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Hello - Jumping in
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Hello - Jumping in

  #11 (permalink)
Elite Member
desert CA
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, TOS
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Favorite Futures: CL,YM
 
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Good to hear about your experiences in live trading. As you may have discovered, there is a lot more to just
the mechanics of trading. There are ways to learn about dealing with losses too. Repeating what I've heard elsewhere about losses: Losses will occur, best to consider it the "cost of doing business". After a series of losses, one should just close up the trading for the day. I've had to learn to accept losing days (losses kept within the overall trading plan) the hard way. One losing day a month is already spectacular.

Only a very few "superstars" can maintain a 95+% winning ratio. Already being consistently profitable on a retail level is like winning a lottery and should be counted as a blessing. Absolutely right about the work ethic and the sacrifices needed. For some, it's easier as one can get "obsessed" with the trading and striving to improve, a quasi-labor of "love", and the hours just slip away without thinking about it.

That said, sounds like you're well on your way! And if $1.8k is all you've lost, I would consider yourself very fortunate. Trading is far more riskier and all too easy to incur setups and drawdowns than any other business. The crux is to keep the losses/"cost of doing business" relatively small to the bottom line. Congrats and continued good trading.

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  #12 (permalink)
bRoKeN
Houston, TX/USA
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Sierra Chart
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Chrismind's Avatar
 
Posts: 68 since May 2013
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Cloudy,
Thanks for the encouragement and kind words. It's hard to gauge success at first, especially on a small account, so a a vote of confidence from another trader feels good.

Another update:
After my 3 first winning days(M-W), I blew it yesterday. I wasn't in the right frame of mind. Bad decision, after bad decision. I was tired and grumpy, got into the hole right away and started revenge trading. I forgot my rules apparently. I lost most of what I made Mon-Weds. It was another good lesson learned. But, I had another good day today, and finished up with 3.5% profit for the week(72% win ratio). I'm thrilled with that honestly. I would have been happy with 1% a month to start out.

The losses are hard for me. I'm sure it gets easier, and it is, one day at a time. I should be on cloud 9, but I am more disappointed about my loss yesterday than I am happy for finishing up this week. That's probably because it was pure stupidity that made me lose yesterday, not just probabilities. I'm getting better at thinking in probabilities.

I envy those who find trading boring. I can't wait to enjoy the boredom of trading. I could use some boredom!

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  #13 (permalink)
Elite Member
Phoenix, AZ
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
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Chrismind View Post
Cloudy,
Thanks for the encouragement and kind words. It's hard to gauge success at first, especially on a small account, so a a vote of confidence from another trader feels good.

Another update:
After my 3 first winning days(M-W), I blew it yesterday. I wasn't in the right frame of mind. Bad decision, after bad decision. I was tired and grumpy, got into the hole right away and started revenge trading. I forgot my rules apparently. I lost most of what I made Mon-Weds. It was another good lesson learned. But, I had another good day today, and finished up with 3.5% profit for the week(72% win ratio). I'm thrilled with that honestly. I would have been happy with 1% a month to start out.

The losses are hard for me. I'm sure it gets easier, and it is, one day at a time. I should be on cloud 9, but I am more disappointed about my loss yesterday than I am happy for finishing up this week. That's probably because it was pure stupidity that made me lose yesterday, not just probabilities. I'm getting better at thinking in probabilities.

I envy those who find trading boring. I can't wait to enjoy the boredom of trading. I could use some boredom!

You mentioned trading with intuition. Do you have a trading plan that tells you when to trade and how to manage the trade, and has the plan been sufficiently backtested (manually, not a canned automated backtest)?

My personal experience was that I had to have specific rules based on thorough statistical research and then spend a long time learning to trade that plan (lots of mindset issues). Even now, almost 3 years from the completion of my core plan, I find that intuitive trades (out-of-plan trades, which I aptly call OOPs) are a net drain on my overall profits. I have no idea what still compels me to occasionally throw them on. I imagine the stretches of boredom get to me...

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  #14 (permalink)
Market Wizard
Switzerland
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
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rubyslippage View Post
You mentioned trading with intuition. Do you have a trading plan that tells you when to trade and how to manage the trade, and has the plan been sufficiently backtested (manually, not a canned automated backtest)?
...Even now, almost 3 years from the completion of my core plan, I find that intuitive trades (out-of-plan trades, which I aptly call OOPs) are a net drain on my overall profits. I have no idea what still compels me to occasionally throw them on. I imagine the stretches of boredom get to me...

