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Trading with no margin?
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Trading with no margin?

  #21 (permalink)
 Vendor: diversifyportfolio.com 
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@jamiecassar, I suggest you read the following threads of someone who has very recently been through the exact same journey as you are about to start on. Namely, trying to open an account without enough funding, little to no live trading experience and thinking you're somehow going to start making money right off the bat.

There is some excellent advice in the threads and if read from beginning to end, tell a good real life cautionary tale of someone in your position. Dont make the same mistakes.

Threads to read:
Can you open an account with $3000?

Account has been approved

This post in particular:
The truth:

As for some practical suggestions, I would concur with the others who have suggested you look into Topstep Trader. It will give you a feel for having real money on the line without having you lose all your capital in a week.

Watch all the webinars you possibly can that focus on risk and psychology. There are plenty here on futures.io (formerly BMT).

Good luck.

Diversification is the only free lunch
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  #22 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Budapest, Hungary
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
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my 2 cents

I'd suggest this site to learn technical analysis (TA) from the very basic: School of Pipsology | Learn Forex Trading

Futures or Forex. There are lots of posts on the net what's the difference between forex and futures. Here on futures.io (formerly BMT) I think most of us trade futures because it is done on regulated exchanges and so brokers make money on commissions only. On forex, which is an interbank market without central regulation, it is practice that the broker trades against you. Of course there are good forex brokers but you need decent knowledge to find what is good for you.

Margin. It is an "urban legend" that margin is fearful. It can work for you exactly as much as against you. The question is how much risk you can tolerate and how much money you can afford to lose. You make or lose money on the move of the price multiplied by the position size. It just does not matter how this is covered by the broker.

The only thing you need to keep in mind.. what happens when things go wrong and how much you make when price moves in your favor.

Capital. I found that well known futures brokers allow account opening from $5k but you can ask them to allow begin with $3k.

I don't see that any reasonable trading activity is possible below this.. Here's why.
Will sitting at the computer motivate you if you make $5 per day? It is 1% of a $500 account and only $100 for a month. On a $5k 1% per day is $50 with the same amount of work. For 20 trading days (a month) this adds up to $1000 which is something and still not easy to achive on a $3-5k account.

As for non-losing strategy. Most likely you'll try scalping. It has to have very high win rate (80%+) with small profits. But when the loser comes in.. you give back 8-10 winner's profits. If you are very very disciplined it can work but otherwise say goodbye to your account.

Longer distance trades have less win rate and better profit/loss ratio but this also requires discipline to accept the intermittent losers.

You definitely need decent education in trading. There are good sources here on futures.io (formerly BMT).
Please, please learn before doing anything!

TopStepTrader and others may fund an account for you if you prove that you are profitable. Most offer education as well (for pay). Taking a qualification for a live account also have cost so read their rules and follow all in sim. It is meaningless to repeat the exam indefinitely.

There are good threads on futures.io (formerly BMT) about how to begin, how to choose platform and broker.

Remember, scared money goes into others pocket!

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  #23 (permalink)
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So, today I almost borrowed $780 from my boss to start a 500 dollar forex account, 3 month ninja trader lease, and 100 dollar sign up for elite here at futures.io (formerly BMT). as fate would have it, my boss was in the cities and not there today. I came home and read these posts and followed all the links (been reading for 3 hours nonstop now) and I'm really glad I haven't opened a $500 forex account. I will be becoming an elite member, I think it is the best course right now to sit back, take my time, watch more webinars, and soak in more information. I want to thank everyone who told me to learn as much as I can before jumping in. I am thinking trading ANY account less than $5000 could be headed for ruin. Even that would be starting small. Anyways wanted to thank everyone again, I'm sure I am the millionth newbie to come in here with ego over confidence syndrome.

I do have one more question, do I have to be an elite member to make a journal?

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  #24 (permalink)
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jamiecassar View Post
I do have one more question, do I have to be an elite member to make a journal?

Nope, there's a section on the forum for non-elite as well as elite journals.

Diversification is the only free lunch
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  #25 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Budapest, Hungary
 
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Posts: 19 since Sep 2013
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Warm welcome @jamiecassar !

You've made the first step wise!

Don't borrow for trading!

Ok, this is my oppinion but see this forum...

futures.io (formerly BMT) - How many blew up account before becoming successful trader:
https://futures.io/psychology-money-management/11890-how-many-blew-up-account-before-becoming-successful-trader.html

There are so called prop firms who risk their money by giving it for trading to talented traders and share the profits. The point here is they risk that money and you are not required to pay back if anything kicks in.

At TopStepTrader you can go for a $50k account paying $200 for the tryout. But take it seriously. You need to prepare otherwise that $200 is also thrown out. You can find funded TopStepTraders here on futures.io (formerly BMT)!
https://futures.io/vendors-product-reviews/27262-list-big-mike-trading-traders-w...ader-combine-funded.html

Since prop firms risk money they carefully select the traders to work with. So they have rules what professionals follow https://www.topsteptrader.com/combine#combine-rules . You can find others on the net.

