Poll:

So, have any of you ever switched from spot to futures or just switched products in general? What led you to make the switch? How long did it take you to adjust to the flow of a new market?

All the best,

Awls

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  #2 (permalink)
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  #3 (permalink)
Trading for Fun
Buffalo, NY
 
Futures Experience: None
Platform: Python, Excel, R, Ninjatrader
Broker/Data: IB quandl
Favorite Futures: Low frequency trading
 
Posts: 64 since Jul 2014
Thanks: 4 given, 37 received


Of course.

I think most people starting out make their choice of instruments based on the availability heuristic. You happened to have pulled up data on instrument X so instrument X becomes "yours" to the irrational exclusion of everything else.

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  #4 (permalink)
Elite Member
London, UK
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: TT, CQG, esignal, TWS
Favorite Futures: Futures, spot FX, Energy Spreads Prop Firm
 
Posts: 61 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 16 given, 55 received


CobblersAwls View Post
Hello,

I have around 2.5 years of market experience and around 7 months of live trading experience on my own personal account. I joined up to futures.io (formerly BMT) as it is the best site for trading I have come across and there is some good discussion on the threads here. I am hoping to learn a lot here and also give a lot back.

I trade spot FX and metals and after about 2 years finally created a system that works for me and is profitable. I trade using price action, focusing on key levels to fade/breakout (depending on said PA).

Although profitable, I found myself missing some key things - volume and visibility. This pushed me to want to learn to trade futures and read the order book/DOM. I have started researching a lot and will probably focus on FESX on the early EU seesion then move over to the ES for the start of the US session. I may change my mind though after testing a range of products to see which suits me the most.


Question Poll:

So, have any of you ever switched from spot to futures or just switched products in general? What led you to make the switch? How long did it take you to adjust to the flow of a new market?

All the best,

Awls

Hi

Most traders will have switched products. I don't think there is anything wrong with it as long as you switch for the right reasons. What I would say though is that when you are considering products to trade start with the end game in mind. If you actually get very good at trading then slippage will start to become a problem. For this reason I normally only trade products that are thick enough to handle very large clips so that in the event that I manage to get very good at trading I will have the experience and screen time in these markets. For example I like trading oil futures (CL) however slippage is going to become a huge problem if you ever get to the point of trading large size, you would then be forced to change products again. The biggest size I normally trade is 5 contracts or 5 lots of forex, so I am a small trader. The products I trade are:

Bund Future
10 year Note Future (London afternoons only)
Eurostoxx Future (London mornings only)
ES mini Future (London afternoons only)
GBPUSD spot
EURJPY spot

With all of these markets you can comfortable trade 50 contracts or lots without any slippage, so in the event that one day you become a very successful trader you can keep sizing up with these contracts. For the most part you can drop 500 contracts or lots with very little slippage.

So even though I trade 1 to 5 contracts on the above whilst learning and improving, it's good to know you wont ever have to change products again unless you become the next George Soros.!

good luck.

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  #5 (permalink)
Elite Member
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Futures Experience: Intermediate
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Favorite Futures: Energies
 
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Posts: 284 since Jul 2014
Thanks: 970 given, 363 received


londonkid View Post
What I would say though is that when you are considering products to trade start with the end game in mind. If you actually get very good at trading then slippage will start to become a problem. For this reason I normally only trade products that are thick enough to handle very large clips so that in the event that I manage to get very good at trading I will have the experience and screen time in these markets.

A great point actually. As stated I am looking at the FESX (morning) and ES (afternoon) but have also considered incorporating the Bund or the Eurodollar (GE) in there at a later date too. Right now I am testing the waters and will concentrate on the FESX whilst learning to trade off of the DOM.

How do you find the bond markets these days? I figured until they start upping the rates the volatility might not be that great but I don't know much about them to be honest.

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  #6 (permalink)
Elite Member
London, UK
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: TT, CQG, esignal, TWS
Favorite Futures: Futures, spot FX, Energy Spreads Prop Firm
 
Posts: 61 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 16 given, 55 received


CobblersAwls View Post
A great point actually. As stated I am looking at the FESX (morning) and ES (afternoon) but have also considered incorporating the Bund or the Eurodollar (GE) in there at a later date too. Right now I am testing the waters and will concentrate on the FESX whilst learning to trade off of the DOM.

How do you find the bond markets these days? I figured until they start upping the rates the volatility might not be that great but I don't know much about them to be honest.


Hi. I really like the way the Bund trades and there is enough volatility there for my purposes but I guess it depends on the traders strategy. Typically in the bund I will have a 5 tick stop and 5 to 9 tick target. I haven't really been trading the ZN too much but always watch it when trading bunds in the afternoon. The FESX is very thick isn't it, like trading the bobl. Just in terms of the markets character with the bund it does tend to respect levels but when it breaks it goes hard, you will know you are wrong fast. in terms of the news flow you also need to be aware of the various bond auctions that occur if trading the bund.

GL

PS - I dont use the DOM a huge amount but I do watch the total amount bid/offered on the 1st 5 levels. On the Bund it does seem to be slightly loaded one side before a quick move but there are lots of bluffs, double bluffs and triple bluffs going on.


Last edited by londonkid; August 2nd, 2014 at 12:20 PM. Reason: DOM stuff
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