Hi @rubyslippage

You are perfectly right: The mentioned problem "OOps" had been pointed out by Dr. Stocks*
It is a special trader virus that appears like influenza from time to time.
The good news:
OOps disappears (from time to time). The bad news: there is no medicine against

Good Trades!
GFIs1

*intentionally invented on purpose

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  #15 (permalink)
bRoKeN
Houston, TX/USA
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Sierra Chart
Broker/Data: Sierra Charts Data Feed
Favorite Futures: Futures
 
Chrismind's Avatar
 
Posts: 68 since May 2013
Thanks: 40 given, 101 received

Update:
I'm still here. I still have an account. Wow, trading is such a trip. This has been a roller coaster. Highest of highs, lowest of lows. I love it though. I've stopped(hopefully) losing money and am basically breaking even at this point. I'm feel like I'm just spinning my tires, and just need a little traction to get me going. I've been trying to tweak some things with my strategy that weren't working. I have collected enough of a standard to start really seeing where my strengths and weaknesses are. Time of day is a huge factor for me. There are certain times of day that I can't seem to win a trade for the life of me, and other times it seems like I can't lose. Also, my stop placement still needs some tweaking. 10% of my losing trades are stopped out too soon, and would have been winners. However, I have GREATLY improved my entry points which have helped avoid stops. Maybe the worst problem, I'm cutting my winners short most of the time and letting them get nowhere near my target; and some are really great trades too. Which leads to me my overall problem.....I am still having a pretty tough time psychologically, but it's getting better one day at a time. I truly amazed at this whole experience. It's just so, so much tougher than I thought it would be(mentally). I'm humbled. But, still loving it. This is the first time in my life that I've ever looked forward to Mondays.

Ruby,
Thanks for the reply and touche on the boredom, I like that I caught myself being a little bored today, it felt great! To answer your question, yes I do have a strict plan that tells me when to trade and how to manage each one. Like you said the OOPs probably hurt me more than anything. I've working on putting that problem to rest, but like you, it still pops up more often than I would like to admit! Last week, I made one OOP trade that was a really big winner, which gave me the overconfidence to quickly give it all back, plus hitting my daily stop. Fun stuff.

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  #16 (permalink)
bRoKeN
Houston, TX/USA
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Sierra Chart
Broker/Data: Sierra Charts Data Feed
Favorite Futures: Futures
 
Chrismind's Avatar
 
Posts: 68 since May 2013
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Update:
Although my strategies are good, I was having some serious discipline/self-control/patience issues. I'm now doing a TST combine in order to feel the real pressure, without losing the real $$$. I'm on day 3, and have already made huge progress. I don't need to be funded, and I'm under no false illusion about the program. I'm there for the structure, discipline and accountability; I must say, it is working tremendously. It is so ironic. I've been running from structure and discipline my entire life, and now I'm chasing it down. Being a rebel doesn't work in this endeavor.

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  #17 (permalink)
Elite Member
ladson, sc
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: ninja trader
 
Posts: 1 since Jul 2009
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Keep at it man

I know what you mean. I did well SIM trading and tanked because I hadn't mastered the emotional part. I'm glad you're doing better.

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  #18 (permalink)
bRoKeN
Houston, TX/USA
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Sierra Chart
Broker/Data: Sierra Charts Data Feed
Favorite Futures: Futures
 
Chrismind's Avatar
 
Posts: 68 since May 2013
Thanks: 40 given, 101 received

Update:

I failed my first TsT combine. Even though I have a personal daily limit much lower than the combine limit, I hit the combine daily limit. I basically have about 5 excuses why it happened. But no good reason except for myself. I listened to someone else. I traded a product I know nothing about, because I got bored with my product. I tried to dig myself out of a hole. And then 2 executions errors to top it all off. All mistakes that were avoidable. Anyways, I've learned a lot. Mainly I learned that losing control is disastrous.......again. On to the next one.

For anyone that has a problem transitioning their performance from SIM to Live, a combine is a truly amazing tool. You get to feel the real pressure of trading that can not be simulated. But you can do it at a very small cost. It's just a matter of exposure. The anxiety and fear become less and less, or I'm becoming more tolerant.

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  #19 (permalink)
bRoKeN
Houston, TX/USA
 
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Chrismind's Avatar
 
Posts: 68 since May 2013
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I just had to update this thread. It has been a lot of very hard work, dedication, and self discovery. After 6 months, I have passed a combine at TsT and will be going live as a funded trader in the next couple of weeks. Never give up. If you have the ability, passion and dedication, you will make it!!!!

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  #20 (permalink)
Elite Member
Cedar Rapids, iowa
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader
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Chrismind View Post
I just had to update this thread. It has been a lot of very hard work, dedication, and self discovery. After 6 months, I have passed a combine at TsT and will be going live as a funded trader in the next couple of weeks. Never give up. If you have the ability, passion and dedication, you will make it!!!!

Congrats on the hard work and the rewards! Great post!

"Money is better than poverty, if only for financial reasons." - Woody Allen
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