Either you take their or other trader education you can use these rules to evaluate your simulator trading. If these are good for professionals for a tryout then the best you can do is to practice in sim without risking your money until you reach consistency. To be honest, I wish I took that way before!

Consistency. It is widely accepted that at least 40 trades (but better do 100) is required to evaluate a method.

However, don't forget as many people have said, once it's your (real) money, everything changes (compared to sim).

Some links on futures.io (formerly BMT):
https://futures.io/psychology-money-management/29688-being-undercapitalized-how-fix.html

https://futures.io/webinars/jan14_2012/where_to_start_part_1/

You must also decide what time you can commit to trading, which markets are available at that period and what trading style you can implement that way (intraday trading or trading at the open or close, swing trading for some days or weeks, etc). Find a good educator whose method is inline with your personality, style and limits. Always check the background of an educator and search for reviews! Better to find one here

Some used to quote Alice and the depth of the rabbit hole but.. better prepare for a jurney in the washing machine

Good luck!


Last edited by lezzlee; January 16th, 2014 at 09:01 AM. Reason: one more thought
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  #26 (permalink)
bRoKeN
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jamiecassar View Post
So, today I almost borrowed $780 from my boss to start a 500 dollar forex account, 3 month ninja trader lease, and 100 dollar sign up for elite here at futures.io (formerly BMT). as fate would have it, my boss was in the cities and not there today. I came home and read these posts and followed all the links (been reading for 3 hours nonstop now) and I'm really glad I haven't opened a $500 forex account. I will be becoming an elite member, I think it is the best course right now to sit back, take my time, watch more webinars, and soak in more information. I want to thank everyone who told me to learn as much as I can before jumping in. I am thinking trading ANY account less than $5000 could be headed for ruin. Even that would be starting small. Anyways wanted to thank everyone again, I'm sure I am the millionth newbie to come in here with ego over confidence syndrome.

I do have one more question, do I have to be an elite member to make a journal?

I am so happy to see this post, after reading the first 2/3rd of this thread. You have come around, I hope. You are not the first person with the ego over confidence, I was one of them. After a LOT of hard work, I am now funded by topsteptrader. And it sounds like you've figured it out, but for your ego's sake and your family's sake.....DO NOT BORROW MONEY TO TRADE FUTURES! Don't open a live account anytime soon. Feel free to read my experience here: https://futures.io/beginners-introductions/27286-hello-jumping.html

Good luck to you.

P.S. I've said it before, and I'll say it again. The elite membership is probably the best money you could spend right now. I can't tell you how much I learned from all of the elite webinars. Worth every penny.

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  #27 (permalink)
Elite Member
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jamiecassar View Post
So, today I almost borrowed $780 from my boss to start a 500 dollar forex account, 3 month ninja trader lease, and 100 dollar sign up for elite here at futures.io (formerly BMT). as fate would have it, my boss was in the cities and not there today. I came home and read these posts and followed all the links (been reading for 3 hours nonstop now) and I'm really glad I haven't opened a $500 forex account. I will be becoming an elite member, I think it is the best course right now to sit back, take my time, watch more webinars, and soak in more information. I want to thank everyone who told me to learn as much as I can before jumping in. I am thinking trading ANY account less than $5000 could be headed for ruin. Even that would be starting small. Anyways wanted to thank everyone again, I'm sure I am the millionth newbie to come in here with ego over confidence syndrome.

I do have one more question, do I have to be an elite member to make a journal?

The futures.io (formerly BMT) Elite membership is probably the best $100 I have ever spent in my life. As @tigertrader said, under capitalization will drastically affect your trading performance. One losing trade could take you out. Trading on SIM does not give you the same intense pressure of real money on the line and the pressure is multiplied by having what is essentially no money in your account, nor does it realistically give you the fills on whatever instrument you're trading. Very often your limits will not be filled, and if they are it is because price is going the other way.

Anyways glad you've realized that it's not that easy.

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  #28 (permalink)
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same boat

I also was hoping to start trading with little capital. After finding futures.io (formerly BMT), I have taken a step back to really analyze and document my trading strategy and performance. Lots of educational examples are included on this site. Learn, develop,e sim, live...keep a journal to be honest with yourself the whole way. Good Luck.

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  #29 (permalink)
Market Wizard
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There's a lot of noise out there in the media that encourages the idea that the average guy can be the next Tim Sykes, turn a small stake into a million dollars in a short time.

Why? Lotsa pageviews.

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  #30 (permalink)
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Don't trade yet. You should save your money build up capital, and learn and read and study the topics here as much as possible. When you are ready the market will still be there.

Investing in your education is the best way not to become a statistic.

Good luck.

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